Something else: Saxby Chambliss should be in prison instead of Don Siegelman.

If, any at all?

...The good guys in Washington remember Paul Wellstone, so Wyden has gotten near-zero help. It's the entire national security state apparatus: Like Wile E. Coyote and an anvil, they squish flat any who stand up to them in public. Perhaps the gloves will come off, seeing how We the People really do give a damn and will stand up with him.

line. They will not relinquish these powers. I believe they are strong enough to take bold actions against those that oppose them. I believe the revolution has been waiting for a spark. This may be it.

...Had a chance to chat with strangers from Akron to Huntington. Every one I spoke with, man, woman, young, old -- every one -- says the jig is up for the banksters and gangsters and traitors running the show. They are fed up, "no matter who we vote in" things just get worse.

The thing is, they all -- every one I spoke with -- are loyal to the Constitution. No one wants to overthrow the country. They just want to throw the bums out of power.

The trip buoyed my heart. The bastards are starting to sweat. Maybe they soon will be ones on the run.

Ms. Clinton when Citizens United puts her in as the DEmocratic candidate?

...However, if the party keeps nominating the drinking buddies of the GOP, all bets are off.

As for 2016, that's a way off. While we've seen this picture before -- it's a damn franchise -- anything can happen before then. Let's try to write the new script, sans the editing of MIC-Wall Street. That means calling up decentralized casting for some new talents.

In Michigan, we ran Lansing mayor Virg Benero against the DeVos/Prince/Koch turd Gov Gateway Rick Snyder. The Dem establishment went ape shit, seeing that their guy, Andy Dillon got beat by the grassroots. (Incumbent Gov. Jennifer the Dimple Granholm did near-zero to help the general campaign, but now has a good future in front of the camera or on Wall Street.)

The money spigot did not trickle down and so Snyder won. And now Michigan runs redneck-and-redneck with 1936 Germany, emergency managers calling the shots in all the major cities with black majority populations, including Detroit where every damn thing worth owning is being looked at for piratization.

As for Dillon, don't cry for me Reagan Democrats. Snyder selected the guy, among his first appointments, to serve in the cabinuts as State Treasurer. I kid you not, symbolic as all the hell my Great Lakes State is become.

Me? Who do I want to see in Washington? Not anyone connected with Hillary, Obama, or the DLC. Once, I had hoped Kerry would be that guy, way back in 2004. I lambasted Gov. Dean at every opportunity. I now realize my mistake as recent developments have tarnished my hopes for that old Dem line.

Bottom line: We need new blood at the top of the ticket, yet the MIC doesn't like people they can't control. Perhaps we'll get Mark Udall or Ron Wyden, both of whom stood up more than a bit to the MIC. Elizabeth Warren stood up the Wall Street bastards. I think she would get the better of Hillary in the debates -- in front of the whole world.

As for the same-old same-old. No. Won't do it.

And look what happened to her there. Yes, '16 IS a long way off, and who knows who may step into the spotlight by then.

I bet Hillary set her price too high which allowed for a first-term senator to underbid her.

Hillary Clinton will be no different from what is in there right now, meet the new boss same as the old boss. We have been sold out since we elected the first Clinton, Obama has sold us out, wait for the Trans Pacific Partnership the ultimate sellout of America.

I am tired of voting for the lesser of 2 evils! What happens in D.C is all a show. It is very obvious now that they keep us distracted so we don't have time to go after the "Root Cause" of our problems. The root cause is the corruption of our electoral system. We have to get the money out of our elections and reign in the Lobbyists. We should DEMAND that Complete Campaign Finance Reform be addressed ASAP! Publicly funded elections from local to the national level would give us Representative government again, something we have not had in quite awhile. The problem is, even here at DU there are still too many that think the fights in DC. are real and Obama is a swell guy. They think that my message is just another conspiracy theory. I mean, it is too much to believe that the billions raised in campaign contributions (bribes) in all of these $25,000 a plate lunches gives the donors more access and sway over these politicians than the average Joe or Jane! They only control who wins the primaries and the general election. I know that's hard to believe (for brainwashed idiots)!

I think, deep down, people know things have been going down hill at a fast pace since 2000. They know it when they pay their utilities, go to the grocery store, or have to take a "staycation" because they can't afford to go anywhere.

Last edited Sun Aug 4, 2013, 06:20 PM - Edit history (1)

Can't have the hoi polio knowing what their betters are doing, now can we?

It's what friends in Georgia call him.

Forms of tard are really offensive to those with friends who are challenged.

However prefix re would have been. He didn't use re but rahter the non offensive fuck.

It has neither a prefix nor a suffix. It's simply someone's less than witty play on the word RETARD. You DO get that, right?

Wyden is popular here in Oregon because he's not a complete tool of the corporations like Chambliss.

He is savvy to how Washington works and is independent and intelligent. Very admirable qualities, in my opinion.

Wyden - I really would settle for half.

And today Chambliss was talking about this "incredibly" dangerous security alert we're under.

Such a bunch of crap. If something happens this weekend they can say its a victory for intelligence collection and if nothing happens they will say the intelligence alert was successful. Either way the neocon authoritarians win.

...on target.

are praying hard that something along the line of 9/11 happens. They've got their script ready I can assure you.

But you know that.

If they can use an algorithm to see that you may like calling a certain ethnic food place for supplies because you like to make that certain ethnic food, and than use that information to actually listen to your conversations. Than the NSA can most certainly know a great deal of what could "possibly happen" in regards to another 9/11. The question is, based on scale, would it be hindered?

The man, and I use the term loosely, is a loathsome waste of pus.

Georgia chose this guy over a Vietnam vet like Cleland. Cleland lost his limbs for this country. So they replaced him for this guy.

I leave it to you to discover why.


On another note, I agree with every word of it.

...but desecrating veterans is a Republican mainstay.

He is a disgusting man.

...they have to have their questions pre-approved by the organization they are overseeing? NSA tells Congress what they can ask?

Wyden issued a statement the following day:

..if he had went to Wyden or anyone with the files he had downloaded based on what has happened to other whistleblowers. Could we suppose that someone in Clapper's office dropped the ball and didn't relay the Senator's question to him so he would be prepared? It still comes back to that it seems as if NSA is the ones doing the oversight instead of Congress. Instead it seems they dictate to Congress what it can do.

No based on what has been published and what we have heard, I would be willing to believe Wyden's version. My take is that Feinstein, Clapper and others have gotten the attitude that we are just supposed to take their word, even with all that has come out about the NSA's overreach. In other words it seems that we the citizenry have no right to know what our government is doing.

Wyden is to be commended for standing up for the Constitution. Look at the Representatives and Senators we have here in Texas!!!!

Who else does he have to listen to? I wish there were some way for him to have a beer with Snowden and actually have a real discussion about this stuff.

Maybe while he's in Russia not meeting with Putin.

Shouldn't we think that having a constitutional scholar as President he would be aware of the Fourth Amendment? Or has he sold out to the 'establishment'?

It might do him good to sit down with Snowden and discuss this. Or not. Basically he has already convicted him by the statements he has made.

But it seems to me that Clapper and Alexander is running the show where neither the President or Congress has any say.

They have private hearings where the Congresspeople can ask whatever they want.

Calling it that was not off the mark at all.

Really Georgia? You voted this partisan prick (Chambliss) over a decorated Vietnam amputee hero? Blinded by the Right!

A real piece of shit.

Any turd of mine or my dog's would be challenging you to a duel over that.

I can understand your reaction.

with a 9% approval rating!? Congress works for the 1%. Congress does not give ONE SHIT about The People. Some individuals in Congress DO, but they are so few and far between...

eom

I drew the first slot in the "town hall meeting" (in retrospect I wish it had been later in the program) and asked him,
"Senator, who do you think are more dangerous to our national security: guys like Bradley Manning and Edward Snowden, or guys like Lloyd Blankfein and Jamie Dimon?"

Obviously he didn't want that right out of the chute, and he avoided the question by separating security issues and economic issues. However, I notice that in recent days he's been getting out closer to the edge on the NSA, and that's a good thing.

I've attended them, and have been appalled by the questions he fields from the right wing constituents over here East of the Cascades. He answers well and honestly, aware all the while, I'm pretty sure, that these are folks who would never vote for him. I can only imagine the pressure he's under, and commend him for his stand on difficult issues. Don't always agree with him, but have been grateful for a long time that he as well as Jeff Merkley are our senators. Maybe Saxby should move to Oregon so he can run against Ron and get thoroughly trounced at the ballot box. Now that would make me cheer!

Oregon: She flies with her own wings. And, we vote by mail. Yes!

I am becoming a bit worried about what the RW may try to do to Wyden as he becomes more and more vocal. Have all the respect in the world for this man and have spoken with him many times when he has attended events in Portland over the years. His heart is in the right place always.

There are a FEW elected officials who speak their minds and "go off script", but all Republicans and most Democrats stay very close to a very carefully crafted script that's designed to eradicate hope for change from those who are paying attention while also dividing the nation based on superficial rhetoric.

I believe we have to somehow instill a desire to become politically aware in the general population or we're going to continue losing ground. I'm not sure how to begin doing that either.

about what he understands to be an important concern to democracy. He can't even tell us what he knows, so we should pay attention to everything he does tell us knowing he would tell us a lot more if he could.

We can't even pretend anymore...our government is not of, by and for the people. unbeleivable man...

lie. Sen Wyden knew he lied and gave him an opportunity to make it right for the record. Gen Clapper choose to go on a friendly media for damage control. This is a story that shouldnt be allowed to die. Gen Clapper lied to Congress and went on TV to rectify it.

If we were free he would be called back before Congress and asked to explain. Pres Clinton was impeached for less because he was merely a president. Gen Clapper will walk because he is a member of the ruling cabal that outranks the president. Ask Pres Obama.

Keep in mind that Gen Clapper has been involved in intelligence agencies before Obama and unless we have a miracle, will be in charge after Obama leaves. The Ruling Cabal transcends presidents.

This Clapper lying during Congressional testimony got me rankled at the time. Exactly because of the aggravating SELECTIVE ENFORCEMENT our government uses. I thought lying to Congress was in the felony category?

How come Martha Stewart and Tommy Chong do hard time and so many that do much worse - like the Presidents of Big Banks and Big Wall Street Firms, commit serious provable crimes and nobody goes after them?

So I was paying attention to all this and one thing I remember is that all questions to Clapper from the Senate were submitted to Clapper at least a day beforehand. So he had a day of prep before his testimony and still lied!

That Wyden asked a question that WAS NOT previously submitted is unknown to me.

Isn't Wyden an advocate of the heinous TPP?

-90% Jimmy

There are substantial elements on both sides of the political spectrum that view the NSA with disdain.

This is prime filet with respect to potential voters. Not often can you grasp an issue that isn't polarizing for all except for those that swear fealty to politicians instead of issues. If not for a Democratic administration, the Democratic Party would have seized this issue quickly. President Obama has convoluted this greatly. Wyden is simply doing what the Democratic Party would have strategically done under a GOP administration.

as doing something wrong. I believe the left will look at this as good news. At least we have a Sen that doesnt bow down to the NSA. I wish we had a president that would stand up to the NSA. The only people Pres Obama stands up against are patients needing medical marijuana.

video here http://presspass.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/08/04/19863000-watch-meet-the-press-august-4-2013

...is the money quote.

Seriously, how do you guys think they work? What do you think the secret hearings are for? Do you really not think that they work out in advance what they can publicly ask without violating secrecy laws?

To inform the public?

Or to make us think we are being informed?

Or doesn't matter?

And the Senators and agency people do want to be on record for some of their questions and answers.

I'm not saying Wyden was wrong to do this, at all; I just didn't think Chambliss's news was, well, "news" in any real sense.

Even if some of the Senators with the information were uncomfortable with keeping it secret from the people, at the request of the NSA and a handful of senior Senators.

Wyden says he gave the questions in advance to Clapper. Either he didn't read them or he simply took it for granted that no one would have the balls to ask him such a question? They seem to have forgotten about it now?

Judging from the comments, there are a few people that might disagree with you?

Does it make Wyden look like the bad guy because he asked the question and broke Senate Intelligence Committee protocol? Or was he a whistleblower, in his own way?

It's a way to get classified information out that you can't be prosecuted for (speech as a Senator or Representative is absolutely constitutionally protected); the downside is it makes the agency very, very pissed at you and unwilling to work with you. If Wyden judged it was the right thing to do at the time I give him the benefit of the doubt.

...the NSA locks Wyden out of future briefings. I don't think the NSA has that right to keep secrets and avoid telling even our elected representatives. There has to be oversight, no ifs, ands, or buts...

and that Wyden only did that because he judged there was nothing to lose from an access standpoint at this moment.

What we have is a secret cabal that tells the President what is in our national security and what he needs to do about it. They also have a handful of malleable Senators and Congressmen, like Diane Feinstein, Saxby Chambliss, and Mike Rogers from Michigan, that are easily guided and will keep all the secrets that the NSA gives them. They look at it only from a security standpoint and seldom will question the constitutional privacy concerns of the secrets. And the NSA then says that they have informed Congress and the Executive, and then they ask the secret court, the FISA Court, to approve their operations...and the Congress and the Executive have nothing but a rubber stamp. It has been thus for quite some time. It is a dangerous situation for our nation to be in, in my opinion. Important decisions like war and drones and assassinations and prisons are made by a secret cabal, away from the people and most of their representatives.

The president has no influence over the intelligence elites, nor apparently does Congress itself. Have we ever been in a more dangerous time?

lol

That's how far free our senators are. And we are no freer than our senators.

How low has our nation fallen?

That a senator is chided for asking an honest question and trying to inform the public of the truth? I'd say we've fallen really low.

How can people bray on and on about freedom when long ago we traded our liberty for an empire.

[link:

It doesn't add up from what we know.

again.

Here (IMO) is the answer to all the BS in the House and Senate....... ready?...... TERM LIMITS........if the executive branch has it so should the legislative branch.....

This right here is a very good start to alot of the horseshit that our politicians put us, and themselves through. I would even go so far as to say a single six year term for president would be sufficient.

... because at that point, the only body of people in the congress that will have "institutional knowledge" will be the frickin' CORPORATE LOBBYISTS!!!!

Arbitrary term limits will only make things worse and make it harder to get people as good as Ron Wyden, Bernie Sanders, etc. in to replace them. Do you REALLY want that?

The answers are public campaign financing, getting rid of corporate personhood and "money is free speech", and instant runoff voting, to get the money out of politics as well as empower third party options on election ballots.

but term limits will definitely make whoever we vote in work while they are in the seat they were elected to. Not start campaigning for their next power grab before they did one single thing in their current seat. That cannot be a bad thing.

Term limits or no term limits, what you said is still 100 percent true. But the Ron Wydens of the world do not disappear because of term limits. They remain the same. IMO.

Of campaigns and limiting campaigns in length. Both would, I believe, go a long way towards making elections both the term limits and the limit on power they ought to be.Closing off the revolving door between congress and K street wouldn't hurt.

his bullshit on teevee yesterday. Same old crap, terror scares to try to justify their crazy fascism. Hopefully only the most braindead sheeple will buy it. Chambliss is scarier than any cave dwelling thug in the middle east.

My Senator Wyden has my support in this.

and most decisions are actually made well outside the area that citizens can ever access?

"We're an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality. And while you're studying that reality—judiciously, as you will—we'll act again, creating other new realities, which you can study too, and that's how things will sort out. We're history's actors…and you, all of you, will be left to just study what we do."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reality-based_community

Please to recommend and kick this back to the top.