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It's scary that anyone would believe this bullshit.. Even scarier that people voted for this idiot.. (Original Post) Playinghardball Apr 2014 OP
There was no image when I first viewed the thread. I see it now. Don't know why it did not show up lostincalifornia Apr 2014 #1
What "substance" are you looking for? Ohio Joe Apr 2014 #4
Post removed Post removed Apr 2014 #10
This message was self-deleted by its author lostincalifornia Apr 2014 #49
When I saw the post there was no body in the message, now it has something lostincalifornia Apr 2014 #46
ahhh... I have seen posts where the pics do not show up... My apologies... Ohio Joe Apr 2014 #51
No problem. I was only trying to tell the OP that I didn't see any content. I should have just lostincalifornia Apr 2014 #53
That just happened to me on this post too. JimDandy Apr 2014 #96
Interesting lostincalifornia Apr 2014 #97
He is half right, remember the conservation of Energy happyslug Apr 2014 #89
Everything you need to have a discussion is in the OP. Rex Apr 2014 #44
Well, he might. GoneOffShore Apr 2014 #47
For one reason or another the image did not show on my computer. But please,pile on. Assume the lostincalifornia Apr 2014 #52
I would say "welcome to DU", but you've been here, so you should know what to expect. 7962 Apr 2014 #80
or worse JackInGreen Apr 2014 #83
Ok, I'm over it lostincalifornia Apr 2014 #91
Thanks, I am not falling apart lostincalifornia Apr 2014 #90
Yep, and some days on DU it's RKP5637 Apr 2014 #101
If the population of China were to all fart at the same time... nikto Apr 2014 #82
Only if everyone was sulphurdunn Apr 2014 #85
Only if they ignited them. HubertHeaver Apr 2014 #100
Sounds like a new doomsday weapon nikto Apr 2014 #107
It made complete sense to me. notadmblnd Apr 2014 #54
That is because I did not see the embedded image when I first looked at the OP. I see it now though lostincalifornia Apr 2014 #55
It did not show up for me initially, either. I had to wait for the image to load. A DU glitch? freshwest Apr 2014 #105
Jesus on a pogo stick, where do these buffoons come from? The Velveteen Ocelot Apr 2014 #2
Barton's rambling full-length comment is absurd. And he has a degree in industrial engineering. John1956PA Apr 2014 #8
A degree in industrial engineering? From what university? Aristus Apr 2014 #17
Neander U, home of the clubbin' Cromags Scootaloo Apr 2014 #28
... Aristus Apr 2014 #34
Agreed Iwillnevergiveup Apr 2014 #98
Do you suggest GeoWilliam750 Apr 2014 #73
Bizarrely NewJeffCT Apr 2014 #75
I have known some people with MBAs that were utter idiots. Thor_MN Apr 2014 #84
Now I get it! VA_Jill Apr 2014 #20
Let me give you an advice Hutzpa Apr 2014 #24
So rickyhall Apr 2014 #29
In all fairness, it was his much more recent experience of working with monkeys that influenced his okaawhatever Apr 2014 #37
Bonzo did his best to educate Reagan about politics, but I can't see he was successful. NT Jerry442 Apr 2014 #39
Perhaps he got treated by Faith Healers for his heart attack and diabetes. nt Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2014 #72
I think being a buffoon is a lifestyle choice rurallib Apr 2014 #11
Oil interests are paying big money for that buffoon siligut Apr 2014 #67
Where do they come from - Surprise!!! - From Texas dem in texas Apr 2014 #38
You do realize he is correct, right? philosslayer Apr 2014 #41
Philoslayer, are you saying Barton is correct? irisblue Apr 2014 #56
See Post #40 philosslayer Apr 2014 #63
No, he isn't. Wind is not a finite resource. The Velveteen Ocelot Apr 2014 #71
Infinitesimally correct, but why play the oligarchy's profit-centric game for them? Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2014 #78
I don't for a gottafly Apr 2014 #70
And harnessing solar energy would confiscate radiation? Zambero Apr 2014 #3
Good grief, don't give him and more hairbrained ideas!! n/t Stonepounder Apr 2014 #14
The uninformed voting for the uninformed Rider3 Apr 2014 #5
Another idiot that Texas has inflicted on the nation. TexasTowelie Apr 2014 #6
The scary thing is, he actually sounds smart compared to some of the Texas Delegation. Fuddnik Apr 2014 #26
Can't help but notice ... Cheviteau Apr 2014 #36
Isn't he the one.... cynzke Apr 2014 #66
Yes, he did apologize to BP. TexasTowelie Apr 2014 #87
And said that it was the responsibility of the taxpayers to clean up and cover BP's loses. DhhD Apr 2014 #92
It's very discouraging that people like this are at the highest ... dawg Apr 2014 #7
It's embarrassing is what it is. giftedgirl77 Apr 2014 #13
I live in a fairly republican area Cosmocat Apr 2014 #50
OMG Tsiyu Apr 2014 #9
Aynd huk't awn fonix, two! riqster Apr 2014 #16
Did any other member of the committee give him an argument at the time? Demoiselle Apr 2014 #12
Are you assuming that committe members who were not in front of a camera were: merrily Apr 2014 #23
I think every politician should be tested to be a licensed politician .... MindMover Apr 2014 #15
"WHY NOT POLITICIANS..." merrily Apr 2014 #25
Gee, why didn't we put up those wind slowing thingies long ago? merrily Apr 2014 #18
Is this the same morAn that said the Internet is a bunch of tubes? MoonRiver Apr 2014 #19
Not that I can remember Hutzpa Apr 2014 #22
Yes, the quote is from Alaska Senator Ted Stevens..... A HERETIC I AM Apr 2014 #30
Thanks Hutzpa Apr 2014 #33
Ted Stevens! MoonRiver Apr 2014 #31
As we evolve Hutzpa Apr 2014 #21
It's scary that anyone would believe this bullshit.. Even scarier that people voted for this idiot. The CCC Apr 2014 #27
Welcome to DU, The CCC! calimary Apr 2014 #86
It should be noted that Barton said that almost 5 years ago. A HERETIC I AM Apr 2014 #32
he was still wrong in 2009. nt irisblue Apr 2014 #57
He got more than his fair share of Neandertal genes. ErikJ Apr 2014 #35
"This is not a monkey court" but there are some roots in truth IronLionZion Apr 2014 #40
And a butterfly can begin a hurricane. But wind is NOT a finite resource and ErikJ Apr 2014 #43
Great stats, food for thought, thanks. toby jo Apr 2014 #48
The more energy sources the cheaper it gets, supply and demand. ErikJ Apr 2014 #58
They control the supply, and they don't want anything to reduce demand IronLionZion Apr 2014 #61
So the problem with the statement sunnystarr Apr 2014 #111
The global effects are probably negligible, but the local effects are probably significant IronLionZion Apr 2014 #113
This thread is a bit embarrassing.... philosslayer Apr 2014 #42
Online forums can be embarassing IronLionZion Apr 2014 #60
It's embarrassing to those who stand on one technicality and miss the boat. Bernardo de La Paz Apr 2014 #77
+1 nt F4lconF16 Apr 2014 #88
Its a bit more local IronLionZion Apr 2014 #95
Hank Johnson has some competition now. egduj Apr 2014 #45
I'll bet Joe Barton is full of enough hot air to provide plenty of energy. mountain grammy Apr 2014 #59
Let me guess, this same asshat denies climate change and thinks oil will last forever. liberal N proud Apr 2014 #62
Exactly. AverageJoe90 Apr 2014 #74
That's nothing npk Apr 2014 #64
Looks like someone failed Science class Mrdrboi Apr 2014 #65
yes I believe it. krakfiend Apr 2014 #68
E-40 should tell him when to go, Jamaal510 Apr 2014 #69
I thought this was bull pucky until I did a little research..... Swede Atlanta Apr 2014 #76
Hmmm. stage left Apr 2014 #79
In his case intelligence is a finite resource. YOHABLO Apr 2014 #81
fire in the hole father founding Apr 2014 #93
thanks for reminding me about this particular tidbit of utter stupidity. certainly niyad Apr 2014 #94
So Barton admits human actions can change the temperature of the Earth? n/t JoeyT Apr 2014 #99
As an American average citzen of average age fairly well read and educated, raised with enough bkanderson76 Apr 2014 #102
Holy shit. That clown must ingest a lot of cocktails to come up with such ridiculous material. nt valerief Apr 2014 #103
Texas fundies LOVE Joe Barton mississippi62 Apr 2014 #104
It's called brainwashing... n/t doxydad Apr 2014 #108
After listening to this panel discussion, I'm on the fence with this... yawnmaster Apr 2014 #106
Texas wind energy has proved him wrong. mc51tc Apr 2014 #109
OMg~~ yuiyoshida Apr 2014 #110
Wind Mills!! bleedinglib Apr 2014 #112
Republican Sen., TX Joe Barton, must be one of the smarter Republican Senators vkkv Apr 2014 #114

lostincalifornia

(3,639 posts)
1. There was no image when I first viewed the thread. I see it now. Don't know why it did not show up
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 11:47 AM
Apr 2014

Last edited Wed Apr 16, 2014, 02:21 PM - Edit history (1)

Initially

Ohio Joe

(21,756 posts)
4. What "substance" are you looking for?
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:00 PM
Apr 2014

"2. That said, Barton has used the threat of global warming to combat something he hates even more: wind energy. In a 2009 hearing, Barton implied that wind is a "finite resource" and that harnessing it would "slow the winds down" which would "cause the temperature to go up.""

http://content.time.com/time/politics/article/0,8599,1997963,00.html

There are even more simply wrong and stupid things said by this moron at the link.

Response to Ohio Joe (Reply #4)

Response to Post removed (Reply #10)

Ohio Joe

(21,756 posts)
51. ahhh... I have seen posts where the pics do not show up... My apologies...
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 02:16 PM
Apr 2014

I jumped to an unwarranted conclusion, I am sorry.

lostincalifornia

(3,639 posts)
53. No problem. I was only trying to tell the OP that I didn't see any content. I should have just
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 02:19 PM
Apr 2014

Should have Made it that clearer

Images are showing, I don't know what happen.


Thanks

JimDandy

(7,318 posts)
96. That just happened to me on this post too.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 10:01 PM
Apr 2014

It showed up after about 10 seconds while reading the thread.

 

happyslug

(14,779 posts)
89. He is half right, remember the conservation of Energy
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 08:08 PM
Apr 2014

If you transform one type of energy (wind) to another type of Energy (electricity), the first form of energy no longer exists. i.e it is now electrical power. Thus wind is a "Finite" source, sooner or later if you have enough wind mills, the wind will stop blowing for if a gust does pick up, the wind mills will absorb that energy and convert it to electricity.

A lack of wind, permit ground temperature to accelerate thus you would have increase heat (but that increase heat will provide the energy that pushes air and causes wind).

We tend to forget the wind currents are driven by the cold of the arctic and Antarctic interacting with the hear of the tropics. Air wants to be the same temperature as possible and thus cold air is pulled in the direction of hot air, and hot air is driven in the direction of cold air.

In fact one of the fears of Global Warming is that if the ice caps ever disappear, you would have a more uniform world wide temperature, thus killing the wind currents.

This is the problem with most Anti-Global warming advocates, they rely on science when it supports they side, but ignore it when it is against them. Thus they are often half right.

 

Rex

(65,616 posts)
44. Everything you need to have a discussion is in the OP.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 01:56 PM
Apr 2014

What? You believe in finite wind or something?

lostincalifornia

(3,639 posts)
52. For one reason or another the image did not show on my computer. But please,pile on. Assume the
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 02:17 PM
Apr 2014

Worst. Geez

 

7962

(11,841 posts)
80. I would say "welcome to DU", but you've been here, so you should know what to expect.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 06:35 PM
Apr 2014

Remember, its just like an 8th grade hallway around here sometimes.

 

nikto

(3,284 posts)
82. If the population of China were to all fart at the same time...
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 06:58 PM
Apr 2014

Would it cause a typhoon?


Or are farts finite?

 

sulphurdunn

(6,891 posts)
85. Only if everyone was
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 07:09 PM
Apr 2014

was facing the same way and mooning the so-called Communist Party when they cut loose.

HubertHeaver

(2,522 posts)
100. Only if they ignited them.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 10:36 PM
Apr 2014

If they are all facing the same direction it could cause axis problems...if done at night, could probably be seen from outer space...

lostincalifornia

(3,639 posts)
55. That is because I did not see the embedded image when I first looked at the OP. I see it now though
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 02:24 PM
Apr 2014

and edited my post accordingly

freshwest

(53,661 posts)
105. It did not show up for me initially, either. I had to wait for the image to load. A DU glitch?
Thu Apr 17, 2014, 02:53 AM
Apr 2014
There are some that never show up from Twitter. Have to be signed in with them and DU simultaneously to make them show up, or so I'm told.

But what a great message. The Idiocracy will soon be upon us, and it ain't pretty.

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,706 posts)
2. Jesus on a pogo stick, where do these buffoons come from?
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 11:53 AM
Apr 2014

"Wind is a finite resource and harnessing would slow the wind down which would cause the temperature to go up."

Maybe a somewhat dim third-grader might think that, but gawd almighty, this is a member of Congress? Shouldn't there be some kind of minimum knowledge requirement for a person to run for public office? Have candidates pass some high-school civics and science tests, at least?

John1956PA

(2,654 posts)
8. Barton's rambling full-length comment is absurd. And he has a degree in industrial engineering.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:06 PM
Apr 2014

I read the Wikipedia page about him to get the full version of his rambling comment about how harnessing the wind may cause it to stop. I do not care to repeat that nonsense here.

Also, he referred to the Genesis flood story in stating his opinion on the Keystone pipeline.

The Wikipedia page indicates that he has a medical history of diabetes and a heart attack. It would be kind to suggest that his physical illness contributed to his ridiculous statement that harnessing the wind may diminish it.

Aristus

(66,379 posts)
17. A degree in industrial engineering? From what university?
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:29 PM
Apr 2014

A school where stacking one block on top of another without the structure collapsing earns one a satisfactory grade?

This smells like the stink that wafts out from anti-education states...

 

Scootaloo

(25,699 posts)
28. Neander U, home of the clubbin' Cromags
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:48 PM
Apr 2014

He took Professor Ogg Smackrock's class, where he learned the physics behind pointy sticks, hitting big rocks with bigger rocks, and farting into campfires.

NewJeffCT

(56,828 posts)
75. Bizarrely
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 05:31 PM
Apr 2014

He got his undergraduate degree from Texas A&M, and a master's degree from Purdue. He's obviously regressed quite a bit since those days.

 

Thor_MN

(11,843 posts)
84. I have known some people with MBAs that were utter idiots.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 07:09 PM
Apr 2014

My conclusion is that the only thing that can stop one from getting the diploma is your ability to write a check that clears. I don't man to say all with MBAs are idiots, just that there are MBA programs that lack the ability to screen out morons.

VA_Jill

(9,975 posts)
20. Now I get it!
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:34 PM
Apr 2014

He thinks wind is a finite resource because his industrial engineering classes taught him that when you turn a fan off, the breeze stops!

Hutzpa

(11,461 posts)
24. Let me give you an advice
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:43 PM
Apr 2014

Wiki page is the last place to go to read on someone, especially now were we see every tom, dick and harry with a computer
has figured out a way to manipulate the site.

okaawhatever

(9,462 posts)
37. In all fairness, it was his much more recent experience of working with monkeys that influenced his
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 01:16 PM
Apr 2014

policies.

rurallib

(62,416 posts)
11. I think being a buffoon is a lifestyle choice
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:11 PM
Apr 2014

I don't believe many are born that ignorant. It is something they have decided to pursue with great vigor.
A person can not become that stupid without a lot of effort to totally ignore all that goes on around you.

siligut

(12,272 posts)
67. Oil interests are paying big money for that buffoon
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 03:54 PM
Apr 2014

His statement only demonstrates how stupid and/or powerless he believes others to be.

dem in texas

(2,674 posts)
38. Where do they come from - Surprise!!! - From Texas
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 01:29 PM
Apr 2014

We are on overload in the production political fools and overload for the stupids who vote for them.

irisblue

(32,975 posts)
56. Philoslayer, are you saying Barton is correct?
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 02:25 PM
Apr 2014

that wind is finite resource? Or DeGrasse is correct. Please clarify that for me.

The Velveteen Ocelot

(115,706 posts)
71. No, he isn't. Wind is not a finite resource.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 04:44 PM
Apr 2014

Post #40 says wind speed may be reduced in the locality of wind turbines but that doesn't mean wind is a finite resource, nor does it mean that any resulting small, local temperature change has anything to do with global climate change. There would have to be wind turbines on every square mile of the earth for them to make any significant difference in overall wind speeds and tempertures. He seems to be interpreting this information as meaning you should not use wind turbines to "harness the wind." Wind is not a finite resource; it's a complex phenomenon caused by variations in temperature across large areas. If anything, it's becoming windier lately because of rapid and unusual temperature variations. This knucklehead, a devout climate change denier, just doesn't want to use alternate energy sources (because, I don't know, maybe God?), and so has concluded wind turbines are bad because they will make the wind go away. He's the second stupidest guy in Congress after Louie Gohmert.

Bernardo de La Paz

(49,002 posts)
78. Infinitesimally correct, but why play the oligarchy's profit-centric game for them?
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 06:04 PM
Apr 2014

In the absence of any discussion of the all-important broader context, your bald statement is simply carrying the water for the oligarchy and to hell with our grandchildren.

See my post #77

gottafly

(12 posts)
70. I don't for a
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 04:26 PM
Apr 2014

minute think he believes that. Typical GOP though, pandering to the ignorance of the Pubbie base...

TexasTowelie

(112,204 posts)
6. Another idiot that Texas has inflicted on the nation.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:02 PM
Apr 2014

I am ashamed and apologize for what the stupid p.eople in my state have done.

Fuddnik

(8,846 posts)
26. The scary thing is, he actually sounds smart compared to some of the Texas Delegation.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:45 PM
Apr 2014

Louie Ghomert was a judge. And a Defense JAG attorney.

Cheviteau

(383 posts)
36. Can't help but notice ...
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 01:06 PM
Apr 2014

...the past tense in your comment. When he had to perform in front of people with intelligence he couldn't make it.

dawg

(10,624 posts)
7. It's very discouraging that people like this are at the highest ...
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:05 PM
Apr 2014

levels of power in this country. It's just a reflection of the electorate, I guess.

Cosmocat

(14,564 posts)
50. I live in a fairly republican area
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 02:16 PM
Apr 2014

and I know a lot of our local elected officials who are republicans, including judges.

Overwhelmingly good people, most are truly giving and decent people who I like a lot and interact with regularly on non-partisan civic matters.

People I like and respect.

They either completely swallow whatever bullshit the party sells or know it is nonsense and don't care.

It is truly bizarre.

To me, they are liberal in almost every way, kind, giving, accepting ...

But, they totally have swallowed the Obamacare meme, the evil liberal.

Sat in a meeting and a bunch of really good people started complaining about how hard it is to get mortgage now because of typical big, intrusive government.

Like, they totally missed out on what caused the collapse of the economy 6 years ago.

I don't get it, and I have stopped trying to get it.

Can't beat it ...

merrily

(45,251 posts)
23. Are you assuming that committe members who were not in front of a camera were:
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:40 PM
Apr 2014

1. In the building,

2. In the room,

3. Awake,

4. Paying attention

And

5. Smarter than this guy?





MindMover

(5,016 posts)
15. I think every politician should be tested to be a licensed politician ....
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:17 PM
Apr 2014

Everyone else has to be licensed and stamped and certified ...

WHY NOT POLITICIANS ...

merrily

(45,251 posts)
25. "WHY NOT POLITICIANS..."
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:43 PM
Apr 2014

Depressing, albeit correct, answer. Federal and state Constitutions set out all the criteria for our elected "representatives;" testing is not one of them and, at least as to the federal Constitution, we can't get out of our own way long enough to amend it.

merrily

(45,251 posts)
18. Gee, why didn't we put up those wind slowing thingies long ago?
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:31 PM
Apr 2014

We could have saved so many of the lives and homes lost to hurricanes.

Hutzpa

(11,461 posts)
22. Not that I can remember
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:37 PM
Apr 2014

but that moron you speak of met with an untimely death in a plane crash up in Alaska I think. I'm sure someone will correct me if I'm
wrong.

A HERETIC I AM

(24,368 posts)
30. Yes, the quote is from Alaska Senator Ted Stevens.....
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:51 PM
Apr 2014

who died in a plane crash in 2009.


From the Wikipedia page "Series of Tubes";

Partial text of Stevens' comments

“Ten movies streaming across that, that Internet, and what happens to your own personal Internet? I just the other day got… an Internet [that was] sent by my staff at 10 o'clock in the morning on Friday. I got it yesterday [Tuesday]. Why? Because it got tangled up with all these things going on the Internet commercially.

[…] They want to deliver vast amounts of information over the Internet. And again, the Internet is not something that you just dump something on. It's not a big truck. It's a series of tubes. And if you don't understand, those tubes can be filled and if they are filled, when you put your message in, it gets in line and it's going to be delayed by anyone that puts into that tube enormous amounts of material, enormous amounts of material.[5]

Hutzpa

(11,461 posts)
21. As we evolve
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:35 PM
Apr 2014

we are quickly finding out the reason why someone like Joe Barton got elected. The amount of shenanigans that these
guys get into is to put it mildly, just plain insane. Our fight with the rich should really be a fight against corrupt business
individuals and dealings, which I might add is not an easy fit to accomplish, because they have made it so convoluted
that federal agents are so disjointed in a way that you don't know who is working for or against progress.

So we end up with morons like this punk here speaking on issues he has no knowledge of, but just so we can see his
mouth moving with nothing but hot stinking air coming out of it.

The CCC

(463 posts)
27. It's scary that anyone would believe this bullshit.. Even scarier that people voted for this idiot.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:45 PM
Apr 2014

This man is not an idiot. He just knows the people who voted for him are.

calimary

(81,273 posts)
86. Welcome to DU, The CCC!
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 07:18 PM
Apr 2014

Glad you're here! I do disagree with you on one thing - I definitely do believe he is an idiot. And like attracts like. That's the best I can figure it. And when I look at certified ding-dongs like him, I find myself seriously questioning the sanity of the voters back home who saw fit to elevate this idiot to freakin' CONGRESS!!!! It's utterly shocking to me to consider brainless twits like him, and louie gohmert, being elevated to Congress. For crying out loud!!! And then to realize also that gohmert was a judge before he went to Washington. THIS dingbat was a JUDGE????? WHAT THE HELL??????

I'm sorry - but I find myself wondering what the hell is wrong with the voters who think these are worthy individuals to represent them in Congress. The fault lies squarely with THEM. What is it? Something in the water? Is it the dust-bowl leftovers in the air they breathe? WHAT THE HELL??????? You folks back there - you want THIS pathetic, shameful, anti-intellectual type of individual representing you? What does that say, then, about YOU? Answer - NOTHING good. They should by all rights be ashamed. But perhaps they're too dim a bunch of dim bulbs even to realize it.

A HERETIC I AM

(24,368 posts)
32. It should be noted that Barton said that almost 5 years ago.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 12:57 PM
Apr 2014

The quote is from a congressional hearing that took place in the late summer of 2009.

IronLionZion

(45,446 posts)
40. "This is not a monkey court" but there are some roots in truth
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 01:43 PM
Apr 2014
Wind turbines extract kinetic energy from the air around them, and since less energy makes for weaker winds, turbines do indeed make it less windy. Technically speaking, the climate zone right behind a turbine (or behind all the turbines on a wind farm) experiences what's called a "wind speed vacuum," or a "momentum deficit." In other words, the air slows down.

The effect has implications for wind-farm efficiency. Upwind turbines in a densely packed farm may weaken the breeze before it reaches the downwind ones. It could even have a more general impact. If wind farms were constructed on a truly massive scale, their cumulative momentum deficit could conceivably alter wind speeds on a global scale (though how winds would change is complex—they'd likely slow in places and speed up in others).

Wind farms can also affect the local temperature. According to Somnath Baidya Roy, an atmospheric scientist at the University of Illinois, as a breeze passes over a wind farm, the turbines create an atmospheric wake where wind speeds drop and turbulence increases. The rotors spawn a set of eddies that mix air from above with air from below. The eddies can lift cool air and sink warm air or vice-versa. That turbulence could raise or lower local temperatures. In a paper published in 2012, one group of researchers studied areas over several wind farms in Texas and found that local surface temperatures had risen by a small but significant amount.

http://www.popsci.com/science/article/2013-05/fyi-do-wind-farms-make-it-less-windy





“We found that when wind turbines are present, they slow down the outer rotation winds of a hurricane,” Jacobson said. “This feeds back to decrease wave height, which reduces movement of air toward the center of the hurricane, increasing the central pressure, which in turn slows the winds of the entire hurricane and dissipates it faster.”

The researchers found that 78,286 large wind turbines arrayed off the coast of New Orleans would have dropped Hurricane Katrina’s wind speeds by 81 miles per hour, and reduced storm surge by up to 71 percent. Covering most of the Gulf Coast with wind turbines (meaning over half a million individual turbines) slowed down a modeled Katrina even more (wind speeds by 90 mph and storm surge by 79 percent). The same area covered by half as many turbines would still cut storm surge by 63 percent. Hurricane Isaac would have lost up to 60 percent of its storm surge and 57 mph of wind speed. Their model of Hurricane Sandy found that 112,014 offshore turbines would cut wind speed by 80 mph and drop storm surge by 21 percent.

The purpose of a wind turbine is to transmit kinetic energy from wind into electrical energy used to power homes and businesses. The wind that comes out the backside of a wind farm has less energy than it did when it entered the array. And a recent study found that wind farms, even on a huge scale, do not affect the climate as some have claimed. And Archer and Jacobson said in 2012 that 4 million turbines spread around the world could generate half the world’s energy needs without interfering with atmospheric circulation too much.

http://thinkprogress.org/climate/2014/02/26/3332521/offshore-wind-turbines-slow-hurricanes/


Joe Barton is an idiot for many reasons. But not because of this. The energy comes from somewhere, which reduces the energy somewhere else. There are consequences to everything.

 

ErikJ

(6,335 posts)
43. And a butterfly can begin a hurricane. But wind is NOT a finite resource and
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 01:52 PM
Apr 2014

Last edited Wed Apr 16, 2014, 03:01 PM - Edit history (1)

turbines cant cause increase in global temperatures. That's "Jesus rode dinosaurs" Republican logic.
Wind isnt a finite resouce in the sense that we will never run out of it like fossil fuels.
And experts say that the midwest alone has enough wind energy potential to supply 15 times the electrical needs of America.

 

toby jo

(1,269 posts)
48. Great stats, food for thought, thanks.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 02:14 PM
Apr 2014

I'm still stuck on, "wind is a finite resource".

From what I can tell, wind is a result of a spinning earth and atmospheric conditions, (highs, lows, etc.).

I can't imagine us building enough turbines to stop it. His statement implies we will. Then this would be a guy who backs up everything carbon-based, the truly finite resources.

Our little local electrical co-op, running off the local coal plants, has a guy who does an editorial every month. Last months covered how we need coal, because it is cheap, and it is helping poor people around the world to lift themselves up out of poverty. He being of the type that gives a rats ass about the world's poor.

They pull hypocrisy out of their assholes when needed.

 

ErikJ

(6,335 posts)
58. The more energy sources the cheaper it gets, supply and demand.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 02:33 PM
Apr 2014

So I never understood that GOP logic.

IronLionZion

(45,446 posts)
61. They control the supply, and they don't want anything to reduce demand
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 02:42 PM
Apr 2014

"free market job creators" don't like competition.


sunnystarr

(2,638 posts)
111. So the problem with the statement
Thu Apr 17, 2014, 09:28 AM
Apr 2014

is that it's misleading. What he actually referred to is that the energy from wind turbines may be finite because once you reach the critical mass of turbines placed globally, you may affect global temperatures due to reduced wind. To which he should have added that this was an unproven theory.

IronLionZion

(45,446 posts)
113. The global effects are probably negligible, but the local effects are probably significant
Thu Apr 17, 2014, 11:08 AM
Apr 2014

My purpose in posting this info is that I wouldn't be too quick to dismiss something without studying the consequences.

I grew up with a small wind farm in my hometown. It really does affect weather patterns for rain/snow and the temperature in the immediate vicinity. And they are noisy as hell. Bigger wind farms in the midwest and Texas have much bigger impacts on the immediate vicinity and climate, so it is best for sparsely populated areas. I support wind energy.



 

philosslayer

(3,076 posts)
42. This thread is a bit embarrassing....
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 01:52 PM
Apr 2014

See post 40. He may be wrong 95% of the time, but on this particular topic his comments are basically correct.

IronLionZion

(45,446 posts)
60. Online forums can be embarassing
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 02:39 PM
Apr 2014

Whenever I see too many people agreeing on a conclusion too quickly, I seek out opposing points of view because I'm a rebel like that.


Bernardo de La Paz

(49,002 posts)
77. It's embarrassing to those who stand on one technicality and miss the boat.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 06:01 PM
Apr 2014

While it is true that in physics for every action there is a reaction and therefore technically the wind does slow down when it pushes on a a turbine blade, ... to insist on that point, especially without explaining it, and without discussing the context, is to miss the boat.

The amount the wind slows down is little, and even then only if there is a concentration of wind devices.

In the wider context of the world's weather and climate, the effect is negligible and possibly so small to be not measurable. There is so much wind all over the world that wind farms are not a factor.

As to whether slower wind makes the world infinitesimally warmer, I don't know, but on the face of it a case could be made for both sides. Faster wind could be more efficient transporting solar heated air around the world. On the other hand, at least locally, slightly more stagnant air may heat up more.

Once again, the effect will be negligible and perhaps too small to measure.

On the other hand, standing on the technicality gives aid and comfort to the oligarchy who are more concerned about their profits than our children and grandchildren.

IronLionZion

(45,446 posts)
95. Its a bit more local
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 09:37 PM
Apr 2014

Liberals think globally, but conservatives are thinking it may affect the breeze in their 7th beachside vacation home

liberal N proud

(60,334 posts)
62. Let me guess, this same asshat denies climate change and thinks oil will last forever.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 02:45 PM
Apr 2014

Who does he represent? Not the people of Texas, just the Oil Companies of Texas.



 

AverageJoe90

(10,745 posts)
74. Exactly.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 05:26 PM
Apr 2014

It could be denial, too: just look at how much solar power has advanced in just this past 5 years alone. The deniers are scared of losing their paymasters' profits and they know it.....

npk

(3,660 posts)
64. That's nothing
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 02:50 PM
Apr 2014

A friend of mine has built a device in his backyard that will suck up and collect all the wind. So all you poor bastards in Greenville SC are all going to be screwed once all the wind is gone. Ha Ha take that.

Mrdrboi

(110 posts)
65. Looks like someone failed Science class
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 03:05 PM
Apr 2014

How can someone think wind is finite? I feel my brain hurting after reading that.

krakfiend

(202 posts)
68. yes I believe it.
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 03:58 PM
Apr 2014

I live in fort worth, and I see idiots like this everyday. So I'm not surprised someone like joe Barton gets re-elected.

 

Swede Atlanta

(3,596 posts)
76. I thought this was bull pucky until I did a little research.....
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 05:38 PM
Apr 2014

I haven't had the time to do more exhaustive research and look for peer-reviewed studies into the matter but the concept that wind farms on a massive global scale could affect wind patterns and on some local level also affect temperature is not without some basis.

This is a short article from Popular Science from about a year ago....

http://www.popsci.com/science/article/2013-05/fyi-do-wind-farms-make-it-less-windy

I am not convinced that given the size of the earth and the strength of wind currents globally we are anywhere near having an impact on global wind currents or widely distributed temperatures.

I did find it interesting when I did some Googling that there are some scientists that believe that significant wind farms offshore such as in the Gulf of Mexico could significant weaken hurricanes. Again I am not confident of the science on this and wouldn't quote it but it is interesting.

niyad

(113,315 posts)
94. thanks for reminding me about this particular tidbit of utter stupidity. certainly
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 09:36 PM
Apr 2014

brightened my evening!

bkanderson76

(266 posts)
102. As an American average citzen of average age fairly well read and educated, raised with enough
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 10:57 PM
Apr 2014

dirt between my toes to combine with good common sense, I would tend to go out on a limb in saying it is truly a disturbing fact that people actually voted for this idiot......my two cents

mississippi62

(75 posts)
104. Texas fundies LOVE Joe Barton
Wed Apr 16, 2014, 11:12 PM
Apr 2014

I was shunned by some folks at a little fundamentalist church that I attended back in Texas because of this guy.

In early 90's, he ran against Kay Bailey Hutchison and Bob Krueger for the U.S. Senate seat that was vacated when Lloyd Bentsen became Secretary of the Treasury under Bill Clinton. My homeschooler friends were having wet dreams over Barton. Even in my Rush Limbaugh ditto-head days, I thought that Joe Barton was a wingnut. So I voted for Hutchison. She went on to win the election. Ted Cruz won that seat when Kay retired in 2012.

There were people in the church who would not speak to me afterwards. I don't know why I put up with that crap for so long...

bleedinglib

(212 posts)
112. Wind Mills!!
Thu Apr 17, 2014, 10:31 AM
Apr 2014

I grew up on a farm in southern Missouri & I remember we had 2 wind mills. well, we had to tear one down because there wasn't enough wind too turn them both!!

Barton might be from Missouri?

If we just harness the BS wind coming from the House of Reps. it would provide enough power for NY City.

 

vkkv

(3,384 posts)
114. Republican Sen., TX Joe Barton, must be one of the smarter Republican Senators
Thu Apr 17, 2014, 12:34 PM
Apr 2014

since he's the chair of the Energy Committee, right?

Wow.. just wow.. No wonder this country has problems... thank you ignorant Republicans.
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