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freshwest

(53,661 posts)
3. The last I heard about Maduro and Panama was when he objected to the ship being searched for weapons
Thu Mar 6, 2014, 01:11 AM
Mar 2014
going through the canal. There is a treaty permitting this and he didn't like it. The ship was coming or going to China or North Korea. Can't swear to which one.

I can only speculate that this is the cause of the rift. The story was here on DU and he was angry at the USA about it. Possible they searched another Venezuelan cargo ship looking for some proscribed weaponry.

Unless tt's that, I have no clue. I'll bet Panama charges well for ships going through the Canal. Maybe he's balking at the amount of money. But like the situation in the Black Sea is for Russia, Venezuela needs that Canal.

I thought another canal was planned farther south through Central America. Hope that someone will come through with a better answer.

Just guessing.

 

smokey775

(228 posts)
4. He's pissed off that Panama asked the OAS to look at what's going on in Venezuela.
Thu Mar 6, 2014, 01:25 AM
Mar 2014
Chavez's successor, President Nicolas Maduro, angrily announced that he would break off relations with Panama, which he accused of being a "lackey" of the U.S. in a conspiracy to topple his government through the daily protests that have left at least 18 dead since mid-February.

Maduro said he made the move because Panama asked for the Organization of American States to study the situation in Venezuela. Maduro considers the OAS to be dominated by Washington.

"We don't accept the interventionism of anyone, because our international policy is a policy of peace, of cooperation, of respect, of the anti-imperialist Latin American union," Maduro said.


http://news.yahoo.com/venezuelans-mourn-chavez-protests-dont-break-022342017.html

He's acting like a fucking brat.

freshwest

(53,661 posts)
9. Well, you answered the question well. The headquarters of the OAS is in Washington, D.C.
Thu Mar 6, 2014, 02:11 AM
Mar 2014

I see why he takes umbrage, it's purely ideological:

OAS or Organization of American States

Status of Cuba:


Cuban relations with the Organization of American States

The current government of Cuba was excluded from participation in the Organization under a decision adopted by the Eighth Meeting of Consultation in Punta del Este, Uruguay, on 31 January 1962. The vote was passed by 14 in favor, with one against (Cuba) and six abstentions (Argentina, Bolivia, Brazil, Chile, Ecuador, and Mexico). The operative part of the resolution reads as follows:

1. That adherence by any member of the Organization of American States to Marxism-Leninism is incompatible with the inter-American system and the alignment of such a government with the communist bloc breaks the unity and solidarity of the continent.
2. That the present Government of Cuba, which has officially identified itself as a Marxist-Leninist government, was incompatible with the principles and objectives of the inter-American system.
3. That this incompatibility excluded the present Government of Cuba from participation in the inter-American system.[10]


This meant that the Cuban nation was still technically a member state, but that the current government was denied the right of representation and attendance at meetings and of participation in activities. The OAS's position was that although Cuba's participation was suspended, its obligations under the Charter, the American Declaration of the Rights and Duties of Man, etc. still hold: for instance, the Inter-American Commission on Human Rights continued to publish reports on Cuba's human rights situation and to hear individual cases involving Cuban nationals. However, this stance was occasionally questioned by other individual member states.

Cuba's position was stated in an official note sent to the Organization "merely as a courtesy" by Minister of Foreign Affairs Dr. Raúl Roa on 4 November 1964: "Cuba was arbitrarily excluded... The Organization of American States has no juridical, factual, or moral jurisdiction, nor competence, over a state which it has illegally deprived of its rights."[11]

The reincorporation of Cuba as an active member regularly arose as a topic within the inter-American system – for instance, it was intimated by the outgoing ambassador of Mexico in 1998[12] – but most observers did not see it as a serious possibility while the present government remained in power. Since 1960, the Cuban administration had repeatedly characterized the OAS as the "Ministry of Colonies" of the United States of America.[13][14] On 6 May 2005, President Fidel Castro reiterated that the island nation would not "be part of a disgraceful institution that has only humiliated the honor of Latin American nations".[15] After Fidel Castro's recent retirement and the ascent of his brother Raúl to power, this official position was reasserted. Venezuelan President Hugo Chávez promised to veto any final declaration of the 2009 Summit of the Americas due to Cuba's exclusion.[16]

On 17 April 2009, after a "trading of warm words" between the administrations of U.S. President Barack Obama and Cuban leader Raúl Castro, OAS Secretary General José Miguel Insulza said he would ask the 2009 General Assembly to annul the 1962 resolution excluding Cuba.[17]

On 3 June 2009, foreign ministers assembled in San Pedro Sula, Honduras, for the OAS's 39th General Assembly, passed a vote to lift Cuba's suspension from the OAS. The United States had been pressuring the OAS for weeks to condition Cuba's readmission to the continental group on democratic principles and commitment to human rights. Ecuador's Foreign Minister Fander Falconí said there will be no such conditions. "This is a new proposal, it has no conditions—of any kind," Falconí said. "That suspension was made in the Cold War, in the language of the Cold War. What we have done here is fix a historic error."[18] The suspension was lifted at the end of the General Assembly, but, to be readmitted to the Organization, Cuba will need to comply with all the treaties signed by the Member States, including the Inter-American Democratic Charter of 2001...[19]


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organization_of_American_States

Venezuela is also a member of OAS, and may find itself in the same predictament as Cuba, because of political ideology. Personally, I think that is not a good thing, but it is the policy of the OAS. And I would not go low to characterize Maduro as a brat.

Personal comments have been used against Obama by the far right in this country, and I do not appreciate them as they have led to disrespect for civil society and are the language of our RWNJ demangogues. That people may select different political systems is their right, even if we don't like it.

But Maduro screwed up in Venezuela by not dealing with corruption. There would be no issue with him by the people of his own country if he had fulfilled his duties. Does he have an obstructionist group in his country like we have with the GOP?

I don't know, and at this point, no longer care. You cannot gun people down and have the right to complain others don't like it. There is a long history in SA of colonialism, slaughter of the native peoples and exploitation by a combination of foriegn and native business interests that have kept the people impoverished.

I don't hold to the idea that what is going on in those countries is solely within the power of the USA. There are oligarchs in every nation. We have the Koches, for example. Venezuela, Russia, Ukraine, Europe and virtually every country have theirs. After a while, they are invisible to the public but they have their own interests they will protect.

Thanks very much for your information on this thread. I hope that Venezuela will stop the bleeding and get back to a state of civil society no matter who ends up in charge.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
5. That was a ship from Cuba.
Thu Mar 6, 2014, 01:27 AM
Mar 2014

The man-child is doing this because he's desperately in search of enemies to blame for VN's problems.

freshwest

(53,661 posts)
6. Okay, that was a ship from Cuba? Who did the complaining? I thought this was about the same time
Thu Mar 6, 2014, 01:43 AM
Mar 2014

Snowden was doing his world tour and no one seemed to know where he was. There was the planeload of reporters who whined about a lack of alcohol or didn't like the quality of the drinks on the plane. So that was not Maduro complaining? TIA, since you remember it better.

MADem

(135,425 posts)
10. He's now accusing the Panamanians of "conspiring against him." Paranoia strikes deep.
Thu Mar 6, 2014, 07:41 AM
Mar 2014

Everyone is arrayed against him! The USA! Panama! The entire OAS!!! It has nothing to do with his incompetent leadership, of course.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-26461530


Last week, the government of Panama requested an urgent meeting of OAS member-states to discuss the unrest in Venezuela.

Venezuelans have long been complaining about high levels of crime, record inflation and shortages of some staple items.

But in the last three weeks marches initially started by disgruntled students in the western states of Tachira and Merida spread to other areas and gained support.

On Wednesday, the OAS said a meeting would take place the next day behind closed doors to decide whether or not to convene the region's foreign ministers over the issue.

Mr Maduro accused the Panamanian government of conspiring to bring down his government....The Venezuelan president also criticised OAS President Jose Miguel Insulza, who had suggested earlier that a group of observers could be sent to Venezuela – if its government and the opposition found it useful.

freshwest

(53,661 posts)
15. I doubt Panama can bring down his government. He needs to quit talking to the world and talk to his
Thu Mar 6, 2014, 01:59 PM
Mar 2014
citizens instead. Oscar, Moscar.

Panama, OAS, these are all about words. Proper actions in Venezuela will overcome his problems, not looking to what the world thinks of him.

JMHO.

COLGATE4

(14,732 posts)
11. Thanks. That makes sense. BTW, there has always
Thu Mar 6, 2014, 09:14 AM
Mar 2014

been a dream of a canal through Nicaragua. In fact, when the canal was being planned Nicaragua was the first choice but supporters of the canal in Panama raised phony objections about earthquakes in Nicaragua so Nicaragua was discounted in favor of Panama. There has recently been talk about a second canal through Colombia but it has never come to much.

 

msanthrope

(37,549 posts)
13. It was an attempt at wit, I think. Maduro, a homophobic bigot, is routinely
Thu Mar 6, 2014, 09:45 AM
Mar 2014

lauded here. But he's no St. Hugo so the repartee tends to have an awkward and sad feel to it.

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