Remember your author here also wrote this.....

http://www.cracked.com/article_15740_was-911-inside-job.html

thought some of the insights were unusual, never thought about the way the guy always gets the hot girl .. and how that breeds expectations at a subconscious level (perhaps).

Wong's final sentences in his 9/11 article:

"After all, nobody likes feeling like an asshole. But if we keep getting the real information out there, with time, the conspiracy silliness will fade away.

I have faith in humanity."

but I am interested inthis particular issue.

We need a variety of puke icons.

or the snarky attitude?

It was certainly a certain kind of male viewpoint.

I think there is a hard to define discomfort, at best, from many mainstream males about women that has gotten worse.

I consider this honest, from this kind of a guy, obviously not all men have these issues.

women's movement and thought we were past that, not!

Just noticing now that in my field the women have left the spotlight, at conferences
all the panels are male, the women might introduce the panel.. this is new and no
one says anything about it.

at how blatanty sexist and misogynistic a lot of guys his age, and, hell, up to age 30, are and, even more disturbingly, how little they care that they are and how openly they flaunt it. I have no idea why that is, but it's truly disgusting, infuriating and disheartening. Why should we have to fight this shit all over again?

maybe the media as pointed out in the article, maybe the recession does a number on people... right wing talk radio?

It looks like younger women haven't figured out what's in their interest or they don't have avenues for learning about
sexism. Even progressive young women seem over sexualized in their look and attitude, the way of talking, but I do
not know how to judge exactly since my generation went to the extreme, not wearing makeup and all that, not so
much caring about clothes, anyway it's something to research, what in the world is causing this regression..

seem to be all that bothered by it, in fact, a not-so-rare attitude seems to be that they want a man to take care of them and they see nothing wrong with subordinating their career and desires to his. So we're coming right back to where we started. Sigh.

And the usual crap about how "I was just joking" and "you older women have no sense of humor", etc., etc. gets thrown at me whenever I comment on one of my son's friend's sexists jokes, pics or posts. It's upsetting to my son 'cause he can't seem to talk any sense into them, and yet they're the ones who seem to have all the dates even though they treat women like shit. Some of his cousins who are the same age have noted this crap as well and feel outnumbered when they try to speak against it.

It looks like the shock value kind of entertainment, politically incorrect, has taken root.
If you don't like it you're an old bra burning feminist, emphasize the old I guess.

I'm hoping the latest attacks on women wake up young women that they still have to
work with even their close family and friends on awareness.

Consciousness raising as we used to call it!

i mean, you now have the women themselves calling themselves sluts, to own the word. not gonna own it. not gonna be sexual equals, as long as there is a word slut to differentiate a womans sexual want from a mans

http://www.feminisms.org/4685/its-international-womens-day-are-our-foremothers-rolling-in-their-graves/

The third wave, which is the wave I’ve found myself in (I was born in 1979 so I had little choice in the matter), seems decidedly marked by what could almost be viewed as a backlash against first and second wavers. Certainly it isn’t fair to paint the entire third wave as ungrateful, burlesque-loving, Slutwalking, post-modernists, as there has certainly been valuable theory and critiques to come out of this generation of feminism, but when I imagine us looking back at this particular wave, I am sometimes overcome by a sinking feeling that very much resembles embarrassment.

While radical feminists, bra-burners, and hairy, man-hating, lesbians (which, for the record, are super awesome caricatures, in my opinion) seem representative of second wave feminism, what we’ve been stuck with, in the third wave, are half-naked, stiletto’d, women and girls, stripping on-stage and calling it empowerment, or marching through the streets calling themselves sluts under the guise of “sexual freedom.”

Amid a culture that hypersexualizes women and girls, so much so that we seem to have lost any understanding of the word “objectification,” are blessed with the ability to ignore the ever-increasing violence of the porn industry in favour of conversations of the “grey areas,” and seem overly committed towards engaging in desperate attempts to derail every conversation into one about the supposed existence of “feminist porn,” it can feel as though the third wavers are a somewhat confused bunch. more at link

In the face of very serious threats to both individual women and the rights and freedoms of women as a whole, white, privileged, Western women are….Slutwalking? And framing stripping as empowerment? Really?

As Laurie Penny wrote so articulately in a piece published earlier today:

Women, like everyone else, have been duped. We have been persuaded over the past 50 years to settle for a bland, neoliberal vision of what liberation should mean. Life may have become a little easier in that time for white women who can afford to hire a nanny, but the rest of us have settled for a cheap, knock-off version of gender revolution. Instead of equality at work and in the home, we settled for “choice”, “flexibility” and an exciting array of badly paid part-time work to fit around childcare and chores.

Sadly, she is so very right. Talk about oppression, exploitation, and objectification and, without a doubt, someone will throw the word “choice” at you as though it’s a weapon. Watch out, critics of burlesque! Some women feel individually empowered by taking off their clothes on stage! Criticize the sex industry or men who buy sex? Well, clearly it’s because you hate sex. Which is a bad thing, by the way. Sex-positivity preaches that women must like all things “sexy” in order to be empowered. The blanket of sex-positivity means that, suddenly, exploitative and sexist industries equal sexual freedom for women! How about that.

all the things women worked on in the past to make it a more friendly environment for women, is now ignored, so we can start all over again.

truly amazing.

I went through that in the 90s and had to act on hostile work environment behaviors by a male and his porno stash he liked to show off .. is there a change?

I'm guessing you're referring to general environment.

I was able to prevail against the guy in question back then, not that it was easy.

Males and females alike. In fact, what you might be seeing is a cultural feedback loop.

All participants involved in the telling of these jokes need a slap in the head with a wakeup call stick.

They do not know what it is to have to have abortions in secret. They cannot imagine having no access to contraception. They can't imagine not having laws to protect them in the workplace. They take it all for granted so they don't think it really matters.

Movies represent what men expect out of women? Freeperville represents all men? Men who masturbate in public and get caught represent all men? This reminds me of Coulter's tactics. You make some extreme inflammatory statement and then use pure unadulterated bullshit to back it up. It's like throwing shit against a wall to see what sticks.

I stopped reading after the 3rd example. I'm surprised I made it that far. Andrea Dworkin made better arguments for this type of tripe and it was still BS. This is just a lower grade of BS.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/1255186

http://pandagon.net/index.php/site/comments/misogyny-isnt-caused-by-male-horniness

A million people have sent me this off-putting article by David Wong at Cracked trying to explain misogyny. The women have found it unnerving, and the men have loved it, for reasons they should be ashamed of that I will explain in just a moment. I didn't want to write about it, because having done this for many years, I'm less inclined to be critical of someone who means well, even if they're doing it all wrong, but this seems to be the only way to get people to stop sending me this article. Apparently, it struck a chord. The piece starts off on a good foot, explaining that men are taught from the cradle that they're entitled to women's affection, and he even touches on how women who aren't considered beautiful are often not considered at all. He's 100% right on this. This is the underpinning of the Nice Guy® complaint. They say that "women" overlook the "nice" guys because they're not as attractive or whatever, but if you scratch them, you'll find that they exclude a huge percentage of women from the category "women" for not fitting their beauty standards. Thus, the whine only makes sense if you assume that men are entitled to beauty, but women should settle for "nice", and give up on physical attraction.

The rest of the piece is based on the iffy theory that only men really know what it's like to feel horny. This is why liberal dudes were licking it up, since it was a purportedly anti-sexist piece, but it still had a soothing message that men still somehow are more than women, because they are more alive, you know. They have more desire. They really like sex, in a way that you women can never understand.

*

Wong means well, but he's letting men off the hook. By making misogyny about men's supposedly overpowering sex drive, he makes it seem primal and nearly unavoidable. After all, if nature dictates that men want it and women don't, then there's not much you can do about it. But I think misogyny is rooted in something else, something Wong does hint at before scrambling away to make more jokes about how women can't know what it's like to really feel sexual desire. It's hard to talk about, because it cuts right to the bone in something humans don't like to talk about, but it's about the will to dominate. I think men become misogynists not because their intense horniness short circuits their brain. It's because they feel entitled to have women in a submissive position to them. They want to live in a world where women are considered automatically dumber, where women are expected to clean up after them, wipe their brows, and kiss their asses, all with a smile on our faces and without asking much more in return but an occasional bit of jewelry and a door-opening, which is just as much about the man feeling more powerful as it is about being nice to the woman. They want to control women sexually, not because they're more horny, but because sexual control is just one more form of control. Misogynists especially dislike women having reproductive control, because if a woman can't control her pregnancies, she's going to be more dependent on a man, and they believe that makes it easier for them. If women are dependent, you don't need to be nice to your wife to get her to stay. She doesn't have a choice, and that's how they like it. They believe in their hearts that women are inferior, and fear that if they're disproved in this contention, their entire sense of self will crumble, because that sense of self is all built on being a "man". They get angry and mock other men they believe are trying to hard to be pleasing to women---genuinely pleasing, not faux "build skyscrapers" pleasing---but men who take care of their looks to be sexually attractive (they get dismissed as "metrosexual&quot or men who treat women with respect. Those men are seen as undermining the united front to artificially lower women's standards. It's not an accident that the biggest misogynists are the first to flip their shit at the idea of swapping out big greasy burgers for some broccoli on occasion.

*

More importantly, men get to feel hornier because they're socially supported in this. The whole of society is geared toward titillating men and discouraging female sexual desire. It's inherent to the Nice Guy® complaint, where men are entitled to feel physical attraction, but a woman who wants more than "nice" is shallow. It's evident in the way men and women dress, with women always mindful to wear stuff that makes them sexually attractive, whereas men have the opposite problem, and have to avoid being too sexualized lest they seem feminine. Naked women are draped over every inch of public space, and the internet is full of visually interesting porn for men, but our society barely can imagine what it would be like to try to attract a female eye. (Though "True Blood" is really making up ground rapidly on this front.) Men seem hornier in no small part because their sexuality is celebrated and codified. It's easy for men to know right away how to be sexual, whereas women are still largely expected to figure it out for themselves---and even that's a recent invention, because pre-feminism, women were mostly just expected to do what men wanted. To a large extent, that's still true, but we're at least getting a few glimmers of liberty for women, but in many ways, the past few generations of women are real pioneers in trying to figure out what sex means when we're actually allowed to want it, even a little.

Good, I was hoping for some help unpacking this. I will now reread it!

It's such old news about men supposedly being hornier that I just ignored that as self congratulatory.
But it's a can of worms.

But the issue of domination, now that is a worm farm!

It feels like two steps forward one and a half back for progress.

it sounded pro women at the beginning. the further i read, just the glorification of the all powerful, all awesome, all consuming male sexuality.

I think that's the term, but I was willing to give space to an Asian American male telling his story.

Very curious about how that impacts his views since the Asians are often denied their sexuality
in the US, and I wondered if some compensatory issues were at work there. I think he was
trying to be entertaining but in so doing a world of unconscious crapola is revealed.

this is how we have been pumping our boys/men up for the last decade and half. i figure it is more the cult like evolutionary behavioral psychology of dominance and this author is just reiterating what our society is continually telling and feeding our guys. he is just one more that embraces whole heartedly cause it serves him well.

Wong's article rubbed me the wrong way, too. I know he meant well, but I just kept thinking, "The brain in my big head knows how to override the brain in the little one."

i do like all of what this woman wrote though. it is a very good article calling out the areas i had issue with. and tobin

you just keep impressing me more and more in your RL. i have been reading your posts.

but I went to lunch, instead. What did I miss?

It is a foolish way for men to think, but I do indeed believe that lots of men think thay way. I certainly know that lots of my friends think that way.

Personally, my mind doesn't work anything at all like men are portrayed in this article. But I do recognize all of those attitudes. So in the end, I think the article was thought-provoking and therefore worthwhile.