Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Jesus Malverde

(10,274 posts)
Mon Apr 28, 2014, 12:01 PM Apr 2014

Pentagon to destroy $1B in ammunition

The Pentagon plans to destroy more than $1 billion worth of ammunition although some of those bullets and missiles could still be used by troops, according to the Pentagon and congressional sources.

It's impossible to know what portion of the arsenal slated for destruction — valued at $1.2 billion by the Pentagon — remains viable because the Defense Department's inventory systems can't share data effectively, according to a Government Accountability Office report obtained by USA TODAY.

The result: potential waste of unknown value.

"There is a huge opportunity to save millions, if not billions of dollars if the (Pentagon) can make some common-sense improvements to how it manages ammunition," said Sen. Tom Carper, D-Del., and chairman of the Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs Committee. "Despite years of effort, the Army, Navy and Air Force still don't have an efficient process for doing something as basic as sharing excess bullets. This Government Accountability Office (GAO) report clearly shows that our military's antiquated systems lead to millions of dollars in wasteful ammunition purchases."

The Army and Pentagon, in a statement, acknowledged "the need to automate the process" and will make it a priority in future budgets. In all, the Pentagon manages a stockpile of conventional ammunition worth $70 billion.

http://www.stripes.com/report-pentagon-to-destroy-1b-in-ammunition-1.280372

22 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Pentagon to destroy $1B in ammunition (Original Post) Jesus Malverde Apr 2014 OP
good G_j Apr 2014 #1
Give it to Homeland Security.. dixiegrrrrl Apr 2014 #2
To make it up the Pentagon will buy $4 billion of fresh ammunition Blue_Tires Apr 2014 #3
Having worked in procurement I can see how this could happen Recursion Apr 2014 #4
Of course they will madokie Apr 2014 #5
Shhhh don't tell our gun lovers here Bandit Apr 2014 #6
The Army makes a lot of its own small arms ammo jmowreader Apr 2014 #22
And if they sold the small arms ammo to civilians.. MicaelS Apr 2014 #7
If the bullets are past due nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #9
Not entirely accurate, the shelf life depends on how they are stored. Lurks Often Apr 2014 #11
Nadin, small arms ammunition has a very long shelf life. MicaelS Apr 2014 #12
I have no issue with recycling, but the point I made is still standing nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #14
I guess you're right. MicaelS Apr 2014 #15
Unfortunately that is the country we live in nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #19
"labially" ??? WTF? Do you not even proof read at all? Or do you post like that on purpose? Electric Monk Apr 2014 #16
More nits nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #17
Words mean things. Why use words if you're not paying attention to which words you are using? Electric Monk Apr 2014 #18
Alert away, nit away, go ahead nadinbrzezinski Apr 2014 #20
It would be more efficient to just burn huge pallets of cash. Comrade Grumpy Apr 2014 #8
No excuse for our federal government to be this inept and stupid seveneyes Apr 2014 #10
Good. It's a start. An insignificant one, but a start. Tierra_y_Libertad Apr 2014 #13
We found some pretty creative ways to waste ammo in the artillery. bluedigger Apr 2014 #21

dixiegrrrrl

(60,010 posts)
2. Give it to Homeland Security..
Mon Apr 28, 2014, 12:10 PM
Apr 2014

they have been buying millions of $$$ in ammo lately.

I am so damn happy I don't pay income taxes anymore.

Blue_Tires

(55,445 posts)
3. To make it up the Pentagon will buy $4 billion of fresh ammunition
Mon Apr 28, 2014, 12:11 PM
Apr 2014

which will still remain mostly unused and end up being discarded...

madokie

(51,076 posts)
5. Of course they will
Mon Apr 28, 2014, 12:17 PM
Apr 2014

A lot of the incentives is to funnel money to their ammunition making buddies to replace it. Plus I'd be pissed if I went into battle with half ass bullets. Hell now that I think about it I did go into battle with half ass weapons, M16. it was about as unreliable as a 1901 model T is today compared to a 2014 ford focus.

Bandit

(21,475 posts)
6. Shhhh don't tell our gun lovers here
Mon Apr 28, 2014, 12:48 PM
Apr 2014

Most believe the AR-15 is the best weapon ever created by mankind.

MicaelS

(8,747 posts)
7. And if they sold the small arms ammo to civilians..
Mon Apr 28, 2014, 01:18 PM
Apr 2014

The anti-gun people would be screaming they heads off.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
9. If the bullets are past due
Mon Apr 28, 2014, 02:04 PM
Apr 2014

they will not work. So that is opening themselves for labially. You knew that, but that is ok.

Yes, for those who have no idea about guns, bullets do have a shelf life

 

Lurks Often

(5,455 posts)
11. Not entirely accurate, the shelf life depends on how they are stored.
Mon Apr 28, 2014, 02:24 PM
Apr 2014

Dry, cool conditions ammo can last indefinitely; hot, wet conditions will cause deterioration of the ammo.

What happens with old ammo is the failure to fire (FTF) rate becomes too high to be acceptable for military or law enforcement use and it then has to be disposed of, either by selling it or destroying it. It remains perfectly acceptable for general target shooting or plinking.

However the real reason the Pentagon won't sell off that ammo as surplus is due to politics, not liability.

Military surplus ammo, both American and foreign made, has been available to American shooters for decades, although supplies have mostly dried up as the warehouses have been emptied out.

Greek 30-06 surplus: http://www.thecmp.org/Sales/ammo.htm

I have personally encountered Korean surplus, South African surplus, Bulgarian surplus, Swedish surplus, among others, that have been available on the US market in various calibers over the past 20 odd years.

MicaelS

(8,747 posts)
12. Nadin, small arms ammunition has a very long shelf life.
Mon Apr 28, 2014, 02:24 PM
Apr 2014

If, and that's a big if, it is properly stored. Now , if this stuff was being left out in the blazing heat and sun, or got flooded, then yes the primer and powder might have started to deteriorate, and the brass corrode.

In any case (pun intended), this stuff is going to be recycled. The powder and primers will be destroyed, but I am willing to bet all the brass will be inspected and most reloaded, buy someone. If not, it will be sold for recycling. And the projectiles will be sold for recycling too. Someone is going to make a boatload of money off recycling this stuff.

There has to be more to this story, and I would like to know what it is.

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
14. I have no issue with recycling, but the point I made is still standing
Mon Apr 28, 2014, 02:31 PM
Apr 2014

the US Government is not going to open itself to liability. This is why a lot of this crap is not sold in the civilian market.

Hey, I would prefer the brass goes to OTHER things and not ammo, but that is just me... same goes for lead

 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
19. Unfortunately that is the country we live in
Mon Apr 28, 2014, 02:40 PM
Apr 2014

they USED to sell small ammo but that stopped a while ago.

 

Electric Monk

(13,869 posts)
16. "labially" ??? WTF? Do you not even proof read at all? Or do you post like that on purpose?
Mon Apr 28, 2014, 02:37 PM
Apr 2014
nadinbrzezinski

9.If the bullets are past due

they will not work. So that is opening themselves for labially. You knew that, but that is ok.

Yes, for those who have no idea about guns, bullets do have a shelf life
 

nadinbrzezinski

(154,021 posts)
17. More nits
Mon Apr 28, 2014, 02:38 PM
Apr 2014

have a fun day

And no, I am not alerting on you, but I expect alerts anyway. So alert away.

FYI, this is a bottom of barrel complaint

 

Comrade Grumpy

(13,184 posts)
8. It would be more efficient to just burn huge pallets of cash.
Mon Apr 28, 2014, 02:01 PM
Apr 2014

Then they wouldn't have to mess around with all those bullets they don't need.

And don't forget the $7 billion worth of MRAPs they're trashing in Afghanistan.

I want to be a military contractor when I grow up.

 

seveneyes

(4,631 posts)
10. No excuse for our federal government to be this inept and stupid
Mon Apr 28, 2014, 02:11 PM
Apr 2014

They could at least sell the small caliber ammo to us taxpayers rather than destroy it. Whomever is in charge of this cluster fuck should be relieved from duty and then assign someone with a clue.

bluedigger

(17,086 posts)
21. We found some pretty creative ways to waste ammo in the artillery.
Mon Apr 28, 2014, 03:00 PM
Apr 2014

We would usually find ourselves out on field training exercises near the end of the fiscal year. In order to get ammo in the budget for next year's training you have to consume all the ammo budgeted for the current year - otherwise you get less for next year. So we would get orders to fire all the ammo we had available to us, in a very short time period. We would spend quite a bit of effort to compute firing data that would allow us to spell our battery motto and such in the sky with illumination rounds. (We did a pretty good job, too!)

People need to remember the military has all kinds of expensive ammo - artillery, tank, missiles, etc... besides small arms ammo, and much of it has a shelf life. You don't want to send people out with ammo that might have a 50% fail rate. None of which excuses DOD's atrocious book keeping - but that's really another matter.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Pentagon to destroy $1B i...