but, you are correct. And now,

. . . which, to many voters in the heartland, brands him as barely American, sadly enough.

I've rarely, except maybe once or twice, seen comments/OPs critical of the Senator. If you have more, please share. and thanks

If it's Bernie, then it's Bernie.

despite what DU says Sanders has little chance of winning a national election ... and no chance, if he doesn't change his party affiliation. Sanders would pull most of the progressive vote ... some of the libertarian progressive vote ... some of the Democratic vote; but lose most of the independent vote and all of the uniformed American vote ... which dwarfs the previous 4 voting blocks.

Why are so many Dems under the delusion that independents only vote for right wingers?

That's why.

Did you see the latest PEW Survey (regarding Millennials)?

The 2010 midterms were lost largely because of Obama shifting to the right instead of standing up to them. This right wing nonsense is destroying the Democratic party and the country.

sounding like the fox news clowns that spewed about unskewed polls?

Because Obama's hard shift to the right after being elected drove away the youth vote.

Yeah, I sound like FOX news...uhuh, sure, if you say so.

is shooting the messenger. Those are the facts. Live in a land of delusion - it makes no difference to me.

...and the Democratic party is almost as right wing. It makes no difference to me.

No difference between the parties. Blah, blah, blah.

It's called, "The Third Way®"

I'm sure you have heard of it.

rebuttal to those frustrating little thing called facts ... call tripe and offer supposition!

Okay ... Now I'm convinced!

don't bother voting, regardless of skin color, things don't go so well.

and I suspect you know that.

To rehash:

it becomes 'tripe'.

I posted what the survey stated ... white independents are that right wing cohort that you claim they are not.

"...time after time. When the Democratic candidate allows himself to be put on the defensive and starts apologizing for the New Deal and the fair Deal, and says he really doesn't believe in them, he is sure to lose. The people don't want a phony Democrat. If it's a choice between a genuine Republican, and a Republican in Democratic clothing, the people will choose the genuine article, every time; that is, they will take a Republican before they will a phony Democrat, and I don't want any phony Democratic candidates in this campaign." - Harry S. Truman

Act like a Republican and you are sure to lose elections.

that is similarly unresponsive to the challenge of your claim that independents are not right wingers. But argue the strawman because that is all you have.

Peace.

has anything to do with the fact that the Republican party would not exist without large numbers of white voters.

Knows that a Democrat who acts like a Republican scares away voters.

I know that fact is inconvenient, but it is a fact none the less.

endlessly about how the Dem party has "drifted to the right". If according to you and a few others, if people so despise Dems that act like Repubs, how could that have happened?

And your "point" still has absolutely nothing to do with the facts that 1SBM posted. His posts contained facts, not quotes and rhetoric.

Have a good night!

of Congress, which extends to both parties (though Republicans do fare a bit worse than Democrats). The public saw gridlock inside the Beltway last Fall and it pissed them off. That could work in Bernie's favor.

I'm hearing crickets from the choir so far.

are Republicans. Given a choice between a "Dem" candidate who supports chained CPI and a "socialist" who doesn't... I'd be worried if I were the "Dem".

If you don't think "socialist" is a dirty word to most of the American electorate, you haven't been paying attention, I'm afraid.

unless they listen to hate radio and watch Fox News. What I have seen is a lot of people who feel that neither party is doing a good job of representing them, and the things they want are the things Sanders advocates.

Become a Democrat and give the GOP hell!!

Like Warren, they are treasures where they are. Not every Progressive has to be a trotted out as a candidate or run for President.

I think she would beat the pants off of any republican that she faces and have her defeated opponent looking for another country to run for office in, ala Scott Brown looking for another state to run in.

populist PTB. Is the Dem Primary/Country ready for a Real Progressive, is the issue. With Hillary and Jeb right now ... seems like same-old/same-old. Boring and depressing, to be sure.

But if Bernie ran, I would vote for him.

The DEM Machine doesn't want Bernie, so he won't get the support nor the money of the DEM Big Wigs.

They want Hillary, I believe.

Thanks for your opinion.

Most excellent point !

See you then.

Which is how Dubya got his sorry ass in the WH in 2000.

by having his running mate's duck hunting buddy on the US Supreme Court step in and push to reverse the Florida State Supreme Court's decision to conduct a statewide recount, among other things.

Gore got more than a half million votes more than Dubya did nationwide, even with Florida's skewed results.

I am of the opposite opinion, and think Mr. Sanders actually has a mainstream popular appeal.

So take that into consideration.

But this is pathetic... Even they won't fall for it.

but all they would have to do is call him a socialist and he would lose so many votes!! IMHO.

If I recall correctly it was "He's a great guy with good ideas but Americans just aren't ready yet for a black man in the White House. Making him the nominee will push centrist whites to the Republicans."


Don't count out Bernie so soon.

Give the people a real choice and let's see what happens.

Instead of a choice between the lesser of two evils.

"People who said that X would not win were wrong, therefor people who say that y will not win are wrong" is not logic.

Besides, the overwhelmingly vast majority of times practically everyone has agreed that a candidate could not win, they haven't.

I merely pointed out that people CAN be wrong about a candidate, not that the Bernie haters WERE wrong.

You, however, do a great job of contributing to the self-fulfilling prophecy that a Progressive can't win.

Pound the drums loud enough and shout at the top of your lungs that a Progressive wouldn't get elected dog catcher and voting for one will give us PRESIDENT TED CRUZ!!!! OMG!!!

We need a real choice instead of a pre-fabbed, pre-anointed candidate.

I think Sanders would make a perfectly good president if he won an election, it's just obvious he has no chance whatsoever of doing so.

The prophecy that Sanders (not "a progressive" - I think any left-wing candidate is going to have a hard time winning, but not all are obviously doomed the way Sanders is) is unelectable is not "self-fullfilling", it's just obvious. Sanders can't win if we say he can't, and he also couldn't win no matter how loudly you shout that he could.

What will lead to president Cruz is the dems picking someone who can't win.

Here are just two examples -


links:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024586432


http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024598940

Or perhaps I should say this election cycle.

In 2007, everyone said that we had to vote for Hillary because she was the only candidate with a chance. We heard time and again how we were throwing the election by nominating a black man. For some reason, we did it anyway. And despite the doom and gloom predictions during the entire year of 2007, we nominated a Black Man anyway.

And get this, we managed to win the General Election, twice.

Now it's starting even earlier, the inevitability of Hillary. If we nominate anyone else, we'll be handing the election to Ted Cruz. Which is interesting since Rand Paul won the CPAC poll by a significant margin. How about this, I'm going to donate and support the candidate I feel is best.

I think DESERVES it, certainly not to one who thinks SHE is OWED it.

This is a pretty balsy, if highly misguided OP.

Gasp! The REPUBLICANS wouldn't LIKE HIM!!

Yeah, lets just keep electing Dems who push us further and further into fascism. Jeez.

Lets just stay the course

Move along, nothing to see here.....

I'd vote for Bernie any day!

The American people poll dead on with Bernie on every important issue. That makes Bernie a centrist.

We should never allow politically motivated propagandists to tell us what a centrist is.

which I don't see happening.

have been president if elected in the primaries.DU isn't really a very good gauge for who the most likely presidential candidate will be. There may come a day that this country swings to the left enough to vote for Sanders but I just don't see it anytime soon.

It sure is predictable and interesting to see who chimes in to agree with you. A collection of conservative DUs whose policy views and agendas have failed repeatedly.

Sanders would not have a chance in Texas. Hillary Clinton could win Texas. Hillary Clinton could help Wendy Davis win Texas whole Sanders would be of no help in Texas

She would surely win Florida and possibly take Georgia and Kentucky.

If the GOP loses Texas, they can get to 270 electoral votes

That's usually what happens historically. I would support Bernie in a heartbeat, however election time the Dem always gets my vote. Quit dissing the far left, you need us.

...if the Republicans pick the candidate they seem likely to pick, the odds will favor continued Democratic control.

I don't think we will see another republican President in 30 years.

like start a war with Russia?

The only one I see giving us trouble is Jeb Bush. Everyone else is a goddamn joke.

Then he was "elected".

2000 because of Democratic voters who thought they knew more than anyone else. We will always have Reagan Democrats, forget those assholes unless the vote wisely. What we can't have in 2016 is voters voting "Nader" when they should fucking understand the unappealing consequences of such a vote.

He will have a similar problem as Dennis Kucinich had. He doesn't have the broad name recognition required to win primaries in states outside of a small group near his own, and maybe not even in those. He can run, but primary voters will not choose him, except perhaps in his own state. And even that's not certain.

The Presidential race is not about politics as much as it is about emotions. Since it's a national race, and the only actual national race, it has different parameters for a successful candidate than statewide or district-wide races. It's about big appearances and recognition.

While Sanders can reiterate the "Change" idea that got Obama elected, I don't think his personal charisma has the qualities that Obama's had in the 2008 race. Rather, he's likely to be misunderstood, as Dennis Kucinich has always been.

I'd love to have Sanders as President. I would have liked to have Kucinich as President. But, neither has the personal qualities that go into a successful Presidential candidate.

Unfortunate, that is.

ok.

[hr][font color="blue"][center]I'm always right. When I'm wrong I admit it.
So then I'm right about being wrong.[/center][/font][hr]

For example, the race in NC. If tillis loses...

A fantasy world is continuing to elect Third Way Party candidates and expecting that they will take the necessary steps to employ desperately needed solutions to the myriad of very serious problems human beings face as a nation and a planet.

They don't and they won't. They play for the other team, the team that has 1% and $$$ logos on their uniforms

I will vote to nominate Senator Sanders or Senator Warren if either of them decides to run for President as a Democrat, and if they are nominated, I will work to get them elected 24/7.

A US President has limited freedom under our Constitution. Yes, Executive Orders can be done, but those orders can be issued under strictly prescribed conditions. The key is the 2014 Midterms, our side need to get busy and win State Houses, US House and Senate races to retake the House and hold the Senate. If republicans hold the House, take the Senate and hold critical State Houses, our side will HAVE to win the White House in 2016 to avoid a generational disaster.

especially if he had a name like Barack Obama. Remember?

So who would sit out or not vote if Bernie Sanders was the nominee? Would it be the progressives? The moderates? The conservative blue dogs?

But those same voters would demand that you vote for their choice.

the Majority of the American Public on the ISSUES.
I want to see Bernie run a real LEFT campaign and win on the issues with LONG coat tales.

The I want to see all the faux democrats have to deal with a real liberal agenda.

with working class southerners and get more of them to vote for their economic self interest. I prefer Clinton and if she doesn't run, Warren because I think both will run more organized campaigns than Sanders would run - but I love that Sanders has the view that working class southerners can be brought to the right voting decision, we can win without them, but if we are to get the country working at it's best, we need to bring more southerners on-board.

That the only way Bernie can stand a chance is if he wins the Democratic nomination, and right now the odds don't favor that

From a policy perspective he is my ideal candidate - he doesn't mince words, he speaks truth to power, uses fact-based analysis and has compassion for his fellow man. Senator Warren is on the same page as Senator Sanders.

I will support Hillary if she pursues the office and will vote for her but she is far from being my ideal candidate. First of all she carries the baggage of the Clinton Presidency. Don't get me wrong I admire Bill and Hillary Clinton and know they did some good things - certainly better than Bush Senior or Dole. But he supported NAFTA, signed DOMA into law and other policy decisions with which I seriously disagree.

Hillary is very much a corporatist. She would continue to pursue economic policies that benefit corporations and the 1%. She would be very good on social issues such as women's rights, choice, LGBT equality, etc. but not sure how engaged she would be on important issues such as immigration reform and poverty. The ACA would be well served with her in the White House.

I am really looking for a fresh face, preferably someone younger, who comes with some "fire in the belly", solid progressive credentials, someone who could possibly inspire a younger generation. I thought Obama would do that but after the initial shine wore off on his election, his quiet, methodical style has hurt his ability to connect with many Americans. I still have much admiration for him, voted for him twice and think he was a godsend after 8 years of Cheney/Bush.

Good thing people didn't say this about Obama six years ago.

.... so it is pretty hard to predict what they would do if they were. Frankly, poll after poll shows that Americans by and large are way way WAY to the left of their "leaders".

the left and socialism is EEEEEVVVILLLLLLL

anything that questions the violence of Capitalism needs shut down hard.

red state southerners. I like his populous character. I think Clinton is our best choice by far, but if Clinton doesn't run, I want to see Warren run. My only concern about Warren is whether she can spread her well thought-out policy populism deep into the South, I do know that Warren is a fighter who will take the fight to her republican opponent, I like that in a Democratic politician.

until the he has got a chance in hell of being the Democratic nominee. Kids starting learning about politics instead of speculating what if, what can or maybe's.

...then they shouldn't nominate a thirdway fake Democrat.

to have him as prez, but let's face it -- he would need to take money from special interests which i don't think he would do.

Why don't you let the primaries happen, before you tell people who they are or aren't allowed to support. That's why we have primaries.