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Jesus Malverde

(10,274 posts)
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 06:26 PM Jan 2014

Patrick Kennedy on marijuana: ‘Destroys the brain and expedites psychosis’

For a generation of liberals, legalization of marijuana has become a harmless — if not inevitable — issue.

Not for Patrick Kennedy. The former Rhode Island congressman and scion of the famed Democratic dynasty has taken a surprising turn to the right in this debate.

Marijuana destroys the brain and expedites psychosis,” he told us Tuesday. “It’s just overall a very dangerous drug.”

Kennedy’s public battles with alcohol and prescription drugs are well known. Was pot an issue for him? He’s used it but wouldn’t elaborate. Still, it’s all part of the same conversation for him: “In terms of neurobiology, there’s no distinction between the quality and types of drugs that people get addicted to. That’s why they call it a gateway drug. Addiction is addiction is addiction.”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/reliable-source/post/patrick-kennedy-on-marijuana-destroys-the-brain-and-expedites-psychosis/2013/01/08/795a20ae-59e3-11e2-88d0-c4cf65c3ad15_blog.html

launched Project SAM (Smart Approaches to Marijuana) to shift the debate from legalization to prevention and treatment — despite what appears to be a growing social acceptance of the drug.

Former ONDCP Advisor Kevin Sabet is at it again.

I’ve warned readers before about the “kinder gentler drug war” ideas that Sabet has been peddling. Now with much fanfare and the bi-partisan additions of conservative David Frum and liberal Patrick Kennedy, Sabet has launched Project SAM, known as “Smart Approaches to Marijuana”.

This is Sabet’s latest attempt to paint criticism of War on Drugs, which is gaining traction with the voters, as a “false choice” between “lock ‘em up” and “legalize it”. It is his Goldilocks-and-the-Three-Bears triangulation of the War on Drugs as “too hard”, the legalization of marijuana as “too soft”, and the emphasis on treatment and prevention as “just right”.

It is, as Ethan Nadelmann of Drug Policy Alliance remarked, “a strategic retreat” in order to maintain the prohibition of marijuana. The racial arrest disparities, the denial of medicine to the truly ill, and the devastating consequences of a marijuana possession arrest are battles that he cannot win any more, so he cedes that territory, calling for an end to “stop and frisk”, restoration of civil rights for those who served marijuana sentences, and emergency approval of non-smoked marijuana medicines for the truly ill.

But Sabet’s SAM never addresses the root cause that leads to all of the devastating consequences in the first place: the arrest of a marijuana smoker for possession or use. Indeed, in SAM’s world, pot smokers would still be arrested, but the “kinder gentler drug war” would mandate rehab and supervised probation for those caught with weed. If you should choose not to go to rehab or you fail a pee test, well, then, the force of law still exists to throw you in a cage.

http://www.theweedblog.com/smart-approaches-to-marijuana-would-force-all-pot-smokers-into-prehab/

62 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Patrick Kennedy on marijuana: ‘Destroys the brain and expedites psychosis’ (Original Post) Jesus Malverde Jan 2014 OP
Tweety (Chris Matthews) agreed with these clowns vt_native Jan 2014 #1
He should have had some non-addicts on who use weed responsibly... polichick Jan 2014 #3
Absolutely! You can't just have recovering addicts.... bobGandolf Jan 2014 #50
Since he seems to idolize Maher, he should have posited a question about ... MindMover Jan 2014 #8
Well he should know about psychosis B2G Jan 2014 #2
The misinformation in that piece was so bad I was screaming at the TV .... MindMover Jan 2014 #4
Brain damage and psychosis... Alkene Jan 2014 #5
then no marijuana for you NightWatcher Jan 2014 #6
I rant, I said... RainDog Jan 2014 #7
Thanks RainDog, all excellent posts. Jesus Malverde Jan 2014 #12
bring back Jesse Jackson Jr reddread Jan 2014 #9
He left the House in 2011. Not clear why Matthews thinks he's a public figure worth listening to FarCenter Jan 2014 #11
The man was in and out of rehab while 'serving' in Congress and never did Bluenorthwest Jan 2014 #51
Matthews slobbers over the Kennedys customerserviceguy Jan 2014 #53
Kennedy is an excellent example of why you shouldn't abuse marijuana, not why is shouldn't be legal FarCenter Jan 2014 #10
Unless I'm mistaken, Kennedy's problem was with prescription painkillers. Warren DeMontague Jan 2014 #25
Oxycontin -- like Rush Limbaugh... But also bipolar and an alcoholic. FarCenter Jan 2014 #27
That reminds me of Stephen Baldwin maxing out on drugs and Cha Jan 2014 #41
He had problems with cocaine, then with presciption opiates, alcohol, etc Bluenorthwest Jan 2014 #52
Pot is bad, yeah sort of like too much alcohol OutNow Jan 2014 #13
Sometimes those reformed addicts are insufferable. Blue_In_AK Jan 2014 #14
Makes me wonder how the hell have the Dutch survived the last several decades. Must be a country adirondacker Jan 2014 #15
Carl Sagan. Warren DeMontague Jan 2014 #24
This country is so far behind all we have to do is look at other countries, who have DECADES of adirondacker Jan 2014 #26
Patrick seems a sad little man. GeorgeGist Jan 2014 #16
You shouldn't overdo anything gollygee Jan 2014 #17
So true. Can't overdose. Or get physically addicted. n-t Logical Jan 2014 #21
But you sure can run out. Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #44
As far as it being a gateway drug, Mr.Bill Jan 2014 #18
Carl Sagan! n/t wildbilln864 Jan 2014 #19
No doubt some people will have issues and abuse Pot.... Logical Jan 2014 #20
There's a brain cell cell missing in part of the Kennedy clan's mystic. Lint Head Jan 2014 #22
Right. They won't put people in jail for smoking it as long as they pay a fine & NEVER DO IT AGAIN Warren DeMontague Jan 2014 #23
This particular generation of Kennedy is not well aquainted with "science" ... etherealtruth Jan 2014 #28
Yep. Patrick and RFK, Jr. are not exactly coin of the science realm. - nt Liberal Veteran Jan 2014 #29
dude MFM008 Jan 2014 #30
Matthews is one fredamae Jan 2014 #31
LOL Beware of reefer madness meme gerogie2 Jan 2014 #32
Good points Jesus Malverde Jan 2014 #43
The "expedites psychosis" bit is broadly accurate. Donald Ian Rankin Jan 2014 #33
Alcohol can expedite psychosis in anyone, not just people already susceptible .... MindMover Jan 2014 #36
I say its the opposite of broadly given that the vast majority of marijuana users never experience.. phleshdef Jan 2014 #38
Roger Pertwee, the leading pharmacologist in the UK RainDog Jan 2014 #39
Compared to other, LEGAL drugs... TroglodyteScholar Jan 2014 #46
perhaps if one already suffers from such an ailment. i know a guy who is paranoid delusional dionysus Jan 2014 #57
Shit like this makes me believe cannabis makes people less materialistic and less hierarchical RadiationTherapy Jan 2014 #34
Bingo TroglodyteScholar Jan 2014 #47
+ 1,000,000,000 redqueen Jan 2014 #60
Of course it does PowerToThePeople Jan 2014 #35
Let's all have some whiskey, instead. nyquil_man Jan 2014 #37
Funny you should mention it TroglodyteScholar Jan 2014 #48
O.K., who put the PCP in Patrick's pot? Coyotl Jan 2014 #40
No matter what he wants to say... TroglodyteScholar Jan 2014 #42
Well, better avoid the bilious cloud over the Stupor Bowl! Eleanors38 Jan 2014 #45
the cloud would be over the tailgating section of the parking lot. dionysus Jan 2014 #56
Post removed Post removed Jan 2014 #49
bump... nt Jesus Malverde Jan 2014 #54
Who funds SAM? LordGlenconner Jan 2014 #55
Looking at their propaganda you see references to big alcohol and big tobacco taking over mj. Jesus Malverde Jan 2014 #62
Living an easy and privileged life evidently has expedited Kennedy's psychosis Rex Jan 2014 #58
He better steer clear of COFFEE then...MAJOR gateway drug. PassingFair Jan 2014 #59
Statements like this make me wonder which drug cartel is propping them up mainer Jan 2014 #61

vt_native

(484 posts)
1. Tweety (Chris Matthews) agreed with these clowns
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 06:35 PM
Jan 2014

Lawford and Kennedy.

Of course, he didn't have anyone one to present an opposing viewpoint.

MindMover

(5,016 posts)
8. Since he seems to idolize Maher, he should have posited a question about ...
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 06:47 PM
Jan 2014

how MJ has not done any harm to Bill ... but NOOOOOOOOO ... time frame and producers bullshit intent ...

MindMover

(5,016 posts)
4. The misinformation in that piece was so bad I was screaming at the TV ....
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 06:40 PM
Jan 2014

Yes, Patrick, THC is higher in the MJ today, but it can sometimes be lower .... in comparing it to something you know a little bit about ...alcohol ... there is beer with lets say 6% alcohol content, then there is wine with lets say 12% alcohol, and then there is spirits with 30+++ alcohol content ....

Now Patrick, MJ today has many different varieties and strains and levels of THC content ...

Please see this article to understand that marijuana does not always have high THC content ...

"This particular plant has 0.5 percent THC and 17 percent CBD -- or cannabidiol -- the non-psychoactive ingredient [in marijuana],

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/12/03/medical-marijuana-epilepsy_n_4378929.html

This is just one of the misstatements that were made in that interview ...

NightWatcher

(39,343 posts)
6. then no marijuana for you
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 06:41 PM
Jan 2014

I don't eat Taco Bell, but you don't see me preaching against it that it should be made illegal.

More cannabis for those who plan to use it as medicine.

 

reddread

(6,896 posts)
9. bring back Jesse Jackson Jr
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 06:47 PM
Jan 2014

and get this SOB out of there.
Nothing does more harm to the American people and the collective psyche than entrenched politicians.

 

FarCenter

(19,429 posts)
11. He left the House in 2011. Not clear why Matthews thinks he's a public figure worth listening to
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 06:51 PM
Jan 2014
 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
51. The man was in and out of rehab while 'serving' in Congress and never did
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 09:19 AM
Jan 2014

he act responsibly, he continued to sit in the Chamber strung out on hard drugs and alcohol. The fact that his wastrel is touted as anything but a shame and embarrassment to our Party is unforgiveable.

customerserviceguy

(25,183 posts)
53. Matthews slobbers over the Kennedys
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 09:47 AM
Jan 2014

Anyone who has their DNA line MUST be worth listening to, in his opinion.

Even if all they can blabber is recovery-speak, like Al Franken's SNL character, Stuart Smalley.

 

FarCenter

(19,429 posts)
10. Kennedy is an excellent example of why you shouldn't abuse marijuana, not why is shouldn't be legal
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 06:48 PM
Jan 2014

With the legalization of marijuana, and hopefully other drugs, there will be some like Kennedy who will abuse them and suffer health consequences.

It will be important to widely publicize these effects to teenagers so that they are less likely to abuse drugs.

Treatment and rehab should be available for those who don't get the message.

 

FarCenter

(19,429 posts)
27. Oxycontin -- like Rush Limbaugh... But also bipolar and an alcoholic.
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 07:35 PM
Jan 2014

Seems to have been a wide-spectrum drug abuser. I'd be really surprised if cocaine wasn't a favorite.

Cha

(297,237 posts)
41. That reminds me of Stephen Baldwin maxing out on drugs and
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 02:53 AM
Jan 2014

then found some sort of religion that hates PBO and Democracy. Another form of overdosing.

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
52. He had problems with cocaine, then with presciption opiates, alcohol, etc
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 09:21 AM
Jan 2014

Many facets to his abuse of substances, also many years of his taking drugs while in Congress.

OutNow

(864 posts)
13. Pot is bad, yeah sort of like too much alcohol
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 07:00 PM
Jan 2014

Well, pot is actually less dangerous that alcohol. But if alcohol is legal, then pot should be legal. If Patrick Kennedy doesn't like pot then he shouldn't use it. But leave the rest of the population alone Patrick!

Blue_In_AK

(46,436 posts)
14. Sometimes those reformed addicts are insufferable.
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 07:02 PM
Jan 2014

I saw him on Bill Maher a year or so ago, and I couldn't believe my ears at all the foolishness coming out of his mouth.

adirondacker

(2,921 posts)
15. Makes me wonder how the hell have the Dutch survived the last several decades. Must be a country
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 07:09 PM
Jan 2014

full of brain dead zombies by now.

" Netherlands stand-out performer of Times Higher Education ranking
Publication date: Oct 04, 2012 09:05 AM
Categories: Education promotion, Expertise

The Netherlands, Germany and Belgium have emerged as strong performers in Europe in the Times Higher Education World University Rankings 2012-13, published last night.

The three European countries buck a clear trend of overall decline for Western universities, against rising investment in world class universities in the Asia Pacific region.

The Netherlands has 12 institutions in the world top 200 in the rankings – the most representatives of any country other than the UK and US. And this year every single Dutch university improved its position."

https://www.nuffic.nl/en/news/nuffic-news/netherlands-stand-out-performer-of-times-higher-education-ranking

adirondacker

(2,921 posts)
26. This country is so far behind all we have to do is look at other countries, who have DECADES of
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 07:33 PM
Jan 2014

experience by now, for all that is ailing us. The whole debate boggles my mind.

GeorgeGist

(25,321 posts)
16. Patrick seems a sad little man.
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 07:13 PM
Jan 2014

Every once in awhile the 'serious people' trot him out to be ridiculed by knowledgeable people.

gollygee

(22,336 posts)
17. You shouldn't overdo anything
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 07:16 PM
Jan 2014

but it seems like it would be less of a health problem to overdo it with marijuana than with alcohol.

 

Logical

(22,457 posts)
20. No doubt some people will have issues and abuse Pot....
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 07:22 PM
Jan 2014

But no one will die from a overdose like with alcohol, no one will ruin their liver like with alcohol, no one will become physically addicted like with alcohol.

People abuse everything. Prescription drugs, Alcohol, Food, etc.

Why throw people in jail or ruin careers over pot? So stupid.








Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
23. Right. They won't put people in jail for smoking it as long as they pay a fine & NEVER DO IT AGAIN
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 07:26 PM
Jan 2014

That's great!

etherealtruth

(22,165 posts)
28. This particular generation of Kennedy is not well aquainted with "science" ...
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 07:43 PM
Jan 2014

... or reality

I miss Ted Kennedy, but I really wish these fools would STFU

fredamae

(4,458 posts)
31. Matthews is one
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 07:57 PM
Jan 2014

of the Most Ill Informed people I've ever heard...they were sure glad-handing each other over a piss poor job making a case against legalizing..
Kennedys org "SAM" had Kevin Sabet before the State of Oregon Leg cmte last Fri and agrees a 50 yo Should be able to imbibe in the privacy of his own home--but should also be required to use the criminal Black Market as the sole source for accessing.

http://www.oregonlive.com/politics/index.ssf/2014/01/marijuana_opponent_kevin_sabet.html

But what this clip doesn't show out of his 53 min presentation is when a Senator at the end asked him to clarify Where "the 50 yo" was supposed to get it (My interpretation) - "Do you expect them to go to the Criminal market for it?" Sabet replied in the affirmative because that is a "con of prohibition". It sure seems like Sabet actually promoted crime in OR! I am unable to post the link to the video archive of the whole hearing from the State website--they may not have it up in Archives yet..but if you are interested you can try here. The hearing was in "Hearing Room F" on Friday, Jan 17th at 2pm.
http://www.oregonlegislature.gov/citizen_engagement/Pages/Legislative-Video.aspx

 

gerogie2

(450 posts)
32. LOL Beware of reefer madness meme
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 08:01 PM
Jan 2014

These control freaks just can't accept that the use of marijuana is harmless when used in moderation. Sure there are people that are going to abuse it, just like people that abuse alcohol and smoke too many cigarettes. But we don't put them in jail unless they harm someone else or are a public nuisance like drunk in public.

Do you know that there are 700,000+ marijuana possession arrests in the USA each year? If each arrests costs $1,000 for police, jail and courts that is that is a cost of about $700M. I would call that a waste of taxpayers money and the waste of police resources. IMHO YMMV!

Jesus Malverde

(10,274 posts)
43. Good points
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 03:03 AM
Jan 2014

Welcome to DU!

It's not just a waste of money. Peoples lives are also being destroyed in the process.

Donald Ian Rankin

(13,598 posts)
33. The "expedites psychosis" bit is broadly accurate.
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 08:03 PM
Jan 2014

There's fairly strong evidence that marijuana can activate/aggravate problems of that sort, especially in people already susceptible to them.

I know that marijuana is practically a holy sacrament on DU, but it's *not* terribly safe, and political enthusiasm shouldn't blind us to that.

MindMover

(5,016 posts)
36. Alcohol can expedite psychosis in anyone, not just people already susceptible ....
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 11:35 PM
Jan 2014

Last edited Wed Jan 22, 2014, 02:06 AM - Edit history (1)

For the record Mr. Rankin ....

Marijuana is safer than aspirin and every other drug known to mankind .... so put that in your peace pipe and smoke it ....

If you can prove the statement above is incorrect, I would like to see the research ...

 

phleshdef

(11,936 posts)
38. I say its the opposite of broadly given that the vast majority of marijuana users never experience..
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 11:56 PM
Jan 2014

...psychosis or expedition of psychosis or whatever it is he is trying to say.

And either way, that's not a good enough reason to keep it illegal unless you are gonna be consistent and ban a lot of other stuff, including alcohol.

RainDog

(28,784 posts)
39. Roger Pertwee, the leading pharmacologist in the UK
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 01:39 AM
Jan 2014

who has devoted his life's work to the study of cannabis, and who now also works with GW Pharma in GB (who will be bringing Sativex to a drug store near you...)

anyway, Pertwee says that the risk of schizophrenia is only for those who have a family history, and therefore probability of developing a schizo-affective disorder. Harvard recently released a study noting the same, and researchers did a meta analysis of cannabis and schizophrenia and came to the same conclusion as Pertwee.

If someone has a history of schizophrenia in their family, I would recommend that they not use marijuana.

This is also a reason that underage use should be discouraged because this correlates with earlier onset of symptoms for those disposed to schizophrenia.

Some people are uncomfortable with extremely high levels of THC and need more CBD in their cannabis. If someone feels paranoid, uneasy, etc. etc...that's too much THC, generally, and someone, if they have not smoked cannabis for a while, should have a little CBD strain around to offset the discomfort.

Those who have not used cannabis in a long time should also take one puff, wait ten minutes. Or wait a little more than that. Some cannabis builds its effects, so people should not think they're buying a bag of leaves when they are buying buds that have been grown and cured to maximize the effect of THC.

On the other hand, people burn a lot less plant material now.

I think it's good to provide valid criticism about an issue - for instance, someone posted a link here to an alternative med site that said cannabis cures cancer... but that's not a valid statement at this time, tho it has shown it does shrink cancer cells in (mostly) animal studies.

TroglodyteScholar

(5,477 posts)
46. Compared to other, LEGAL drugs...
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 03:10 AM
Jan 2014

...it most certainly is terribly safe.

People die from alcohol poisoning. People die from prescription drug abuse. I guess now I'll list here all the people who have died from cannabis abuse...



























...




























...













dionysus

(26,467 posts)
57. perhaps if one already suffers from such an ailment. i know a guy who is paranoid delusional
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 12:46 PM
Jan 2014

whenever he's on anything. he has a family history of mental illness. (ie, he thinks the govt has spiked all the weed with nanites, which are then activated by radio to control your mind. we thought he was joking, but after a while... we realized he really wasn't. he also thinks the CIA has giant machines under the place he works... )

however, I have never seen a non inflicted person descend into psychosis from ripping bongs.

RadiationTherapy

(5,818 posts)
34. Shit like this makes me believe cannabis makes people less materialistic and less hierarchical
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 08:05 PM
Jan 2014

and is thus the greatest threat to the system status quo. I don't know what else to think.

TroglodyteScholar

(5,477 posts)
47. Bingo
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 03:12 AM
Jan 2014

I won't say it makes you smart (it doesn't), but it does lend a different perspective...one that isn't particularly friendly to authoritarianism.

 

PowerToThePeople

(9,610 posts)
35. Of course it does
Tue Jan 21, 2014, 08:14 PM
Jan 2014

Every sane person knows this it true. There appear to be a lot of mindless dirty druggie hippies on this board....



























































































TroglodyteScholar

(5,477 posts)
48. Funny you should mention it
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 03:14 AM
Jan 2014

While I have no adverse effects from cannabis, whiskey makes me mean as the devil. This is shocking to those around me, as I am most certainly a loving, happy-go-lucky guy.

But no, it's the grass that's dangerous.

 

Coyotl

(15,262 posts)
40. O.K., who put the PCP in Patrick's pot?
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 01:46 AM
Jan 2014
"just overall a very dangerous drug"

In which case, we better take the laughing gas away from the dentists too, because that drug really kills people.

TroglodyteScholar

(5,477 posts)
42. No matter what he wants to say...
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 03:02 AM
Jan 2014

...I'm pretty sure I'm waaay fucking smarter than Patrick Kennedy.

So put that in your pipe and smoke it....

dionysus

(26,467 posts)
56. the cloud would be over the tailgating section of the parking lot.
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 12:42 PM
Jan 2014

in the Bills stadium, you get kicked out for smoking a cig in the stands. they even got rid of the outdoor smoking section.

however, the game is at Giants stadium, not "Mile High" (hee hee), stadium...

Response to Jesus Malverde (Original post)

 

LordGlenconner

(1,348 posts)
55. Who funds SAM?
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 12:30 PM
Jan 2014

Smart Approaches to Marijuana.


Hmmm.

Dollars to donuts there are ties to either the alcohol industry, the tobacco industry or big pharma.

Jesus Malverde

(10,274 posts)
62. Looking at their propaganda you see references to big alcohol and big tobacco taking over mj.
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 01:15 PM
Jan 2014

They also say that inhaled or consumed cannabis is not medicine, that cannabis can be made into medicine by pharma.

They also recommend treatment for everyone. In their world you get arrested and go to rehab.

It seems likely they are in the pockets of the medical lobby. The org was started by a doctor.

They could also just be framed in a way to maintain the status quo.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
58. Living an easy and privileged life evidently has expedited Kennedy's psychosis
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 12:58 PM
Jan 2014

that normal people now know that marijuana is mostly harmless. Even the POTUS said so recently. THAT causes Patrick to lose sleep at night, because HIS addiction to booze and drugs the affluent have access to, comes into question. MJ harmless? Not if we play guilt by association games.

IOW, focus on the drugs that are not personally destroying your life - to make you feel better about avoiding your own addictions.

PassingFair

(22,434 posts)
59. He better steer clear of COFFEE then...MAJOR gateway drug.
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 01:03 PM
Jan 2014

Just because his last name is Kennedy doesn't mean he knows
his butt from a hole in the ground.

mainer

(12,022 posts)
61. Statements like this make me wonder which drug cartel is propping them up
Wed Jan 22, 2014, 01:09 PM
Jan 2014

How much money are they getting from criminal drug gangs wanting to keep pot illegal?

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