General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThe fact that there's so much contention here about the Trayvon case
is exactly why Zimmerman walked.
The prosecution failed to prove BEYOND A REASONABLE DOUBT that Zimmerman wasn't acting in self defense when he shot Trayvon.
My gut says he's a guilty fuck who should be in jail.
But my mind says, "Maybe Trayvon DID jump him. I can't rule it out."
Beyond reasonable doubt is the standard, and I'd rather see a guilty man go free than an innocent man go to jail.
Tx4obama
(36,974 posts)... and apparently they did not understand that they could hold on to their own original opinion and cause a hung jury therefore having a new trial to be called.
There was one juror who first voted for 2nd degree and two jurors that wanted manslaughter.
They couldn't all figure out if Zimmerman fell into the manslaughter category, so they went with 'not guilty'.
I think the problem is that the jury instructions were not clear enough.
Listen to what Juror B-37 says...
Duer 157099
(17,742 posts)This juror gives the impression that after awhile they all just threw their hands up in exasperation and said "fuck it" let's just let him walk since we can't figure this out.
Although, she does go on to say that she thinks Z made a mistake, that he escalated things unnecessarily, that he put himself in this situation... but apparently not enough to hold him responsible.
Bad jury instructions, for sure. And jury couldn't decide specifically what they needed clarification on so they just went ah, what the hell.. let's get out of here.
JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)The stand your ground laws have to go. They are not just.
They encourage the escalation of violence. We need laws that discourage violence.
TDale313
(7,820 posts)Trayvon Martin was doing NOTHING wrong. Nothing. Even if he threw the first punch, a complete stranger with NO authority to do so (and who, as it turned out, had a fucking gun!) was CHASING HIM! Trayvon was the one fighting for, and who ultimately lost, his life. He should not have been the one on trial here.
The big problem is how the self defense/syg laws are written/applied. Apparently they used to require that the person claiming self defense used every reasonable effort to avoid the need for deadly force (ie Stay in the fucking car and wait for the real cops. No dead kid. Easy, no?) Now, there is nothing that encourages any restraint and every reason to make sure the person who just gave you a bloody nose ends up dead and can't testify to what happened.
brettdale
(12,384 posts)Asking this, if their races were reversed.
alcibiades_mystery
(36,437 posts)I find it hard to believe that anyone can listen to the shite spewing from the mouth of this B37 juror and still pretend this was a simple case of failing to meet the burden of proof. The woman is a racist imbecile at the very least, maliciously biased against the victim at worst. She refers to the defendant by a pet name. It's absurdity to cling to the arguments - well worn all weekend, in any case - that the jury made a rational decision based in law and reasonableness. We can, of course, switch to Argument #2, that the defense was "savvy" and "intelligent" to pack their jury with racist cretins (this subset seems to be favorable to the Zimmerman camp as a general rule), but let's at least no longer pretend that that argument is about the law, standards, or reasonableness.
Spare us at least that insult after injury.
IL Lib
(190 posts)Major Hogwash
(17,656 posts)The prosecution could have had 12 marching bands perform several songs while marching around the courtroom at that trial, produced a "made for tv" movie written about the circumstances of the case and shown at the trial, subpoenaed Morgan Freeman to appear in court to read Trayvon Martin's own words from his text messages while showing pictures of Trayvon Martin growing up, subpoenaed Harry Belafonte to perform a few songs for the jury to show them that some black men can sing well . . . and it would not have swayed that jury 1 fucking bit!!!
Pelican
(1,156 posts)Puzzledtraveller
(5,937 posts)quinnox
(20,600 posts)Zimmerman was clearly lying his ass off, and the detectives weren't buying a word of it. That tells me he made up his story about being attacked, and is guilty. I said at the time of the thread I don't see how anyone can listen to that tape and think he was innocent. It was clear the detectives felt the same way at the time.
killbotfactory
(13,566 posts)To think he decided to turn back and jump a strange adult who had been stalking him in the night is fucking absurd.
JDPriestly
(57,936 posts)Zimmerman down. My guess is that Zimmerman shot Trayvon Martin as Trayvon was falling.
I say that because I don't think that Zimmerman could have pulled his gun from his holster and shot Trayvon Martin pretty squarely in the middle of the chest if Trayvon had been on top of him as Zimmerman claimed. I could be wrong, but that doesn't fit together. If you try to think of it as a moving puzzle, I can't see it.