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Is Bill DeBlasio going to do away with horse drawn carriages in NY? (Original Post) boston bean Dec 2013 OP
I hope so. MoonRiver Dec 2013 #1
They are? boston bean Dec 2013 #3
Cab accidents, heat exhaustion, pedestrian mishaps...read all about it BeyondGeography Dec 2013 #9
Thank you for the link. I understand much better now.. boston bean Dec 2013 #16
Yes he wants to get rid of them. He wants to replace them with old model cars. hrmjustin Dec 2013 #2
Ok, some are saying it's a promise he made to animal rights activists... boston bean Dec 2013 #8
TThre have beens stories about the horses being abused and some dying on tbe street. hrmjustin Dec 2013 #10
oh really??? Well, then... I guess it's got to go. boston bean Dec 2013 #11
what are they used for ? JI7 Dec 2013 #4
take people for rides through the park and parts of the city. boston bean Dec 2013 #6
some people just want to ruin everything Niceguy1 Dec 2013 #13
Who are these "some people" and what are they "ruining?" nt MADem Dec 2013 #15
He regards it as inhumane. FactBasedLifeform Dec 2013 #5
Too many hansom cab drivers Cirque du So-What Dec 2013 #7
Well they overbought! Codeine Dec 2013 #22
There are numerous reasons - LiberalElite Dec 2013 #12
I saw the link above... heartwrenching. Thank you! boston bean Dec 2013 #17
I can barely breathe the air in NYC, I feel for the horses having to MADem Dec 2013 #14
I hope so. Animal rights groups have been RebelOne Dec 2013 #18
For arguments on the other side (and I'm not taking sides) frazzled Dec 2013 #19
I hope so. The horseshit smell all around Central Park South Lucky Luciano Dec 2013 #20
Indeed....the smell is overwhelming, and indicates that the horses know not to msanthrope Dec 2013 #21

boston bean

(36,221 posts)
16. Thank you for the link. I understand much better now..
Tue Dec 31, 2013, 04:40 PM
Dec 2013

Seems it's a practice that needs to end. Poor horses. I would have never thought they were mistreated. They always looked so beautiful.

boston bean

(36,221 posts)
8. Ok, some are saying it's a promise he made to animal rights activists...
Tue Dec 31, 2013, 04:29 PM
Dec 2013

Is that the case, and what about the environmentalists???

Are the horses abused? If so, do away with it. If not, it is a part of NYC that makes NYC, NYC.

boston bean

(36,221 posts)
11. oh really??? Well, then... I guess it's got to go.
Tue Dec 31, 2013, 04:32 PM
Dec 2013

Now I'm feeling a little bad, that whenever I saw them, I thought they looked beautiful and what a good experience it was.

boston bean

(36,221 posts)
6. take people for rides through the park and parts of the city.
Tue Dec 31, 2013, 04:24 PM
Dec 2013

It's been going on for forever, and I just didn't understand what the issue was and why they needed to be taken away??

 
5. He regards it as inhumane.
Tue Dec 31, 2013, 04:23 PM
Dec 2013

And it was one of the campaign promises he made to animal rights groups, I think.

Hope he gets his way. Seems the only people opposed are those that profit from it.

Cirque du So-What

(25,941 posts)
7. Too many hansom cab drivers
Tue Dec 31, 2013, 04:24 PM
Dec 2013

Last edited Wed Jan 1, 2014, 09:52 AM - Edit history (1)

were feeding their horses Beefarino, resulting in considerable consternation on the part of patrons.

LiberalElite

(14,691 posts)
12. There are numerous reasons -
Tue Dec 31, 2013, 04:34 PM
Dec 2013

horses are very sensitive and "spook" easily. There have been numerous incidents over the years, hurting passengers, drivers and horses alike. Some of these horses had to be destroyed. The horses are worked 9 hours a day, 7 days a week, in all kinds of weather.They're kept in cramped firetrap stables on the far west side of Manhattan. Laws exist regulating the conditions they're allowed to be worked in but it's difficult to enforce - not enough agents (ASPCA is in charge). Also, carriage horses often have come from Amish farmers or racetracks. They've already had a working life. Bought at auction, although having pre-existing injuries and conditions such as arthritis, they end up pulling carriages containing several humans at a time. Average lifespan of a NYC carriage horse is 4 years vs. the NYPD horses at 14 years. There's more if interested: www.banhdc.org.

MADem

(135,425 posts)
14. I can barely breathe the air in NYC, I feel for the horses having to
Tue Dec 31, 2013, 04:37 PM
Dec 2013

haul those massive carriages full of large people through those terrible exhaust-stinky streets.

If they kept them in the park I'd be less perturbed about it, but I am terrified for them in the streets.

RebelOne

(30,947 posts)
18. I hope so. Animal rights groups have been
Tue Dec 31, 2013, 04:57 PM
Dec 2013

trying for years to get rid of those horse-drawn carriages in NYC.

frazzled

(18,402 posts)
19. For arguments on the other side (and I'm not taking sides)
Tue Dec 31, 2013, 06:10 PM
Dec 2013

it is claimed that there's an interest in getting hold of the stables, which rest on valuable property being developed as the massive Hudson Yards project. There's a really big financial interest there (as there is for the carriage drivers themselves). And also, it is claimed that these horses will not be able to be sent to some great horsey retirement community; they'll be killed. I don't know, but here is part of the story:


The American Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals is one of the groups leading the effort to ban the carriages. It is also one of the three entities — along with the city’s health department and the Department of Consumer Affairs — that regulate the industry.

“I don’t see it as a conflict,” the society’s president, Ed Sayres, said last month on the steps of City Hall after a rally against the carriages. “If we don’t bring forward the risk factor that we are observing, then it would be negligent.”

In 2008, Mr. Sayres teamed up with Stephen Nislick, chief executive of the development company Edison Properties, which owns Manhattan Mini Storage, to develop a plan to replace the carriage horses with electric-powered replicas of antique cars.

>

The carriage owners also assert that Mr. Nislick wants to be able to gain control of the land under the carriage horse stables.

Two of the stables are on a prime block between West 37th and 38th Streets in the heart of Hudson Yards, a sprawling commercial and residential development.

Mr. Nislick denied being interested in the land, but other developers envision transforming the lots into hotels and office buildings.

If the stables were sold and then closed, the carriage horses could end up homeless, and their owners could go out of business. Relocating uptown, and closer to Central Park, may not be an option with real estate scarce.

The stables on 37th and 38th Streets are in the district of the City Council speaker, Christine C. Quinn, a Democrat who is expected to run for mayor. Like Mr. Bloomberg, Ms. Quinn has supported the carriage industry, though she has called recently for increased oversight of the horses.

Two other likely Democratic mayoral candidates — Scott M. Stringer, the Manhattan borough president, and William C. Thompson Jr., the former city comptroller — have supported the ban, as well as the electric car initiative.

NY-Class and other animal rights groups pledge that if the carriages are eliminated, they will find safe pastures for the 216 horses. But many veterinarians say horse sanctuaries around the country are full, and facing difficulties because of the economy.

“If we banned the carriage horse industry tomorrow, they would go straight to slaughter,” said Dr. Nena Winand, an upstate New York veterinarian who is a member of the American Association of Equine Practitioners. “There is no big field out there, there is no one to pay the bills.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/08/nyregion/ny-horse-drawn-carriage-industry-fights-for-survival.html?pagewanted=1&_r=0


I don't see why there can't be a compromise position, in which stricter laws for both the horse owners and, say, errant taxis who ram into the horses, can't be legislated. I don't really have an opinion here, though.

Lucky Luciano

(11,257 posts)
20. I hope so. The horseshit smell all around Central Park South
Tue Dec 31, 2013, 11:32 PM
Dec 2013

...and the roads on the west side of the park can be unbearable - especially in the summer.

Not nice to the horses either as alluded to above.

 

msanthrope

(37,549 posts)
21. Indeed....the smell is overwhelming, and indicates that the horses know not to
Tue Dec 31, 2013, 11:36 PM
Dec 2013

mess their stalls...which means that their stalls are not cleaned regularly, and the horses know to dump in the park.

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