of scrubbing us out of existence, but not soon enough.

other species now gone ... other than mankind has created its own demise. And what earth doesn't kill off, mankind will, with endless tribal warfare.

If that's true, we can kiss a large chunk of the world's population goodbye.
Mother Earth is thinning the herd.

could happen. Science can only do so much ... there are not always magical solutions or hard worked solutions.

If we're not here to enjoy it, then it serves no purpose.

But I want to save the planet to save us... not just saving it for the sake of saving it.

I can't stand those who are filled with excitement at the thought of human extinction.

To claim that the planet is useless without a human presence is precisely the kind of old testament thinking true environmentalists shun.

Who wants to live as long as biologically possible because I don't believe in an afterlife.

Polluting the environment and the effects of climate change knocks years off my life.

Therefore, I am an environmentalist.

I'm sorry that I don't fit into your profile of how an environmentalist is supposed to think.

by being selfish, greedy, thoughtless and cruel.

Sorry this pisses you off, but it is reality.

Because they both can't be true.

adds that to their post.

Maybe you should be piling on them instead.

raping and pillaging their only home.

will fill in for us.

If we didn't want to become extinct, we should have behaved better.

But if there is no human, dog, dolphin, mouse, etc around to enjoy the planet, then I don't give a rat's ass about the planet.

opportunity to record it but do nothing ... like WTF.

We are being desensitized to rape. It is now also referred to as a "struggle snuggle".

It has become entertainment. These incidents should be enough evidence that maybe we (the mouthy feminists) actually aren't exaggerating at all.

again.

If you see people having sex, one doesn't assume it's rape without a reason to.
And that has nothing to do with rape culture.

It does demonstrate rape culture. http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5313150

had a doubt as to its nature? She seemed to see SOMETHING to give her pause.

If someone had a doubt about it others likely did too, either desensitsed, insensitive or cowardice, dozens of people stood by and did nothing. Not MY Problem is yet another part of rape culture too.

This was done in public, during the concert. You don't think that in itself was kind of unusual?

I find it highly unusual, and kinda ... gross, and applauded the ONE person with awareness AND guts to do something..

Since least one person could see this was fucked up, and I suspect many more could, the acceptance of it is further proof of how our society condones so many types of aggresion against women as the norm.

That went viral and was claimed as rape but turned out to be consentual .

Quite right that we're being desensitized to rape. And this is a prime example of that, along with rape culture in full force. Guy figures it's okay to attack a girl at a public venue because people wouldn't think it was rape to begin with, and if they did, hey, they'd probably just film it.

Kudos to the woman who stepped in.

Filming a woman being attacked? Does everything we do have to be uploaded to YouTube?

Uploading a video of a rape in progress was more important than stopping it or at least asking questions to make certain it was consensual.

If she did it's rape case closed, if she did not because she was scared this could create a problem. Good on the woman for stepping in and asking, I think people should have been confronting them way ahead of time, the lawn of a concert is not a place to be having sex. Furthermore whoever supplied the girl with booze should be going to jail. Booze most likely created the whole scenario, intoxication can cause people to do stuff they would not normally do while sober, like being dragged off by some stranger for sex on the lawn.

We need to end this practice of assuming that if a woman doesn't say no or fight back that she can is consenting.

Our default setting is NOT 'yes'.

No one gets a pass on rape because they somehow couldn't tell whether their partner was into it or not.

Thank Goddess a woman in the crowd gave a shit about the victim's state of mind enough to notice.

There is no implied YES or NO to a crowd unless they have more information.

He doesn't get a pass on rape of course if he know she didn't want it, and indicated it in any way at all.

The crowd gets a pass if they had no reason to suspect. The article didn't indicate they had a reason.

If they did, they don't get a pass.

Of course it was great that someone eventually asked and a shame no one did sooner.

Ask yourself why that woman intervened.

Think.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025312668

Perhaps you don't realize two people can have different opinions while thinking, and without endorsing rape or a culture that doesn't do enough to stop it.

Two people having sex does not in and of itself imply rape, no matter what you say.

We now know that to be a fact. You said the default position is to assume consent. That is a mistake. This is not a hypothetical. It's an actual event where a girl was being raped in public, and that everyone stood around filming it (assuming it was consensual) is indeed demonstrative of rape culture. Your opinion is demonstrably wrong. To continue to maintain it even in the evidence of rape is problematic. The reasonable thing to do is to take note of this situation and consider it in future rather than just assuming.

All sex is rape unless proven otherwise. Utter bullshit.

Not "all sex." This case.

oh boy!

At 17 her brain is not fully developed and then throw booze in the mix and you have a recipe for disaster. Booze did not cause the rape but it did have a factor in how it happened.

The guy who drug her off was the factor.

The article claims he took her hand and she went with him (just going by the text as written). It was only later during the police interview that she claimed she was afraid.

Needless to say... never blame alcohol for a woman getting raped.

"Booze did not cause the rape..."

The guy caused the rape, all else is rationalizing his behavior to one degree or another.

Anything else is just an excuse for his behavior imo.

Jesus.

No matter how many times or how heavily I've been wasted in my life, I always knew it was incredibly wrong to attempt to force anyone to do anything against their will.

Just like the woman you were praising who stepped in.

First comment: "Hopefully, he gets convicted and gets the favor returned to him in jail."
Jeez, the sick just goes 'round and 'round, doesn't it?

and when the girl said no, she pulled Murphy off her."

good for her, we need more people like this

I LOVE this planet...it is a great planet and is not at fault for the tiny little creatures that run around on it. I am not a big fan of people and this article is one reason why. People will just stand around and watch someone get mugged and killed, raped, bleed to death on the street...and record it with their phones!

Nope...just not there yet, we might evolve into some kind of wonderful species...but not there yet.

watch someone get raped and take pictures with their phones. I'm glad that woman stepped in and stopped the rape.

Unless she was visibly fighting him off, or verbally telling him no, or giving some sort of sign that it wasn't consensual, then I can't blame the onlookers for not stopping him.

If I hear my neighbors having sex, I'm not going to knock on the door to ask if it's consensual.

I wasn't there, but my guess would be that people who didn't worry that it might be rape were not thinking straight.

This isn't someone's private home. The outrage is over the fact that people do not see and do not care, and now we have you arguing why they shouldn't.

Last edited Thu Jul 31, 2014, 12:55 AM - Edit history (1)

He was a feminist instructing a drunk woman on how to do feminism right.

They knew she was drunk how? They knew it wasn't consensual how?
Because two people never have consensual sex in public?
Geez, talk about twisting anything that happens to make it fit into your paradigm.

What kind of sex do you know of where only one of the participants is active?

This poster had a cogent point. http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=5313553
I agree that the failure to observe it was an assault says something disturbing about not only those at the scene but society more broadly.

What is most disturbing is that knowing it is rape, you now insist everything looked just fine, that there was no way for anyone to know. If people pay attention, if they see sex as something other than something to be taken from women but rather as something in which two people actively and enthusiastically consent, chances are far greater that they will recognize assault when it is happening right in front of them, rather than filming it and egging it on. The fact is it was a rape. It was not sex. No amount of dismissal on your part can change that. The only question is do you care about that victim or future victims, or are you more concerned with making excuses why no one should intervene?

I expect the guy didn't think he was raping the women either. He likely shared the view that if a woman isn't strong or aware enough to punch him in the face, it's good enough to constitute consent. That very notion is rape culture. The dismissal of this crime and excuses for those standing by is rape culture. Rape culture is everything that allows assaults like this to proliferate. That doesn't occur by accident.

You nailed it.

I didn't say it wasn't rape. And yes, it's highly possible people didn't realize it was rape.

The fact that people did not know it was rape when the videos they took showed it was rape clearly enough for the police to use them as evidence is exactly the point.

At least one good human being in the crowd.

i'm going to guess she was CLOSE to blackout drunk. he probably knew the condition she was in. she probably didn't actually say no or resist TOO much(she was public and drunk under age, might have thought, if it can be called thought in her state, that there was no way he would do too much to her in public like that and she wanted to avoid making a scene. things got out of hand and she didn't know what to do until someone asked wtf was going on) which of course in his male american brain said "oh boy sexy time!!!".

american society does not take an interest in teaching men that treating women like people, not sex objects, is important.

this young man's life is now a casualty of that failure. his life is over because he never learned that women are people too.

Eww! That girl who pulled Murphy off the rape victim is so gonna get defriended on Facebook! OMG you're just supposed to watch, record, and text!

Stick a fork in us. America's done.