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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsHere's what I don't get about the Treyvon Martin murder
When listening to the 911 tapes we clearly hear the dispatcher ask Zimmerman if he is following Treyvon Martin. When Zimmerman answers that yes he is the dispatcher clearly responds saying, "We don't need you to do that".
The police departments I have been familiar with over the years police dispatchers are police officers with the full rights and authority of any police officer. So when the dispatcher tells Zimmerman that, "We don't need you to do that", to me that's a direct command from a police officer for Zimmerman to not do something. Clearly Zimmerman ignores the command and we end up with another dead black kid. Would seem to me that Zimmerman's refusal to following a valid police command resulted in the unnecessary death of one Treyvon Martin.
That's not to mention that the Florida "Stand Your Ground" law seems to mean that you do not have to run away from a combative situation but it doesn't say it is the Stand Your Ground and Pursue if You Feel Like Doing So law.
Junkdrawer
(27,993 posts)I hear the Police Chief is a piece of work. The dispatcher sounds sane.
shraby
(21,946 posts)LisaL
(44,974 posts)He didn't break any laws by not following what 911 operator told him.
Skip_In_Boulder
(1,841 posts)ProgressiveProfessor
(22,144 posts)Life Long Dem
(8,582 posts)Deep13
(39,154 posts)It shows he was advancing and instigating the violence, not standing his ground or in any way defending himself. Even under the SYG rule, this is a pretty clear case of premeditated murder.
ProgressiveProfessor
(22,144 posts)Last edited Fri Mar 23, 2012, 08:12 PM - Edit history (1)
Been even longer since dispatchers were. They may be under the direction of an LEO. Any discussion has no direct legal authority.
That said, it is something for the jury to consider when it comes to state of mind and motive.
Skip_In_Boulder
(1,841 posts)that if George Zimmerman had of discontinued his pursuit of Treyvon that Treyvon would still be alive today.
oldhippie
(3,249 posts)As do the overwelming majority of my somewhat conservative, gun toting, second amendment loving friends in my pistol club here in Texas. Not one person I have talked with defends the asshole following and confronting the kid. If Zimmerman were here we would be looking for a rope.
Skip_In_Boulder
(1,841 posts)Dispatchers are special trained civilians with no powers of arrest.
At one time, officers on our department who were injured on duty worked in dispatch, but it became a union issue and the practice was stopped. Some departments may still allow that, but it would be the exception.
Source(s):
Law enforcement since 1991
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100829215806AAheTDs
Which corresponds with my understanding of them being police officers as it has been many years since I have had any knowledge of the inner workings of a police department.
X_Digger
(18,585 posts)I had a college roommate in Virginia who worked as an operator part time.
He quit after 6 months. You would not BELIEVE the burn-out rate in that job.
Skip_In_Boulder
(1,841 posts)It's not a job I would wish on anyone and most of the 911 tapes I have ever heard demonstrate they do a really good job of it. Like on this tape the operator is pretty sane and rational.
X_Digger
(18,585 posts)oldhippie
(3,249 posts)... "We don't need you to do that", as a "direct command." It's not. It's a declarative sentence, advisory in nature at best. A direct command would be something like "Don't do that!" It's a language. Words and grammar mean things.
And in my considerable experience with 911 operators and dispatchers, they are not sworn officers and have no police authority whatsoever. It may be different somewhere.
Having said that, I still think Zimmerman is responsible for this whole sorry episode. He was the aggressor and disregarded advice at best. He had no business being within shooting range of the kid, much less arms reach. I hope he burns in hell (after a long prison sentence.)
Skip_In_Boulder
(1,841 posts)"I don't want you to do something", it would be O.K. for them to do that because you had not pointedly stated, "Don't do that"?
oldhippie
(3,249 posts)You are in authority over your children. A 911 dispatcher is not in authority over a citizen (unless someone can show me otherwise.)
And "I don't want you to ......" is different than "I don't need you to .....". Words mean things.
Smart parents would say "Don't do that." Prtetty simple and unambiguous.
X_Digger
(18,585 posts)In jurisdictions I'm familiar with, they're city / county employees, but no more police officers than the clerk who takes your money for a parking ticket.
My guess is that Sanford's is the same- notice that the operator didn't 'order' Zimmerman.
Quick search reveals things like this..
[div class='excerpt']The Communications Bureau is part of the Support Division and is the Public Safety Answering Point (PSAP) for the City of Greenville. Thirty-one civilian employees
(And let's not get into how cops think of non-cops as 'civilians'- that's another discussion altogether!)
Skip_In_Boulder
(1,841 posts)But that was a long time ago and after doing a little more digging it appears that may not be the case anymore. But I still think this is pertinent in this case and as someone pointed out on this thread it goes to Zimmerman's state of mind and I would even say his intent.
X_Digger
(18,585 posts)Cass
(2,600 posts)ground law because he was the one being harassed and pursued by a nut with a gun. This situation is seriously messed up.
It is ripping my heart out when I think of what happened to Trayvon and the PD just blowing it off like it was no big deal and being ok with letting Zimmerman walk. Damn it all. I can't wrap my mind around this injustice.