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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsNeil deGrasse Tyson Under Attack from Christians Who Want More Biblical Creationism on His Show
http://www.alternet.org/belief/neil-degrasse-tyson-under-attack-christians-who-want-more-biblical-creationism-his-showConservative Christians are really mad about the reboot of the legendary science series Cosmos, starring Neil deGrasse Tyson. The complaint? That an ancient myth about creation invented by Hebrews thousands of years ago is not being included in a show that is there to teach science. Christian conservatives have been taking to the airwaves complaining about the non-inclusion of ancient myths in a science program, with Danny Faulkner of Answers in Genesis whining, Creationists arent even on the radar screen for them, and Elizabeth Mitchell of the same organization decrying the show for having blind faith in evolution. (Shes just straight up lying here. Evolution is well-established by evidence, something Cosmos covers in its second episode.)
While its tempting to laugh off the idea that a creation myth should be injected into what is supposed to be a science program, maybe its not as zany as it initially seems. After all, anthropology is a science, and a creation myth segment could be a great way to introduce the way scientists study ancient cultures. But theres no reason it has to be the one in the Bible, which everyone knows already. Theres been thousands of creation stories throughout time, so in the interest of fair-and-balanced, why not given one of these others a chance? Here are some potential creation stories, and the pros and cons for telling each one.
1. The ancient Greeks. Chaos, a goddess who also happens to be the entire universe, gave birth to Gaia, the Earth, and Uranus, the sky. Brother and sister married and gave birth to a bunch of Titans. One of those Titans, named Cronus, had a bad habit of eating his children, but Gaia was able to hide one of those babies, named Zeus, away from him. Zeus wife managed to get Cronus to barf up all his eaten children, and those children ended up, alongside Zeus, defeating their father in battle to become the Greek gods we all know and love. The invention of people is something of an afterthought in this legend, but a big deal is made out of how one gentle Titan, Prometheus, gave the people fire. This irritated Zeus, because he just really didnt like people for some reason, and so he chained Prometheus to a mountain and made a bird steal his liver on the daily. He then punished people for fire-stealing by giving them a woman named Pandora who opened a box that released sin into the world.
Pros: The image of the sky copulating with the earth is pretty cool. The animations you could come up with for Cronus vomiting up his children would also be entertaining.
Cons: Just as with the story of Eve and the apple, this is a misogynist creation myth that blames all the misery and sin in the world on women.
2. Ancient Japanese creation myth. The gods, kicking around in the formlessness of space, decided to stir Earth into being so they had something to occupy their time. Two of them, a man and woman, do this little stirring dance-like routine, but the lady steps on the mans lines, speaking before he does. This causes their babies to be rejects they have to throw out. So the couple redoes their little stirring routine and she acts more submissive this time around. Female submission, being magic, means that this time around, she is way better at producing usable children. Those children end up being a bunch of islands, because Japan, as you know, is a bunch of islands.
Pros: Many creation myths show the gods copulating the world into being, but few really spend much time on their pre-child dating life. This story has the appeal of a rom-com, complete with a dance scene.
Cons: Misogyny, just like in the Bible and the Greek creation myth. For some reason, men the world over were fond of making up creation stories that concluded with a lesson about how women are always screwing things up and therefore should not be allowed to have power.
Cirque du So-What
(25,977 posts)NDT would have to use that incredible space/time vessel of the imagination to explore such a tiny segment of micro-time.
On the other hand, comprehensive coverage of all the ways that religion has hindered science over the centuries would take several episodes.
VWolf
(3,944 posts)there was a monk named Georg Cantor who, among many other contributions, gave us a way to measure the "size" of infinities (cardinality) and constructed the first fractal (the Cantor set). Of course, that's math, not science, and the fact he was a monk is pretty much inconsequential.
I like that NdGT mentions how some of the earlier scientists were religious, but they didn't let their religion cloud their scientific judgment (eg, the episode on comets). Kind of a slap in the face to today's fundies, dontcha think?
wryter2000
(46,081 posts)for his scientific heresy, which later turned out to be true.
Math's science, no?
VWolf
(3,944 posts)Math > Science
But that's just me.
WaitWut
(71 posts)Science without Math is Religion.
I still didn't pass that exam.
wryter2000
(46,081 posts)a mere psychologist.
Let's not forget Gregor Mendel, although he did fudge some of his data. Plus, many of the early naturalists, including Darwin, justified their study of nature as a way to understand the Creator. When J. B. S. Haldane was asked what he'd learned about God from studying nature, he answered that God had "an inordinate fondness for beetles."
jmondine
(1,649 posts)[link:|
mountain grammy
(26,648 posts)rgbecker
(4,834 posts)How about storks, leprechauns, and please, more devil talk. Always good graphics.
LuvNewcastle
(16,856 posts)FreepFryer
(7,077 posts)cap
(7,170 posts)Buddhist, Hindu, Jewish, Muslim, or Wiccan, etc. etc. how do we know the Christian story is valid compared to any one of these?
Part of the Catholic Church is teaching the new cosmology which incorporates scientific evolution as part of the word of God and strongly agrees with the science in cosmos. So do conservative Christians want to start arguing with Catholics ?
florida08
(4,106 posts)It's "his" show. They have Pat Robertson
hobbit709
(41,694 posts)and that's not even counting the cable channels.
Wounded Bear
(58,706 posts)They get plenty of air time. It's not rational peoples' fault they don't get 'popular' support.
RoccoR5955
(12,471 posts)In their own special hell!
This is a show about SCIENCE, not their damn mythology!
eShirl
(18,503 posts)creation myths from many religions and cultures
lunasun
(21,646 posts)The interviews in the first 5 episodes were filmed at George Lucas's Skywalker Ranch in California, with the 6th interview conducted at the American Museum of Natural History in New York, during the final two summers of Campbell's life (the series was broadcast on television a year after his death). In these discussions, Campbell presents his ideas about comparative mythology and the ongoing role of myth in human society. These talks include excerpts from Campbell's seminal work The Hero with a Thousand Faces.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Power_of_Myth
If this was broadcast as the result of their petition for equal time on creationism they 'd get an education at least
Wounded Bear
(58,706 posts)Campbell is pretty good at pointing out the myriad other myths. The Christo-fascists on the hard right think only one is the 'true' story.
Nanjing to Seoul
(2,088 posts)class. screw them and take your medieval hocus pocus with you.
TNNurse
(6,929 posts)Something else they are welcome to do that. I do not like what they say on Fox News so I simply to not choose to view it. I also do not care much for professional sports so I rarely watch that.
Remind them that they are not in charge of the content of TV, movies, books and many other parts of our lives. Their egos have become massive. If they were only as concerned for the welfare of little children, the elderly, the mentally ill and the disadvantaged, they could do some really good work.
mulsh
(2,959 posts)I'm surprised at the posters who feel this sort of grandstanding, publicity stunt should be taken seriously. The best thing is to ignore these publicity hounds and their ludicrous demands. The few brief mentions of things like creation myths are more than enough recognition of the christo-taliban/carnival barker position for a show who's focus is on presenting scientific facts as we know them.
hatrack
(59,592 posts)Having spent decades playing radio and TV bumper cars swerving around Bott Radio Network and the Hour of Power and the 700 Club and all the other outlets these money-grubbers use as digital shears to fleece their flocks, I know personally that it can be done.
yuiyoshida
(41,861 posts)that some day, they might get their wish.
spanone
(135,874 posts)Heidi
(58,237 posts)KittyWampus
(55,894 posts)While Neil is my new tv boyfriend (sorry, Steve Colbert), his show is WAY over-produced.
Wounded Bear
(58,706 posts)It's more of a populist show, so the fact that the actual science is 'dumbed' down a little to make it more attractive to the masses is a good thing IMHO.
At a time when science and rationality itself is under attack, NdGT is a breath of fresh air. Frankly, I think it captures the tone of the original fairly well. Carl Sagan was, after all, a populist when it came to science, in that he wanted to attract more people to it.
exboyfil
(17,865 posts)I am watching the same episode of Sagan's Cosmos immediately after watching Tyson's. Sagan's episode is 15 minutes longer, and, while he does some speculation, Sagan does not spend so much time with it. Also the interactive special effects (such as the ship of the imagination) takes much less time in Sagan's version. Finally Sagan talks more about the actual science and technology showing models and doing a masterful job explaining it. Finally the continued homages to Sagan and his interaction with Tyson is a little creepy (I will give a pass with the first episode). Tyson should be telling viewers to just go watch the original show - it holds up very well. In 30 years we might be watching it when the next Cosmos is produced instead of Tyson's.
I think Tyson's audience must be middle school, while Sagan was high school. What I want to see from Tyson's show, what I expected to see were the amazing things that have been found and seen since Sagan's time. Shoemaker-Levy, Rovers, Human Genome, Tiktaalik, dinosaur/bird transitional fossils, Higgs, etc.
Vashta Nerada
(3,922 posts)Maybe I should demand that more science should be implemented on those crappy Sunday morning church worship shows.
truebrit71
(20,805 posts)...but really, I don't mean that...those idiot, regressive fucktards should just STFU and GTFO...
csziggy
(34,137 posts)Every Sunday in their sermons!
See how simple that would be?
JustAnotherGen
(31,881 posts)To me - it's like Charlie Daniels going to Jay Z and demanding he start performing "The South's Gonna Do It Again" at all of his performances.
Not gonna happen.
Nope.
He's not gonna do it.
deGrasse needs to tell them to go hang and get bent.
madashelltoo
(1,699 posts)He's a damned scientist. The creation story has been told for over 2,000 years. If you haven't sold it by now . . . Hang it up.
alp227
(32,052 posts)But are against:
the Fairness Doctrine that would keep right wing bias on talk radio in check
The ACA contraceptives provision that Hobby Lobby is so against
Duck Dynasty having a gay or atheist cast member in theory "for balance"
what entitled narcissists.
SomethingFishy
(4,876 posts)the guy went to town on "Creationists". Look up Sunday's episode, Tyson explains how long it takes light to travel through the Universe and how that right there kills the legitimacy of any "creation science".
They can hem and haw all they want, their mythology will never be taught by Tyson as an alternative to science.
caraher
(6,279 posts)Creationism is in his cross-hairs!
Initech
(100,102 posts)How many science channels do they have? One or two? I would say the fundamentalists have enough programming. Do they not watch it? Leave Cosmos alone!
Bad Thoughts
(2,531 posts)Archae
(46,345 posts)Three reasons.
1. Science is difficult.
And Evolution is one of the most difficult sciences to understand.
Creationism is easy.
"Gawd dun it!"
2. Fear.
Science says we could all be wiped out, and there isn't a damn thing would could do about it.
Look at the dinosaurs.
Religion says "Gawd made the whole world just for me!"
3. Money.
Ken Ham didn't have his "museum" built, and then let the public in for free.
He charges a hefty fee for the "privilege" of being preached to.