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B2G

(9,766 posts)
Fri Sep 6, 2013, 01:06 PM Sep 2013

Since when is going to the UN 'hocus pocus'?

WTF?

"Frankly, if we weren't talking about the need for an international response right now, this wouldn't be what everybody would be asking about," said Obama at a press conference this morning. "You know, there would be some resolutions that were being proffered in the United Nations and the usual hocus pocus, but the world and the country would have moved on. So trying to impart a sense of urgency about this, why we can't have an environment in which over time, people start thinking this we can get away with chemical weapons use--it's a hard sell, but it's something I believe in."


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Since when is going to the UN 'hocus pocus'? (Original Post) B2G Sep 2013 OP
Mandela in 2002. Still relevant in 2013 Catherina Sep 2013 #1
Eh, Let Freedom Reign! jsr Sep 2013 #2
The UN JustAnotherGen Sep 2013 #3
The UN Security Council has acted in the past. BlueCheese Sep 2013 #5
You know JustAnotherGen Sep 2013 #7
I didn't object to the Libya operation... BlueCheese Sep 2013 #8
He might mean that vetos of Security Council resolutions is the "hocus pocus" (nt) muriel_volestrangler Sep 2013 #4
I don't know what he means anymore B2G Sep 2013 #6
The UN is great at humanitarian relief, HORRIBLE at acting militarily when appropriate. phleshdef Sep 2013 #9
This ... GeorgeGist Sep 2013 #10
And this is the diplomatic president Union Scribe Sep 2013 #11
the un is a useless, broken tool spanone Sep 2013 #12
Since they started telling American Presidents what they don't want to hear. Autumn Sep 2013 #13

Catherina

(35,568 posts)
1. Mandela in 2002. Still relevant in 2013
Fri Sep 6, 2013, 01:13 PM
Sep 2013

"If you look at those matters, you will come to the conclusion that the attitude of the United States of America is a threat to world peace. Because what (America) is saying is that if you are afraid of a veto in the Security Council, you can go outside and take action and violate the sovereignty of other countries. That is the message they are sending to the world. That must be condemned in the strongest terms,"

Later, on September 16, when Washington condemned as mere duplicity Iraq’s offer to allow unconditional inspection of its weapons facilities by U.N. inspectors, and again threatened war, Mandela asked: “What right has Bush to say that Iraq’s offer is not genuine? We must condemn that very strongly. No country, however strong, is entitled to comment adversely in the way the U.S. has done. They think they’re the only power in the world. They’re not and they’re following a dangerous policy. One country wants to bully the world

http://monthlyreview.org/2002/11/01/november-2002-volume-54-number-6


a situation of this nature does not need an individual, it needs an organization like the United Nations to mediate. We must understand the seriousness of this situation. The United States has made serious mistakes in the conduct of its foreign affairs, which have had unfortunate repercussions long after the decisions were taken. Unqualified support of the Shah of Iran led directly to the Islamic revolution of 1979. Then the United States chose to arm and finance the (Islamic) mujahedin in Afghanistan instead of supporting and encouraging the moderate wing of the government of Afghanistan. That is what led to the Taliban in Afghanistan. But the most catastrophic action of the United States was to sabotage the decision that was painstakingly stitched together by the United Nations regarding the withdrawal of the Soviet Union from Afghanistan. If you look at those matters, you will come to the conclusion that the attitude of the United States of America is a threat to world peace. Because what (America) is saying is that if you are afraid of a veto in the Security Council, you can go outside and take action and violate the sovereignty of other countries. That is the message they are sending to the world. That must be condemned in the strongest terms.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/newsweek/2002/09/09/nelson-mandela-the-u-s-a-is-a-threat-to-world-peace.html

JustAnotherGen

(31,828 posts)
3. The UN
Fri Sep 6, 2013, 01:22 PM
Sep 2013

Is generally ineffective unless it is chastising a G20 country.

That's just my perception though.

I view them as sitting on their hands on everything, it's a lot of pomp and circumstance, and the only time anyone in the world has really paid attention to anything coming out of that body the past few years - was when former Iranian President Ahmadinejad would go there to deny the holocaust in a formal speech.

Now, I'm loving the new Foreign Minister of Iran - Mohammad Javad Zarif. What a difference one man's words can make. I don't think we will be hearing anymore holocaust denying wingnuttery crazy talk out of Iran's representatives at the UN anymore.

But even if we did - they would just get up and throw their hissy fit of 'leaving the room' as opposed to someone telling them the Iran representative to "shut the fuck up and sit down - you aren't helping the world."

Yeah - good idea back in the day . . . but pretty worthless in the post Cold War era. . . In the virtual age - there's no reason they can't do teleconferencing and save every single member country a lot of money for them to do Absolutely Nothing.

BlueCheese

(2,522 posts)
5. The UN Security Council has acted in the past.
Fri Sep 6, 2013, 01:30 PM
Sep 2013

Most recently, it voted 10-0 (with 5 abstentions) to authorize military force in Libya. It also authorized military force for the first Gulf war, as well as many, many peacekeeping missions. It is true that General Assembly meetings often are more spectacle than serious interaction.

In this case, I would feel much better about any US action in Syria if it were accompanied by a supportive Security Council vote. Obviously Russia will veto any use of force, but if a sizable majority of the Security Council agreed, it would make the operation a lot more legitimate internationally.

JustAnotherGen

(31,828 posts)
7. You know
Fri Sep 6, 2013, 01:37 PM
Sep 2013

That's a good point about Libya - but even right here in the US it used by Democrats paint President Obama as an evil murdering despot.

I would like to see the UN security council vote for it - but the US stand down completely from armed interevention. We should take humanitarian aid duty - and extend that to Lebanon which has absorbed millions of Syrian's fleeing this nightmare.

BlueCheese

(2,522 posts)
8. I didn't object to the Libya operation...
Fri Sep 6, 2013, 01:39 PM
Sep 2013

... because it had support from the Arab League and the UN.

I agree with you-- humanitarian aid would earn far more goodwill than anything else we could do.

 

phleshdef

(11,936 posts)
9. The UN is great at humanitarian relief, HORRIBLE at acting militarily when appropriate.
Fri Sep 6, 2013, 01:41 PM
Sep 2013

The UN has dropped the ball countless times when it comes to aggressive, war-oriented humanitarian crisis. They have done a pretty good job of dealing with refugees and getting aid to the appropriate places when needed. But they often do not do their job when it comes to enforcing the Geneva conventions and dealing with war criminals.

Union Scribe

(7,099 posts)
11. And this is the diplomatic president
Fri Sep 6, 2013, 02:43 PM
Sep 2013

we were all waiting for to blot out the worldwide effects of Bush's cowboy act? Well at least now I know where our ambassador got her attitude towards the U.N.

Autumn

(45,107 posts)
13. Since they started telling American Presidents what they don't want to hear.
Fri Sep 6, 2013, 03:03 PM
Sep 2013
hocus pocus The magic words spoken when bringing about some sort of change.
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