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sheshe2

(83,925 posts)
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 02:50 PM Sep 2013

What Putin wants you to forget

The idea of Vladimir Putin lecturing us about peace, democracy and international law is beyond ironic. And yet here's what he wrote for the New York Times.

Syria is not witnessing a battle for democracy, but an armed conflict between government and opposition in a multireligious country. There are few champions of democracy in Syria...

From the outset, Russia has advocated peaceful dialogue enabling Syrians to develop a compromise plan for their own future. We are not protecting the Syrian government, but international law.


The photo above was taken in March 2011 when Syrians joined in peaceful protests as part of the movement we now call the Arab Spring. They were protesting the brutal dictatorship of Assad. That would have been a moment for Putin's "champion of democracy" to step up. But instead, Assad sent the Syrian Army to quell the uprising with soldiers firing on demonstrators all over the country - thus sparking a civil war.

Its true that since that civil war has now raged for over 2 years, the lines have blurred with various rebel groups. But what Putin wants you to forget is that it was originally an uprising of the Syrian people that his buddy Assad chose to respond to with brutal force.


More:

http://immasmartypants.blogspot.com/2013/09/what-putin-wants-you-to-forget.html

Dispatches: What Putin didn't tell the American People

It’s not what Vladimir Putin’s New York Times op-ed says that’s so worrisome; it’s what it doesn’t say. As a Russian and as someone who has been to Syria multiple times since the beginning of the conflict to investigate war crimes and other violations, I would like to mention a few things Putin overlooked...

There is not a single mention in Putin’s article, addressed to the American people, of the egregious crimes committed by the Syrian government and extensively documented by the UN Commission of Inquiry, local and international human rights groups, and numerous journalists: deliberate and indiscriminate killings of tens of thousands of civilians, executions, torture, enforced disappearances and arbitrary arrests. His op-ed also makes no mention of Russia’s ongoing transfer of arms to Assad throughout the past two and a half years
.

The Russian president strategically emphasizes the role of Islamic extremists in the Syrian conflict. Yes, many rebel groups have committed abuses and atrocities. Yet Putin fails to mention that it is the Syrian government that is responsible for shooting peaceful protesters (before the conflict even started) and detaining and torturing their leaders – many of whom remain detained – and that the continued failure of the international community to respond to atrocities in Syria allows crimes on all sides to continue unaddressed.



Read more here:
http://www.hrw.org/news/2013/09/12/dispatches-what-putin-didn-t-tell-american-people
58 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
What Putin wants you to forget (Original Post) sheshe2 Sep 2013 OP
And, look at all the innocents who were sucked in by this propaganda Cha Sep 2013 #1
Thanks Cha, sheshe2 Sep 2013 #2
Well, our job is to push back on the putin propaganda with Cha Sep 2013 #7
Kick & recommended. William769 Sep 2013 #3
Thank you William! sheshe2 Sep 2013 #4
No. Thank you. William769 Sep 2013 #5
is it not nice to see DonCoquixote Sep 2013 #56
Obama & Kerry launched Putin into the spotlight leftstreet Sep 2013 #6
Yes Obama put the guy who was president of russia off and on since 2000 into the spotlight Johonny Sep 2013 #10
Oh that was so well done! sheshe2 Sep 2013 #41
K & R pnwmom Sep 2013 #8
Fortunately this is being discussed seriously in serious places nadinbrzezinski Sep 2013 #9
Boy, are you childish sometimes. Skidmore Sep 2013 #11
Sometimes? zappaman Sep 2013 #34
Snork, indeed. Skidmore Sep 2013 #47
DU isn't serious when long time and prolific posters are going all Iggy Plonk Pretzel_Warrior Sep 2013 #12
Now That, Ma'am, Is Some Dead-Pan Parody... The Magistrate Sep 2013 #15
except it is not parody and this essay *is being discussed in serious places* nadinbrzezinski Sep 2013 #17
Kerfunkle!!! DevonRex Sep 2013 #19
Better watch out, you will get double plus ploinked! A Trikerfunk. Rex Sep 2013 #28
It's like double secret probation! zappaman Sep 2013 #35
Oh no. You mean DevonRex Sep 2013 #36
Somewhere, Ma'am, There Must Be An Emoticon For 'Whoosh Right Over The Head'... The Magistrate Sep 2013 #20
Go play with the kids. Goddbye nadinbrzezinski Sep 2013 #22
They Do Often Provide More Intelligent Observation And Comment, Ma'am The Magistrate Sep 2013 #23
Congratulations! You joined the honor roll Rex Sep 2013 #29
omg. You TOO?! bunnies Sep 2013 #30
Yes...evidently I am a nazi! Rex Sep 2013 #31
bwahahahaha! bunnies Sep 2013 #33
Well you know how when two people argue over Israeli policy? Rex Sep 2013 #37
Ah yes. bunnies Sep 2013 #40
YOU NEVER LOVED POOTIE POOT! Rex Sep 2013 #45
.... bunnies Sep 2013 #49
<----LOL Rex Sep 2013 #50
*Snort* You! A Nazi???? DevonRex Sep 2013 #39
If the expert says I am...shit...what else do I not know about myself? Rex Sep 2013 #44
Well, you're not of the "chattering class" so she'd never tell you anyway. DevonRex Sep 2013 #51
Not even that much... Rex Sep 2013 #52
We are The Invisibles. Here we are scaring a kitteh: DevonRex Sep 2013 #55
And all this time I thought you were a Dane! zappaman Sep 2013 #42
I know! That rotten smell!? Rex Sep 2013 #46
Jesus, did you actually ignore The Magistrate? Barack_America Sep 2013 #57
Reasoned my ass, during the NSA debate he showed his true colors nadinbrzezinski Sep 2013 #58
I am so very sorry, Sir! sheshe2 Sep 2013 #48
Uh oh, sheshe! bunnies Sep 2013 #13
Well that's the second time I've been sheshe2 Sep 2013 #18
Thats ok... bunnies Sep 2013 #24
It's over 400 at this point. zappaman Sep 2013 #38
That must be just about every regularly posting DUer. bunnies Sep 2013 #43
I thought what Putin wanted us to forget is that the Syrian government hughee99 Sep 2013 #14
Dems need to stop hyperventilating. Obama made of mess of things, no getting around it. reformist2 Sep 2013 #16
No sheshe2 Sep 2013 #25
No he made a terrible mess of this on the front side but is saving it on the backside. Mojorabbit Sep 2013 #53
Sorry, but IMHO. sheshe2 Sep 2013 #54
When Pootie Poot claimed Russia the "land of equality" Rex Sep 2013 #21
Thanks Rex~ sheshe2 Sep 2013 #26
Sorry forgot to Rec. Rex Sep 2013 #27
Ed did a great takedown of putin today johnd83 Sep 2013 #32

Cha

(297,692 posts)
1. And, look at all the innocents who were sucked in by this propaganda
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 04:26 PM
Sep 2013

from Putin, she.

That is a stunning pic at the link of the Arab Spring in Syria that started it all.

Interesting comment under the piece from smartypants..

"Jack DeTate September 12, 2013 at 9:22 AM

Putin is a lot of things: oppressor, ruthless, disingenuous, cruel, vindictive..... the list is long. He is also an opportunist, who sees the paralysis of constructive dialog between President Obama and obstructionist Congressional Republicans as a chance to promote his agenda, chip away at US influence and further destabilize our dysfunctional government.

Having gone through the collapse of the USSR, he recognizes the symptoms leading up it's demise that have taken hold here. While his motives are to precipitate the collapse of the USA, his messages, the tools he uses to further that end, are the substance of the unspoken dialog, lost in the political firestorm that has become the new American Regressionism."


What I know is.. no one has the freedom to speak out on Russia/Putin in RT or use it for their own propagnda purposes like Putin is in the NYT.

And, the first thing I see when I link to the HRW is .. "Tell the Olympics to Stand Up Against
Russia’s Hate Laws"


From your link at HRW..

"Finally, the sincerity of Putin’s talk about democratic values and international law is hard to take seriously when back home his own government continues to throw activists in jail, threatens to close NGOs, and rubber-stamps draconian and discriminatory laws.

President Putin should give more credit to his audience: Russia will be judged by its actions, both on the international arena and domestically. So far, Russia has been a key obstacle to ending the suffering in Syria. A change towards a more constructive role would be welcome. But a compilation of half-truths and accusations is not the right way to signal such a change."


Thanks for the wealth of information, she~

sheshe2

(83,925 posts)
2. Thanks Cha,
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:06 PM
Sep 2013

The HRW link is amazing. I followed a few more and found this.

The countdown to the 2014 Winter Olympic Games in Sochi, Russia, expected to be most expensive Games in history, is well under way. Russia is rapidly installing state-of-the-art winter sports venues and infrastructure on Sochi’s Black Sea Coast and in the nearby Caucasus Mountains. But the run-up to the Games has been marred by abuses against Sochi residents and migrant workers toiling on Olympic construction, as well as the recent adoption of a discriminatory antigay law. The International Olympic Committee should live up to its Olympic Charter principles on “human dignity” and non-discrimination, and publicly press Russia to stop the abuses. It should also work to prevent similar abuses by future Olympic Games’ host cities.

http://www.hrw.org/russias-olympian-abuses

I also just posted an OP about the 2014 Olympics. I found a great link at HRW.

This is why it boggles my mind to see so much praise being heaped on Putin. I guess I shouldn't be surprised, when you think about Snowden's rise to hero status here.

Cha

(297,692 posts)
7. Well, our job is to push back on the putin propaganda with
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:16 PM
Sep 2013

the reality and the facts of life in Russia, she.

Nancy Pelosi ✔ @NancyPelosi

Hopefully, when Pres. #Putin says "we must not forget that God created us equal" he includes gays and lesbians in Russia.6:34 AM - 12 Sep 2013

1,596 Retweets 654 favorites Reply

http://theobamadiary.com/2013/09/12/keep-chatting-6/

DonCoquixote

(13,616 posts)
56. is it not nice to see
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 11:49 PM
Sep 2013

That anti Obama people can put LGBT under the bus as much as pro obama types? Let's all crown Putin leader of the free world (sarcasm)

Johonny

(20,889 posts)
10. Yes Obama put the guy who was president of russia off and on since 2000 into the spotlight
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:35 PM
Sep 2013

further proof Obama owns a time machine. DAMN YOU OBAMA!!!
How dare Obama use the country with the most political influence in Syria to influence Syria. Next thing you know Obama will use RED CHINA to influence North Korea. Obama is clearly a fool. LOL.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
9. Fortunately this is being discussed seriously in serious places
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:33 PM
Sep 2013

DU is not as serious as it used to be.

Thanks for your contribution to the propaganda war raging. oh and good bye PLONK

 

Pretzel_Warrior

(8,361 posts)
12. DU isn't serious when long time and prolific posters are going all Iggy Plonk
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:42 PM
Sep 2013

Just because someone posts a different opinion.

The Magistrate

(95,255 posts)
15. Now That, Ma'am, Is Some Dead-Pan Parody...
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:53 PM
Sep 2013

If you keep a straight face that well in person, you might be a dangerous poker player.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
17. except it is not parody and this essay *is being discussed in serious places*
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:59 PM
Sep 2013

with serious thinkers, in the chattering classes.

this place stopped being one a while ago.

In fact, the reaction to this essay is the latest in a series of brush wars where DU is becoming increasingly divided.

Myself will continue to liberally use the Ignore feature on this site. I am done wasting my time. I will contend that it has become multiple sites residing in one server.

And if that means I miss the occasional pearl of wisdom so be it. But this, the cold war stopped a while ago. I do not intend to continue fighting the cold war. If you chose to do so, please proceed.

Oh and one more thing. I doubt I will miss too many pearls of wisdom, since quite a few on the ignore list. I will hazard the majority, are into pie throwing, not discussion, why they were put there to begin with. A few are also cyber stalkers, as in fitting the actual legal definition of the term, and cyber bullies.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
28. Better watch out, you will get double plus ploinked! A Trikerfunk.
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:18 PM
Sep 2013

That is when nadin puts you on 'the list' and refuses to cheat by logging out! You know you are in deep doo doo at that point!

DevonRex

(22,541 posts)
36. Oh no. You mean
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:26 PM
Sep 2013

she'll...see me????


Oh, I get it. You mean she's been seeing me all along by cheating and logging out?

That is outrageous!!!!!!!

The Magistrate

(95,255 posts)
20. Somewhere, Ma'am, There Must Be An Emoticon For 'Whoosh Right Over The Head'...
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:04 PM
Sep 2013

I almost never use those things, but in this instance, I would probably break with custom were something suitable to hand.

The Magistrate

(95,255 posts)
23. They Do Often Provide More Intelligent Observation And Comment, Ma'am
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:09 PM
Sep 2013

The five year old particularly; she is very sharp and curious....

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
37. Well you know how when two people argue over Israeli policy?
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:26 PM
Sep 2013

Turns out one of them MUST be a nazi!! I swear I was so shocked that I didn't know if she was joking or not. Turns out, not joking.

 

bunnies

(15,859 posts)
40. Ah yes.
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:30 PM
Sep 2013

Ive been the nazi a time or two. Most intellectually dishonest accusation ever. I was plonked for disagreeing with her Putin love OP. No wonder she loves Putin so much. Disagree with me?! PLONK!

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
44. If the expert says I am...shit...what else do I not know about myself?
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:34 PM
Sep 2013

I wonder what my thetan count is? Probably eat way too much salt too. Got an ingrown hair...no doubt a sign I am in league with the devil.

DevonRex

(22,541 posts)
51. Well, you're not of the "chattering class" so she'd never tell you anyway.
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:42 PM
Sep 2013

I think we're supposed to eat gruel and go barefoot. Sleep in hay if we can find some. Fuck, I don't even know where the closest working barn is...

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
52. Not even that much...
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:45 PM
Sep 2013

evidently we are persona non grata in all forms...that means my non-self is typing this on a non-existent keyboard - somewhere in the neither regions of my loins...God I am just awww-full.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
46. I know! That rotten smell!?
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:36 PM
Sep 2013

Turns out to be me...

What other secrets am I keeping from myself, I wonder?

Barack_America

(28,876 posts)
57. Jesus, did you actually ignore The Magistrate?
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 11:55 PM
Sep 2013

If so, you should seriously consider stepping back from the DU for a while. Not being able to tolerate arguably the most reasoned and respected voice on DU has got to be a rock bottom.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
58. Reasoned my ass, during the NSA debate he showed his true colors
Fri Sep 13, 2013, 12:25 AM
Sep 2013

and a 180 from his views even a few years before. The difference was, it is a Dem in the white house.

So reasoned my ass. He is polite, I will give him that. And during the NSA debates I came this close to putting him on ignore. It was astounding to see somebody switch 180 just because of who is in the WH.

sheshe2

(83,925 posts)
48. I am so very sorry, Sir!
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:39 PM
Sep 2013

You got Plonked on my thread.

You are a noble man, Sir. Your integrity and honor shine through.

To Sir, With Love~

 

bunnies

(15,859 posts)
13. Uh oh, sheshe!
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:44 PM
Sep 2013

Looks like youve just made Nadins famous "iggy" list. All of us cool kids are on it. Welcome to the group!

sheshe2

(83,925 posts)
18. Well that's the second time I've been
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:00 PM
Sep 2013

Put on the "iggy" list. However if nadin is still responding to me then, I guess she just wanted to hurt my feelings Again~ . The threat is terrifying!

Thanks bunnies.

 

bunnies

(15,859 posts)
24. Thats ok...
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:11 PM
Sep 2013

she put me in the "childrens wing" of the list. I hope she actually did it too. Itll make her posts a lot more fun.

 

bunnies

(15,859 posts)
43. That must be just about every regularly posting DUer.
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:32 PM
Sep 2013

It must really suck to go through life so closed off to alternate opinions. I almost feel sorry for her. Almost.

hughee99

(16,113 posts)
14. I thought what Putin wanted us to forget is that the Syrian government
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:49 PM
Sep 2013

is killing people with Russian supplied weapons.

reformist2

(9,841 posts)
16. Dems need to stop hyperventilating. Obama made of mess of things, no getting around it.
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 05:57 PM
Sep 2013

Pointing out where Putin is wrong only further highlights the extent to which he is in the driver's seat, not Mr. Obama, Mr. American Exceptional Peace Prize winner. I voted for Obama twice, but he's lost his way, at least on foreign policy.

sheshe2

(83,925 posts)
25. No
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:11 PM
Sep 2013

He has not lost his way. He has them at the table, just where he wanted them.

I not only voted for him twice, no make that three times, I voted for him in the primary also! I have also lent my support to him after I left the polls. Is he perfect, no. Is he making progressive change. He sure the hell is. Is our do nothing congress/ Repukes working on behalf of the People. No, they are doing everything that they can to destroy this country. Where is your outrage???!

Mojorabbit

(16,020 posts)
53. No he made a terrible mess of this on the front side but is saving it on the backside.
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:57 PM
Sep 2013

No amount of spin will cover up that fact. I give him kudos for the save.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
21. When Pootie Poot claimed Russia the "land of equality"
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:05 PM
Sep 2013

I lost my lunch and tuned him out. Nothing but a dictator pretending to be president of a free nation.

johnd83

(593 posts)
32. Ed did a great takedown of putin today
Thu Sep 12, 2013, 06:21 PM
Sep 2013

I don't usually watch his show but it was pretty epic. I'll look for a link when it gets posted online.

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