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Nye Bevan

(25,406 posts)
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 03:01 PM Dec 2013

Has the word "thug" become racist?


29 votes, 1 pass | Time left: Unlimited
No. "Thug" simply means "violent criminal" and is not a racist term.
21 (72%)
Yes. The word "thug" has become racist and its use should be avoided.
8 (28%)
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Has the word "thug" become racist? (Original Post) Nye Bevan Dec 2013 OP
From wiki: panader0 Dec 2013 #1
Yes. It's a code word used by 'gun advocates' to mean 'urban' which is the GOP's code word for... nt onehandle Dec 2013 #2
Correct Ohio Joe Dec 2013 #5
Exactly. You even see it used here by "gun advocates." Hoyt Dec 2013 #6
Absurd. Lizzie Poppet Dec 2013 #22
in my experience, it has been used as a euphemism for black youth Iris Dec 2013 #37
Then read some of Robert B. Parker's books. Warpy Jan 2014 #60
I don't believe you have to walk on eggshells. The point is that many racist people are far more Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #64
I see no reason to discard a perfectly good word Warpy Jan 2014 #65
agreed. nt. pothos Dec 2013 #32
yes, regardless of definitions of the actual word La Lioness Priyanka Dec 2013 #3
No, but it is a pejorative designed to degrade a person. Live and Learn Dec 2013 #4
Its often used as a code word. JoePhilly Dec 2013 #7
It's code for union supporters and members, so I hope not. n/t Egalitarian Thug Dec 2013 #8
When used with the "union" qualifier, it's not the same term. redqueen Dec 2013 #20
I would say no. dawg Dec 2013 #9
Yep, all the right wing gun fanciers who called Trayvon Martin a "Thug" meant it affectionately. Hoyt Dec 2013 #19
Language evolves. Not always in a good way. It is no longer race neutral. Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #51
I guess it depends on how it is used. hrmjustin Dec 2013 #10
"Union thug" is how I've mostly heard it. I imagine context, Cerridwen Dec 2013 #11
Here, too, it's used a lot to denote low-level people in the mafia. LuvNewcastle Jan 2014 #46
Keep this up dipsydoodle Dec 2013 #12
lol Boudica the Lyoness Dec 2013 #25
Context is all. Orsino Dec 2013 #13
I think the context in which it's used is what makes a word racist or not... penultimate Dec 2013 #14
I was really surprised earlier this year -- LumosMaxima Dec 2013 #15
Wall Street, Bankster and Law Enforcement "thugs" Earth_First Dec 2013 #16
I suppose any word could be tweaked into a racist term depending on context, petronius Dec 2013 #17
No, but, like any derogatory term, racists may consider it an attribute of groups they don't like. Gidney N Cloyd Dec 2013 #18
A thug, is a thug, is a thug. Who ever thought of it anything different? demosincebirth Dec 2013 #21
I've only heard it in reference to criminals, re-thug-licans and racial thugs. TexasProgresive Dec 2013 #23
I've been using "Rethug" since the Brooks Brothers Riot of 2000 UTUSN Dec 2013 #24
I think yes but I think it's a recent change gollygee Dec 2013 #26
Well hopefully it will either go away on its own dipsydoodle Dec 2013 #27
"Union thugs" come from all races, colors, and creeds. Ed Suspicious Dec 2013 #28
No Go Vols Dec 2013 #29
Is that a childhood picture of John Cena? NaturalHigh Dec 2013 #35
I don't know, but I have never considered it at such. Deep13 Dec 2013 #30
Not really firsttimer Dec 2013 #42
It really doesn't matter what WE say it is MrScorpio Dec 2013 #31
Well, I just ask my Sissyk Dec 2013 #33
Just called my grandson - he said 840high Jan 2014 #55
Oh, well, if we're all gonna call some relatives... Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #63
The right wingers I know always call Trayvon Martin a thug n/t doc03 Dec 2013 #34
No. But it can be used that way. Behind the Aegis Dec 2013 #36
Depends on the situation and the potential for selective outrage by the enduser flvegan Dec 2013 #38
Yup. cherokeeprogressive Dec 2013 #39
No firsttimer Dec 2013 #40
I'm not sure, to be honest. I know I don't like using it. cynatnite Dec 2013 #41
I don't think so, how could it be if so many here use the term rethuglican Packerowner740 Jan 2014 #43
Dog-whistle racism and coded language aren't exactly new ideas. LeftyMom Jan 2014 #44
Seeing as a neighbor frequently uses it when referring to my son- a good student ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #45
I don't think that word means what your neighbor thinks it means. Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #50
He's 15, tall, and muscular. That equals "thug" to my neighbor. ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #53
So, we're talking about one guy who uses a partcular word in correctly. Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #54
What I think is that you're picking a battle with the wrong person. ScreamingMeemie Jan 2014 #59
Picking a battle? Seriously. Wow. Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #61
I don't think it's exactly racist. aptal Jan 2014 #47
I think it refers to organized crime and rethuglicans. CTyankee Jan 2014 #48
Wow. Anyone who says "thug" has not become a racist term is denying reality. It IS used by racists Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #49
Being among the older and less wise here, what is a badly behaving white person called? libdem4life Jan 2014 #52
Thug. 840high Jan 2014 #56
That's what I thought. libdem4life Jan 2014 #57
Nice. Another straw man. Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #62
Some say it beacme racist quite a while ago... Dark n Stormy Knight Jan 2014 #58

panader0

(25,816 posts)
1. From wiki:
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 03:07 PM
Dec 2013

Thuggee or tuggee (Hindi: ठग्गी ṭhagī; Urdu: ٹھگ?; Sanskrit: sthaga; Sindhi: ٺوڳي، ٺڳ; Kannada: "thakka&quot refers to the acts of thugs, an organized gang of professional assassins.

The Thugs travelled in groups across India for several hundred years.[1] Although the thugs traced their origin to seven Muslim tribes, Hindus appear to have been associated with them at an early period; at any rate, their religious creed and practices as worshipers of Kālī, the Hindu goddess of destruction, showed no influence of Islām. The fraternity possessed a jargon of its own, Ramasi, and signs by which its members recognized each other.[2]

Ohio Joe

(21,756 posts)
5. Correct
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 03:25 PM
Dec 2013

And in typical fashion, the racists that use it are to cowardly to admit their racism so they blink their eyes and claim ignorance.

 

Lizzie Poppet

(10,164 posts)
22. Absurd.
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 04:42 PM
Dec 2013

Thugs come in all colors. Seeing racism where none exists only inhibits the battle against actual racism.

Iris

(15,657 posts)
37. in my experience, it has been used as a euphemism for black youth
Sat Dec 28, 2013, 12:03 AM
Dec 2013

This happened on a neighborhood Facebook page where neighbors voiced their "concern" about neighborhood kids who were trying to make money mowing lawns.

Warpy

(111,264 posts)
60. Then read some of Robert B. Parker's books.
Thu Jan 23, 2014, 01:34 AM
Jan 2014

Just because a few morons are misapplying a word shouldn't be reason enough to walk on eggshells when it is the most appropriate word to use for a criminal.

Dark n Stormy Knight

(9,760 posts)
64. I don't believe you have to walk on eggshells. The point is that many racist people are far more
Thu Jan 23, 2014, 03:24 AM
Jan 2014

likely to call a black male a thug for certain behaviors or characteristics than they are to call a white male displaying those same behaviors or characteristics a thug. But that doesn't mean people can't still use it in a non-racist way.

 

La Lioness Priyanka

(53,866 posts)
3. yes, regardless of definitions of the actual word
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 03:23 PM
Dec 2013

the connotation of it usually means a young black man or someone acting like a young black man stereotype.

Live and Learn

(12,769 posts)
4. No, but it is a pejorative designed to degrade a person.
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 03:25 PM
Dec 2013

Name calling, instead of seeking real solutions to problems is never useful.

JoePhilly

(27,787 posts)
7. Its often used as a code word.
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 03:26 PM
Dec 2013

Welfare Queen, urban, inner city, thug ... code words. They work as code words because they have alternative meanings, which allows the racist to act surprised when they use them and some one points out the racial connotation.

redqueen

(115,103 posts)
20. When used with the "union" qualifier, it's not the same term.
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 04:39 PM
Dec 2013

Alone, its use is almost always reserved for men of color. Therefore, I consider it racist in those cases, which (at least to me) seem to be the majority of cases where the word is used.

dawg

(10,624 posts)
9. I would say no.
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 03:26 PM
Dec 2013

Some people might use the term with racial intent, but the term itself is race-neutral.

 

Hoyt

(54,770 posts)
19. Yep, all the right wing gun fanciers who called Trayvon Martin a "Thug" meant it affectionately.
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 04:36 PM
Dec 2013

Cerridwen

(13,258 posts)
11. "Union thug" is how I've mostly heard it. I imagine context,
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 03:29 PM
Dec 2013

as with almost everything, is a factor to distinguish how it's being used. I've also heard it used to refer to Mafia thugs (I'm from Las Vegas, NV) as well as run-of-the-mill street criminals.

I see another poster has said it does now have racist implications which doesn't surprise me at all.

Context.

LuvNewcastle

(16,846 posts)
46. Here, too, it's used a lot to denote low-level people in the mafia.
Sun Jan 5, 2014, 10:32 AM
Jan 2014

I've heard people use it interchangeably to describe white and black men, generally young men but not always. I live on the gulf coast; I don't know if it makes a difference. We've had a good deal of mafia (mostly "Dixie Mafia&quot influence down here for a long time. I guess it all depends on who is using it and how they're using it. But unless I know the person using it to be a racist who habitually degrades other races, I don't take it as a racist term.

dipsydoodle

(42,239 posts)
12. Keep this up
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 03:37 PM
Dec 2013

and we'll get to "this bloke comes right up to me says and says hello."

"Hello!"

Search Derek and Clive if you don't know what I mean.

Orsino

(37,428 posts)
13. Context is all.
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 03:49 PM
Dec 2013

Very few words are automatically racist.

The OP, for instance, isn't necessarily so.

penultimate

(1,110 posts)
14. I think the context in which it's used is what makes a word racist or not...
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 03:52 PM
Dec 2013

If I ever use the word thug, it's not based on race, but rather on behavior. However, there are definitely situations in which it seems fairly obvious that the person is using the word in a racial way.

Context and intent have always been the determining factor for me on if something is racist or not.

LumosMaxima

(585 posts)
15. I was really surprised earlier this year --
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 03:53 PM
Dec 2013

to hear young people online saying that it was used to refer to race. That's not at all how I think of the word. If anything, I think of white gangsters during the Prohibition era. I suppose I'm getting old.

petronius

(26,602 posts)
17. I suppose any word could be tweaked into a racist term depending on context,
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 04:09 PM
Dec 2013

but "thug" standing on its own does not have any racial or ethnic connotations (at least, not in the standard USAmerican English usages that I'm familiar with)...

UTUSN

(70,695 posts)
24. I've been using "Rethug" since the Brooks Brothers Riot of 2000
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 05:27 PM
Dec 2013

1.Tom Pyle, policy analyst, office of House Majority Whip Tom DeLay (R-Tex). 2.Garry Malphrus, majority chief counsel and staff director, House Judiciary subcommittee on criminal justice. 3.Rory Cooper, political division staff member at the National Republican Congressional Committee. 4.Kevin Smith, former House Republican conference analyst and more recently of Voter.com. 5.Steven Brophy, former aide to Sen. Fred D. Thompson (R-Tenn.), now working at the consulting firm KPMG. 6.Matt Schlapp, former chief of staff for Rep. Todd Tiahrt (R-Kan.), now on the Bush campaign staff in Austin. 7.Roger Morse, aide to Rep. Van Hilleary (R-Tenn.). 8.Duane Gibson, aide to Chairman Don Young (R-Alaska) of the House Resources Committee. 9.Chuck Royal, legislative assistant to Rep. Jim DeMint (R-S.C.). 10.Layna McConkey, former legislative assistant to former Rep. Jim Ross Lightfoot (R-Iowa) now at Steelman Health Strategies.

gollygee

(22,336 posts)
26. I think yes but I think it's a recent change
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 05:32 PM
Dec 2013

when I was younger there was no racial meaning of "thug" but it does seem to be a more recent thing. I think people our age and older might not always think of it that way but it's definitely changing into that.

dipsydoodle

(42,239 posts)
27. Well hopefully it will either go away on its own
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 05:38 PM
Dec 2013

or some real thugs will put a stop to it themselves making those who misuse the expression truly wish they had never been born.

Deep13

(39,154 posts)
30. I don't know, but I have never considered it at such.
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 06:20 PM
Dec 2013

To me, thug means a violent criminal, often an enforcer for organized crime management.

 

firsttimer

(324 posts)
42. Not really
Sat Dec 28, 2013, 12:40 AM
Dec 2013

You it hear being used by people against unions.

I have heard Union Thug used. The term is a violent person.

I suppose if everyone looks hard enough they can imagine racism in anything.

MrScorpio

(73,631 posts)
31. It really doesn't matter what WE say it is
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 06:23 PM
Dec 2013

If the Wingers uses the word to it describe how they feel about young Black males

Sissyk

(12,665 posts)
33. Well, I just ask my
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 06:54 PM
Dec 2013

Young, black, hip son what he thought and he said he had never heard it used in a racial tone. To him, thug means lowlife dirtbag. Lol.

Behind the Aegis

(53,959 posts)
36. No. But it can be used that way.
Fri Dec 27, 2013, 07:01 PM
Dec 2013

Context is important, as is who is using the term. Is 'gay' homophobic? Not usually, but it sure is when someone talks about such and such is "gay", meaning "bad". What about "Jew?" Is it anti-Semitic? Nope, except when used in such a way, like: "He jewed me on the price." or "Of course, they are upset, it is the Jew pathology to be victims." Both are examples on a word that isn't anti-Semitic being used in such a way. We could go old-school...is "articulate" a racist term? Almost never, except when it is used to express dismay at a non-white (usually black person) speaking in "proper" English (as defined by the person expressing the dismay).

Intent and context will determine if a word is being used in an offensive manner.

flvegan

(64,408 posts)
38. Depends on the situation and the potential for selective outrage by the enduser
Sat Dec 28, 2013, 12:09 AM
Dec 2013

Broad brush being what it is, to suggest that a commonly used word that one might utter might brand that person a racist by the enduser seems pretty...yeah, that.

Thank the gods that "moron" and "idiot" have yet to raise the hackles of those seeking to be pissed about anything.

Packerowner740

(676 posts)
43. I don't think so, how could it be if so many here use the term rethuglican
Sun Jan 5, 2014, 02:24 AM
Jan 2014

I know we don't have a group of racists posting here.

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
45. Seeing as a neighbor frequently uses it when referring to my son- a good student
Sun Jan 5, 2014, 03:10 AM
Jan 2014

athlete, neighborhood task doer, etc... it hasn't for me.

It appears it has for some, but not in my house.

Dark n Stormy Knight

(9,760 posts)
50. I don't think that word means what your neighbor thinks it means.
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 10:09 PM
Jan 2014

How does thug apply to a good student, athlete, (or student-athlete), neighborhood task-doer?

Dark n Stormy Knight

(9,760 posts)
54. So, we're talking about one guy who uses a partcular word in correctly.
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 11:37 PM
Jan 2014

In a way that has little, if anything, to do with the actual meaning of the word. Making that an isolated, insignificant event, almost entirely irrelevant to the question of whether the term thug has become a racial slur in the larger culture.

Perhaps you weren't suggesting otherwise.

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
59. What I think is that you're picking a battle with the wrong person.
Thu Jan 23, 2014, 12:50 AM
Jan 2014

I didn't read the body of your post...because it's been a few days since I posted this. I trust you'll move along now. Have a nice night.

Dark n Stormy Knight

(9,760 posts)
49. Wow. Anyone who says "thug" has not become a racist term is denying reality. It IS used by racists
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 10:04 PM
Jan 2014

ONLY to describe blacks. Others may use it differently, but it is now a tainted word.

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