let's change a couple of words

Proving once again that responsible drivers don't commit crimes . . . till they drink or text and drive

changing just one word...if you want to play semantics...

They were restricted.

Many, many states allow short barreled rifles and shotguns. MI was the latest state allowing ownership. Just need to pay the 200 tax. It takes about 9 months to get the tax stamp from the feds.

I know....my ex husband was facing 5 to 10 for the possession of the one he pointed at my forehead.

This is legal to own:

that is what he put between my eyes...

but he only got 5 yrs probation....not for threatening me with it....for possession of THAT weapon.....He was treated like a terrorist by the cops BTW!

Under the National Firearms Act (NFA), it is illegal for a private citizen to possess a sawed-off modern smokeless powder shotgun (a shotgun with a barrel length shorter than 18 inches (46 cm) or an overall length shorter than 26 inches (66 cm)) (under U.S.C.

who can't see beyond their gun obsession.

Sawed off shotguns are legal to own provided you do more paperwork, have a deeper background check, and pay 200 dollars.

I would imagine VR's husband didn't follow the law.

But VR's case is illustrative of the futilityof the law. A legal shotgun and a hacksaw makes a quick SBS if someone is intend on using it illegally.

It's illegal to just cut the barrel of of a gun that you already own. A person has to go through the process with the feds and the chief of police needs to sign off on it, unless you establish a trust.

18 USCS § 921

The term “short-barreled shotgun” means a shotgun having one or more barrels less than eighteen inches in length and any weapon made from a shotgun (whether by alteration, modification or otherwise) if such a weapon as modified has an overall length of less than twenty-six inches.

http://www.guns.com/2014/03/31/michigans-governor-signs-law-allowing-short-barreled-firearms-state/

Michigan Gov. Rick Snyder signed a bill Friday that will repeal the state’s long-standing ban on private ownership of short-barreled firearms.

The bill created an exception to the state’s current ban on short-barreled rifles and shotguns for those who otherwise comply with federal laws on these National Firearm Act regulated items. It brings Michigan in line with 41 other states that already permit ownership of these firearms that are gaining in popularity.

we never sawed off our barrels. ?

I would start with a ban on assault weapons. If Ybarra had been able to get his hands on one there would almost certainly have been many more deaths.

and what is an assault weapon? Is this?

I am sure you have a plan to get rid of hundreds of millions of magazines and to keep from printing new ones.

Lawyers and judges are funny about that.

for example, the intricacies of producing meth to know they want it banned. That's just some argument gunners make up to try to shut down any talk of prohibition.

In that way, folks can see what is the real agenda of the gun control/prohibitionist outlook, and we pro Bill of Rights folks will no longer be accused of "paranoia" and fear-mongering.

so I can talk about it all I want and you can't blame Dems for this one. And you will still be paranoid.

have to allow the production of any more.

And we can start by reinstating the assault weapons ban that expired during the Bush administration.

And magazines are no harder to smuggle than drugs...

there will be fewer.

Newtown, not an assault weapon
SPU, not an assault weapon, shotgun
Wisconsin Sikh temple shooting, not an assault weapon, Pistol
Aurora shooting, assault weapon jammed due to to large of a magazine. used handgun and shotgun after weapon jammed.
Washington Navy Yard shooting, not an assault weapon, shotgun
Fort Hood, both shootings, not an assault weapon, Pistol
VA Tech shooting, not an assault weapon, Pistol

I am for magazine limits and I think proper mental heath care would have done more than a reinstated AWB that relies on features of a weapon.

No longer an assault weapon.

http://www.thebangswitch.com/stupid-law-stupid-result-new-yorks-awb/

The shooter was disabled with pepper spray because he had to reload.

As bad as this was, with an assault weapon it would have been magnitudes worse. That's why we have to start with reinstating the ban.

The punk used pistols with standard magazines to kill 32 people.

instead of a shotgun. We can't eliminate all gun related murders or mass murders but we can reduce the risk.

I don't know what kind of shotgun it was, but plenty of shotguns ran afoul of that based on their shape.

But. If this were a hunting shotgun than it probably wasn't.

that can be fired off before reloading, the better.

No, I don't know for a fact the status of his shotgun.

In close quarters I would much rather face a person with a small caliber "assault weapon" then someone with a shotgun that knows how to use it.

He was disabled because he was not proficient with a shotgun.

An auto shotgun loaded with any kind of pellet shot is devastating at close range, a breach load can be loaded very quickly and looses no energy in gas chamber movement and is one of the most powerful weapons on the face of the planet.

If he had a handgun he would have most certainly been able to get more rounds off.

before requiring reloading. It was that need to reload that gave everyone there a chance.

and a ban would not have prevented it unless you also want to confiscate the millions out there which was never part of the old AWB or the latest try.

Even in New York they gave up on that.

If it can accept a detachable magazine, it can accept an arbitrarily large detachable magazine.

"Assault weapon" is a subset of the weapons that can accept a detachable magazine, based on the shape of its grip, whether its stock adjusts, and whether or not it can accept a bayonet.

and then move on to all the other guns with detachable magazines.

I'm much more concerned about handguns, personally...

Pre-ban 12 round magazine. Looks like Marlin doesn't make it anymore; lack of demand or something.

no

I think this meme has been beat to death.

Shotguns are widely accepted to have many more uses than murder.

it could have been if he'd had an assault weapon instead of a shotgun that he had to reload. A student could disarm him with pepper spray.

Time to reinstate and strengthen the assault weapons ban.

I think some of this shows that the shooter may not have planned this out and might have flipped out.

If as reports say he worked in a shooting range, he would know what weapons pack more of a punch.

And good on the student who stopped all of this. Are there any groups that encourage concealed or open carry of pepper spray, that would be better than carrying rifles over your back. Saying that, I have been sprayed 3 times on purpose and 1 by accident...and I survived.

Training exercise, I hope?

Geez after 3 times you should learn, lol

Crap, I think I missed that important safety tip!

used annually for the gas mask in the Army. I do not envy you being shot with pepper spray.

I volunteered. (once). Also volunteered for the Taser. (once) Hurt more but ended quicker. Muscles felt like I had been pushing a lawnmower for 8 hours, Ibuprofin helped.

If a double barreled shotgun isn't enough for you, you are either a bad shot or defending the wrong property.

No buy back, just a big cauldron to melt them down and a lot of scrap metal.

Alternatively, restrict weapons to break barrel, single shot only. Or muzzle loaders.

Or raise the taxes on the price of ammo so high as to effectively enact total gun control. The 2A has no ammo price protection. Add a $100 tax PER BULLET.

This shooting would have been so much if he was using an assault weapon instead of a shotgun that had to be reloaded.

And the bullets would be covered by the second just like ink was covered under the first.

Ain't make believe fun!

and is right...

is "humping" the Constitution? Any more of my rights you want to limit to the 18th century?

I don't think you have a right to carry assault weapons into Wendy's!

As I recall it didn't guarantee my right to vote at the time....

I personally think the "Open Carry" advocates that carry long guns into public venues are idiots and do nothing positive for the RKBA. Wendy's, as a private enterprise, is free to ban weapons on their premises; 2nd Amendment not withstanding. What is your definition of an "assault weapon"? For many, it's a scary gun they don't like.

Hence the amendment process. The primary difference of opinion seems to be is the freedoms guaranteed in the Bill of Rights are limited to the technology available at the time of ratification.

Good god...

Get a musket!

Because somehow that "well regulated" part gets overlooked...

does not include radio, television or internet resources?

Are you saying there are no radio or television regulations?

And why can't you own a Bazooka? Isn't that covered under the 2nd?

But then again when did Television Radio or Internet serial kill people!

is right!

SMDH....at the Ammosexuals!

I'm impressed. And of course, the usual, tired, sexual perversion reference.

No one arguing for no regulation of firearms. No one. Ever. (Fail 1)

Clearly, there is regulation of television and radio; yet both are afforded protections under the 1st Amendment even though they did not exist at the time. (Fail 2)

Bazookas, to be pedantic, are perfectly legal to own; it is the explosive shell that is heavily regulated by the BATFE as a dangerous device. (Fail 3)

Whether or not the various forms of media have been used to kill people is not relevant; the initial argument was to restrict the 2nd Amendment to the technology available at the time.

You must be running low on straw; maybe a trip to the gardening supply store is in order?

was not true? Please do post.

It's easy to come back with the name calling. Next will be the penis jokes but I guess "ammosexuals" is the new one for this week.

and when you cannot make a coherent argument to support your position, just fall back on the same tired sexually based insults.

I'd say things like saying "the only way to stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun" is the better analogy to your hammer theory!

ALL you have is a gun....its EVERYTHING to you! What are you without one?

And a gun is not everything to me. Which common-sense gun regulation to you propose? What effect do you suppose it might have on criminal misuse of firearms? Did you pick up your re-supply of straw yet?

or do the Democrats only have straw too?

Please specify. If you can, please expand on how those ideas will impact the criminal misuse of firearms? So far you have only proposed that the 2nd Amendment covers firearms in use at the time the Constitution was ratified. After that your only comment was limited to the usual tired sexual innuendo.

Right to own firearms is subject to reasonable regulation

We recognize that the individual right to bear arms is an important part of the American tradition, and we will preserve Americans' Second Amendment right to own and use firearms. We believe that the right to own firearms is subject to reasonable regulation. We understand the terrible consequences of gun violence; it serves as a reminder that life is fragile, and our time here is limited and precious. We believe in an honest, open national conversation about firearms. We can focus on effective enforcement of existing laws, especially strengthening our background check system, and we can work together to enact commonsense improvements--like reinstating the assault weapons ban and closing the gun show loophole--so that guns do not fall into the hands of those irresponsible, law-breaking few.
Source: 2012 Democratic Party Platform , Sep 4, 2012
Reauthorize assault weapons ban, close gun show loophole

We will protect Americans’ Second Amendment right to own firearms, and we will keep guns out of the hands of criminals and terrorists by fighting gun crime, reauthorizing the assault weapons ban, and closing the gun show loophole, as President Bush proposed and failed to do.
Source: The Democratic Platform for America, p.18 , Jul 10, 2004
Strengthen gun control to reduce violence

Democrats passed the Brady Law and the Assault Weapons Ban. We increased federal, state, and local gun crime prosecution by 22 percent since 1992. Now gun crime is down by 35 percent. Now we must do even more. We need mandatory child safety locks. We should require a photo license I.D., a background check, and a gun safety test to buy a new handgun. We support more federal gun prosecutors and giving states and communities another 10,000 prosecutors to fight gun crime.
Source: 2000 Democratic National Platform as adopted by the DNC , Aug 15, 2000
Click here for definitions & background information for the Gun Control.

And here is another of your "responsible" gun owners gone wrong..

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/tennessee-man-driving-accidentally-shoots-kills-self

and David Letterman agrees..

"For the love of Christ when are we going to do something!"

It is all of the anti-gun posters that got the memo. So what does it mean anyway?

we need to have single payer health care that includes mental health as that seems to be the common link. They have used every type of weapon so unless you ban and confiscate all of them, these shootings and "STABBINGS" will still happen.

I hope you, Dave and Bill are just as animated in the number of dead caused by drunk and distracted driving.

HPD: Child on bike killed by suspected drunken driver
http://www.chron.com/news/houston-texas/houston/article/HPD-Child-on-bike-killed-by-suspected-drunken-5453373.php

Police say:Man mowing grass hit and killed by drunk driver
http://www.wbtw.com/story/25707895/man-mowing-grass-hit-and-killed-in-florence-county

Man Accused of Killing Baby in Drunk Driving Crash Expected in Court -
http://centralnc.twcnews.com/content/news/708181/man-accused-of-killing-baby-in-drunk-driving-crash-expected-in-court/#sthash.bHjLm5Va.dpuf

Suspected drunk driver from Minn. crashes in N.D., kills 2 sisters in his car
http://www.startribune.com/local/259791431.html

Happens multiple times a day but never get posted here or commented on by Dave or Bill. I guess it must be OK.

but if you only have a knife....I have half a chance...

so since you want to compare the number of knife deaths to gun deaths...the shoe fits!

common sense gun regulations would not have stopped these murders. They would not have stopped the Sandy Hook Murders. They would not have stopped the Fort Hood murders. They would not have stopped the Seattle murders. They would not have stopped the VA Tech murders. They would not have stopped The Gabby Gifford's murders. They would not have stopped the Colorado theater murders. They would not have stopped the Navel shipyard murders.

Background checks, Assault Weapons bans,magazine limits would not have affected those. So what else are you now calling for that would actually help prevent these murders?

Right to own firearms is subject to reasonable regulation

We recognize that the individual right to bear arms is an important part of the American tradition, and we will preserve Americans' Second Amendment right to own and use firearms. We believe that the right to own firearms is subject to reasonable regulation. We understand the terrible consequences of gun violence; it serves as a reminder that life is fragile, and our time here is limited and precious. We believe in an honest, open national conversation about firearms. We can focus on effective enforcement of existing laws, especially strengthening our background check system, and we can work together to enact commonsense improvements--like reinstating the assault weapons ban and closing the gun show loophole--so that guns do not fall into the hands of those irresponsible, law-breaking few.
Source: 2012 Democratic Party Platform , Sep 4, 2012
Reauthorize assault weapons ban, close gun show loophole

We will protect Americans’ Second Amendment right to own firearms, and we will keep guns out of the hands of criminals and terrorists by fighting gun crime, reauthorizing the assault weapons ban, and closing the gun show loophole, as President Bush proposed and failed to do.
Source: The Democratic Platform for America, p.18 , Jul 10, 2004
Strengthen gun control to reduce violence

Democrats passed the Brady Law and the Assault Weapons Ban. We increased federal, state, and local gun crime prosecution by 22 percent since 1992. Now gun crime is down by 35 percent. Now we must do even more. We need mandatory child safety locks. We should require a photo license I.D., a background check, and a gun safety test to buy a new handgun. We support more federal gun prosecutors and giving states and communities another 10,000 prosecutors to fight gun crime.
Source: 2000 Democratic National Platform as adopted by the DNC , Aug 15, 2000

period...end of story!

You proposed nothing. When pressed for specifics you resorted to crude sexual innuendo.

Clearly you are out of straw. Maybe a trip to Lowe's? You can holler "Ammosexuals " til the cows come home; it adds nothing to your argument and simply reinforces the immaturity of your posts.

Not the way to settle an argument, seems more like a way to let his point stand as correct and true.

common sense gun regulations will stop all gun deaths....thats a very old canard.

Anyone in this day and age after all the gun deaths that have occurred who doesn't think we need to strengthen gun regulations....IS an ammosexual!

I stand by the Democratic Party Platform on guns...

Right to own firearms is subject to reasonable regulation

We recognize that the individual right to bear arms is an important part of the American tradition, and we will preserve Americans' Second Amendment right to own and use firearms. We believe that the right to own firearms is subject to reasonable regulation. We understand the terrible consequences of gun violence; it serves as a reminder that life is fragile, and our time here is limited and precious. We believe in an honest, open national conversation about firearms. We can focus on effective enforcement of existing laws, especially strengthening our background check system, and we can work together to enact commonsense improvements--like reinstating the assault weapons ban and closing the gun show loophole--so that guns do not fall into the hands of those irresponsible, law-breaking few.
Source: 2012 Democratic Party Platform , Sep 4, 2012
Reauthorize assault weapons ban, close gun show loophole

We will protect Americans’ Second Amendment right to own firearms, and we will keep guns out of the hands of criminals and terrorists by fighting gun crime, reauthorizing the assault weapons ban, and closing the gun show loophole, as President Bush proposed and failed to do.
Source: The Democratic Platform for America, p.18 , Jul 10, 2004
Strengthen gun control to reduce violence

Democrats passed the Brady Law and the Assault Weapons Ban. We increased federal, state, and local gun crime prosecution by 22 percent since 1992. Now gun crime is down by 35 percent. Now we must do even more. We need mandatory child safety locks. We should require a photo license I.D., a background check, and a gun safety test to buy a new handgun. We support more federal gun prosecutors and giving states and communities another 10,000 prosecutors to fight gun crime.
Source: 2000 Democratic National Platform as adopted by the DNC , Aug 15, 2000

I agree with everything except the AWB as it only work due to cosmetic features and not function. See how well the California and NY SAFE act bans are working out.

Function is the exact same as a standard AR-15 just no bayonet lug and a new ugly stock.

But so you don't feign ignorance any more....I will let the man who coined it break it down for ya..

He defined it.....I agree with him. What more needs to be said....

a very small faction of the 100 million firearms owners out there. Since all I know on this site do not agree with the open carry idiots, I am sure you are not calling anyone here that slur.

And no one on your side has yet to come up with sensible gun legislation that would have prevented most of the horrific murders.

Step up, name a few so we can see if they would have affected any of them.

exception. I do not believe in banning weapons due to cosmetic features and that it also energizes the base on the other side. That is why the common sense items were shot down when talk of bans showed up again and nothing happened.

and I still vote democratic as I know there is no chance of another AWB being put into law.

Right to own firearms is subject to reasonable regulation

We recognize that the individual right to bear arms is an important part of the American tradition, and we will preserve Americans' Second Amendment right to own and use firearms. We believe that the right to own firearms is subject to reasonable regulation. We understand the terrible consequences of gun violence; it serves as a reminder that life is fragile, and our time here is limited and precious. We believe in an honest, open national conversation about firearms. We can focus on effective enforcement of existing laws, especially strengthening our background check system, and we can work together to enact commonsense improvements--like reinstating the assault weapons ban and closing the gun show loophole--so that guns do not fall into the hands of those irresponsible, law-breaking few.
Source: 2012 Democratic Party Platform , Sep 4, 2012
Reauthorize assault weapons ban, close gun show loophole

We will protect Americans’ Second Amendment right to own firearms, and we will keep guns out of the hands of criminals and terrorists by fighting gun crime, reauthorizing the assault weapons ban, and closing the gun show loophole, as President Bush proposed and failed to do.
Source: The Democratic Platform for America, p.18 , Jul 10, 2004
Strengthen gun control to reduce violence

Democrats passed the Brady Law and the Assault Weapons Ban. We increased federal, state, and local gun crime prosecution by 22 percent since 1992. Now gun crime is down by 35 percent. Now we must do even more. We need mandatory child safety locks. We should require a photo license I.D., a background check, and a gun safety test to buy a new handgun. We support more federal gun prosecutors and giving states and communities another 10,000 prosecutors to fight gun crime.
Source: 2000 Democratic National Platform as adopted by the DNC , Aug 15, 2000
Click here for definitions & background information for the Gun Control.

regarding gun control a firearms ownership.

you still have not come up with a meaning other than a nice rant by Bill on the idiotic open carry Texas assholes.

So what is the definition? You do not know it do you.

you do not even know the definition of, cool.

I do agree with Bill on the clip about open carry. I just do not think we should sink to the level of name calling.

Then, I don't stoop to crude sexual innuendo to describe people with whom I disagree. I leave that for people who cannot present a coherent argument or facts to support their position. So what impact to you think the proposed "common-sense" gun regulations to have? The weapon used as Sandy Hook was compliant with the 1994 ban as the CT law was a mirror of that one. Cho at VA Tech used handguns with standard capacity magazines to commit his horrific act. Loughner's "Mall Ninja" magazine jammed on him allowing others to tackle him. Focusing on long guns when more people are killed by bludgeoning attacks that with all varieties of rifles and shotguns seems a poor use of resources to address criminal misuse of firearms unless one's only real purpose is to gin up a culture war against law-abiding gun owners.

take it up with Bill Maher!

didn't post his crude sexual innuendo here, you did.

You just agree with it.

"I didn't coin it....I just agree with it!"

Unless you now want to walk back your use of a crude sexual innuendo to describe gun owners.

Right to own firearms is subject to reasonable regulation

We recognize that the individual right to bear arms is an important part of the American tradition, and we will preserve Americans' Second Amendment right to own and use firearms. We believe that the right to own firearms is subject to reasonable regulation. We understand the terrible consequences of gun violence; it serves as a reminder that life is fragile, and our time here is limited and precious. We believe in an honest, open national conversation about firearms. We can focus on effective enforcement of existing laws, especially strengthening our background check system, and we can work together to enact commonsense improvements--like reinstating the assault weapons ban and closing the gun show loophole--so that guns do not fall into the hands of those irresponsible, law-breaking few.
Source: 2012 Democratic Party Platform , Sep 4, 2012
Reauthorize assault weapons ban, close gun show loophole

We will protect Americans’ Second Amendment right to own firearms, and we will keep guns out of the hands of criminals and terrorists by fighting gun crime, reauthorizing the assault weapons ban, and closing the gun show loophole, as President Bush proposed and failed to do.
Source: The Democratic Platform for America, p.18 , Jul 10, 2004
Strengthen gun control to reduce violence

Democrats passed the Brady Law and the Assault Weapons Ban. We increased federal, state, and local gun crime prosecution by 22 percent since 1992. Now gun crime is down by 35 percent. Now we must do even more. We need mandatory child safety locks. We should require a photo license I.D., a background check, and a gun safety test to buy a new handgun. We support more federal gun prosecutors and giving states and communities another 10,000 prosecutors to fight gun crime.
Source: 2000 Democratic National Platform as adopted by the DNC , Aug 15, 2000
Click here for definitions & background information for the Gun Control.

firearms
Handguns, shotguns and rifles, restrictions in who can own.
Full auto rifles and machine guns, legal but heavily restricted
Bazookas and howitzers, legal but heavily restricted
Short barrel rifles and shotguns, legal but heavily restricted

Frankenstein (movie), 1931.

And by "lots," I mean maybe one in five...

Prohibitive ammo tax? Easily smuggled commodity made unavailable or unaffordable = thriving black market.

So even if these measures were not political suicide for many politicians (and they would be), they wouldn't actually work. People need to understand that total gun prohibition is not going to happen here...and find other solutions to the problem of violent crime with guns.