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cthulu2016

(10,960 posts)
Sat Feb 15, 2014, 05:58 PM Feb 2014

Well, it looks like I was Wrong about the Dunn jury

I really thought the lesser charges in the Dunn trial would prove more challenging than the primary charge.

That said... this makes no sense at all because there ought to be unanimity on some lesser included... manslaughter... something. (A person voting for 1st degree would also find the elements of lesser homicides)

Which suggests a juror who will not find any wrongful death in the primary charge... which requires a self defense finding... which means that the lessers would be acquittals...

If any juror finds this to be a self defense case, as defined in law, then they are, in fact, an insane racist.

Unlike the Zimmerman case, a self defense finding here would be a nullification of the law as written, not a controversial application of the law as written.

The Dunn case would, in a more sane world, be a textbook law school example of how self defense in not a state of mind determination, since it is legally irrelevant (to self defense) whether the defendant thought there was a gun, but rather whether a reasonable person would have thought there was a gun, with the level of certainty a reasonable person would require to open fire.

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Well, it looks like I was Wrong about the Dunn jury (Original Post) cthulu2016 Feb 2014 OP
Yeah People With Guns! SoCalMusicLover Feb 2014 #1
If they convict on a lesser included charge exboyfil Feb 2014 #2
not necessarily TorchTheWitch Feb 2014 #3

exboyfil

(17,863 posts)
2. If they convict on a lesser included charge
Sat Feb 15, 2014, 06:50 PM
Feb 2014

Can the prosecution go back for Murder later? It would be tough to stomach that he was negligent and not a hot blooded intentional killer.

TorchTheWitch

(11,065 posts)
3. not necessarily
Sat Feb 15, 2014, 07:07 PM
Feb 2014

They could be arguing the premeditation between Murder 1 and Murder 2 with some solidly for Murder 1 and some solidly not. I think the premeditation aspect has been the most difficult thing for the jury, and I find it difficult myself especially since the prosecution didn't really hammer on the premeditation aspect during the trial. Though I personally believe it was premeditated and had nothing to do with being threatened in any justifiable way I can see a jury not being able to wrap their heads around premeditation.

I've thought all along that it was going to be the premeditation aspect that was going to be the most difficult for the jury even with legal instructions that warrant it. The more I think about it the more I think it was a mistake to charge Murder 1 in the first place especially when the prosecution never really said much of anything about that.

I don't see the jury here acquitting on the murder charges when they can agree to lesser included charges. They'll hang the jury before they acquit him on the charges concerning Davis. And after watching the video of the judge and attorneys having a long discussion about how to answer the self-defense questions it seems that the questions were because the instructions were confusing and had to do with the charges concerning the surviving boys especially seeing as after those questions were answered they came back with having come to agreement on all the charges concerning the surviving boys.



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