Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

eissa

(4,238 posts)
Mon Mar 19, 2012, 04:38 PM Mar 2012

Lynndie England: Lives of detainees are better than hers

Honestly, I pity her. A young, impressionable woman with absolutely no concept of the outside world who was thrust into a war zone and taken advantage of by a superior. I don't excuse her behavior at all, but blame the system that preys on people like her.

"Today, the former soldier who became the callous, “thumbs-up” emblem of the Abu Ghraib scandal lives with her parents in rural West Virginia, raising the son of the man who perpetrated the worst of the torture at the Iraqi prison. Things are so rough for her, Lynndie England told The Daily in a wide-ranging interview, that she has trouble finding much reason to feel bad for the detainees she and her colleagues abused.

“Their lives are better. They got the better end of the deal,” England said. “They weren’t innocent. They’re trying to kill us, and you want me to apologize to them? It’s like saying sorry to the enemy.”

England grew up in the backwaters of Appalachia and despite earning good marks in high school, she was hell-bent on escaping what she saw as a life destined to be behind the cash register of the local IGA supermarket. So she joined the Army.

Now 29, England is back in her parents’ home. She is virtually unemployable and haunted by her past. Charles Graner, her former lover and the ringleader of the Abu Ghraib abuses, refuses to acknowledge his 7-year-old son despite a 2009 paternity test proving he is the father. “Graner didn’t want anything to do with the baby,” England said.



http://www.thedaily.com/page/2012/03/19/031912-news-lynndie-england-1-4/?utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&utm_campaign=cheatsheet_afternoon&cid=newsletter%3Bemail%3Bcheatsheet_afternoon&utm_term=Cheat+Sheet

25 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Lynndie England: Lives of detainees are better than hers (Original Post) eissa Mar 2012 OP
No sympathy. Matariki Mar 2012 #1
She can eat shit. JVS Mar 2012 #2
. . .and bring her own fork for that. DinahMoeHum Mar 2012 #16
boo hoo AtomicKitten Mar 2012 #3
Ooh, I love that picture and caption. Thegonagle Mar 2012 #7
boo hoo frogmarch Mar 2012 #4
Perhaps, then, she would be willing to trade places with one of them. cbayer Mar 2012 #5
' England said her role in the Abu Ghraib disaster has been redeemed because it gave her a son. ... Demit Mar 2012 #6
I might feel sorry for her if she ever says one thing slightly redemptive. Thegonagle Mar 2012 #8
You got somebody waterboarding you these days, Lynndie? tanyev Mar 2012 #9
So she "...has trouble finding much reason xxqqqzme Mar 2012 #10
While I agree that she doesn't deserve sympathy eissa Mar 2012 #11
Snort Solly Mack Mar 2012 #12
She should change her name legally, and murielm99 Mar 2012 #13
I remember Joe Beagant DonCoquixote Mar 2012 #14
Joe B was spot-on, though, in his assessment of her. . . DinahMoeHum Mar 2012 #18
I find no joy in the misery of others Comatose Sphagetti Mar 2012 #15
Why, again, is she so miserable!!!! Tikki Mar 2012 #19
Pity? Maybe a little. But very little. TheWraith Mar 2012 #17
Not holdin' out a lot of hope for that kid to be anything but a piece of shit either then. alphafemale Mar 2012 #20
The child played no role in the events at that prison. davsand Mar 2012 #22
I hold no hope for him because of what he's being raised by alphafemale Mar 2012 #23
One, two, three, AWWWWWWW!!!!! KamaAina Mar 2012 #21
She had me up until "They're trying to kill us" Canuckistanian Mar 2012 #24
That sociopathic POS can rot in hell all I care. Fuck her. Odin2005 Mar 2012 #25

Thegonagle

(806 posts)
7. Ooh, I love that picture and caption.
Mon Mar 19, 2012, 04:49 PM
Mar 2012

Especially since I can easily imagine Joe Biden saying those exact words.

cbayer

(146,218 posts)
5. Perhaps, then, she would be willing to trade places with one of them.
Mon Mar 19, 2012, 04:46 PM
Mar 2012

Guantanamo or living with her parents and child in West Virginia?

 

Demit

(11,238 posts)
6. ' England said her role in the Abu Ghraib disaster has been redeemed because it gave her a son. ...
Mon Mar 19, 2012, 04:48 PM
Mar 2012

“If I say I regret getting with Graner then I say that I regret Carter. And I don’t,” she said. “I wouldn’t give up Carter for anything. And if going through that whole ordeal is what was supposed to happen to me to have Carter then that’s how some things are.” '


I do not pity her. She's had 8 years to reflect on what she was a part of and she hasn't learned a damned thing.

xxqqqzme

(14,887 posts)
10. So she "...has trouble finding much reason
Mon Mar 19, 2012, 05:00 PM
Mar 2012

to feel bad for the detainees she and her colleagues abused...."?

“Their lives are better. They got the better end of the deal,”



Well then England "... then that’s how some things are....”

eissa

(4,238 posts)
11. While I agree that she doesn't deserve sympathy
Mon Mar 19, 2012, 05:02 PM
Mar 2012

I feel like the military fails these kids. They go into these "target-rich" areas, like the backwoods of W. Virginia, and lure these kids in. Then drop them into regions they couldn't find on a map, let alone have any knowledge of, and instruct them to kill AND "win hearts and minds." The higher-ups create the monsters and then when something like this happens, say "well, golly gee, how the fuck did that happen? must be a bad apple."

murielm99

(30,741 posts)
13. She should change her name legally, and
Mon Mar 19, 2012, 05:19 PM
Mar 2012

go live in another part of the country. It might be tough, but it could work out for her.

Maybe some counseling would help, too. She needs to take responsibility for her actions, even if they are somewhat mitigated by the fact that she was exploited herself. She was exploited by Graner, and the military. It does not excuse what she did. But she was used.

DonCoquixote

(13,616 posts)
14. I remember Joe Beagant
Mon Mar 19, 2012, 05:19 PM
Mar 2012

Attacking anyone that cirticized her, saying she was just another poor white who was pressed too hard.

http://www.joebageant.com/joe/2004/06/mash_note_for_t.html

Well, I have a problem with that. Yes, these poor white kids grew up poor, though I will bet hard cash all of them feel superior to the black people around them. Yes, looking at them does show that as big as the race issue is, class is bigger, and that many people do not get the support they need and deserve as human beings, much les as American Citizens.

But frankly me dear, there were many, many people poorer than Lyddie that did not choose to do something THEY KNEW WAS WRONG!!!

And it is apparent that she still does not give a fuck, and would do it all again.

Lyddie my dear, the only regret I have about you is that you did not dangle from the end of a gallows, and I do not mean the one used on Saddam, I mean the sort of good old fashioned type they used to use on soliders that decided to commit atrocities. I humbly offer this as an example for what they should have done to you!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danny_Deever

And the solider's of ol kipling's day had it harder than you ever did, honey.

DinahMoeHum

(21,788 posts)
18. Joe B was spot-on, though, in his assessment of her. . .
Mon Mar 19, 2012, 07:19 PM
Mar 2012

. . .and how she was going to ultimately end up, Abu Ghraib incident or not.

That essay of his marked the first time I ever heard of him, and I will always remember it for this sentence:

If you are doomed to eat shit, you may as well bring your own fork.

http://www.joebageant.com/joe/2004/06/mash_note_for_t.html

TheWraith

(24,331 posts)
17. Pity? Maybe a little. But very little.
Mon Mar 19, 2012, 07:17 PM
Mar 2012

Frankly there are a lot of people in the same position who have done a hell of a lot less to earn it.

 

alphafemale

(18,497 posts)
20. Not holdin' out a lot of hope for that kid to be anything but a piece of shit either then.
Mon Mar 19, 2012, 07:43 PM
Mar 2012

Stupid little white ass playing the victim. Pathetic.

davsand

(13,421 posts)
22. The child played no role in the events at that prison.
Mon Mar 19, 2012, 08:23 PM
Mar 2012

I feel a lot of sympathy for that kid. While I share your lack of optimism for his future--given his mother's issues--I do feel sorry for him. It isn't like he made that choice, yet he's gonna suffer along with her.




Laura

 

alphafemale

(18,497 posts)
23. I hold no hope for him because of what he's being raised by
Mon Mar 19, 2012, 08:33 PM
Mar 2012

He's being raised as a white victim. Not much hope of life success there.

The blacks and the gays and the Hispanics and the Martians stole any chance for him to succeed will be the message drummed into his head.

Canuckistanian

(42,290 posts)
24. She had me up until "They're trying to kill us"
Mon Mar 19, 2012, 08:50 PM
Mar 2012

You wanted to kill them, didn't you, you vengeful minx?

Honestly, the thing that will spell the end of the American experiment is not external enemies, but internal IGNORANCE of the world around you.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Lynndie England: Lives of...