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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsIsrael secured supplies of ammunition from the Pentagon last month without White House approval
(AFP) - Israel secured supplies of ammunition from the Pentagon last month without the approval of the White House or the State Department, the Wall Street Journal reported Thursday.
Since officials there were caught off guard as they tried to restrain Israel's campaign in Gaza, the administration of President Barack Obama has tightened controls on arms shipments to Israel, the newspaper said, quoting US and Israeli officials.
But the case illustrated that the White House and the State Department have little influence over the government of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, the paper said, quoting officials from both countries.
The Journal said that US officials, rather than play their traditional role as mediators, have now been reduced to bystanders as Israeli forces and Hamas battle it out.
On Wednesday, the paper said, Obama and Netanyahu had a particularly tense phone call.
http://news.yahoo.com/white-house-dark-over-arms-supplies-israel-report-094321624.html
atreides1
(16,094 posts)Especially when the White House doesn't appear to have much influence over the Pentagon! The last time I checked it was the United States Department of Defense, not "Weapons-r-Us"!
whathehell
(29,096 posts)Especially when we give them Billions a year to slaughter women and children.
Bibi and his administration disgust me beyond measure..He's an arrogant prick with an immoral agenda, IMO.
DetlefK
(16,423 posts)Fred Sanders
(23,946 posts)to the End Times land has payed off big.
Who says corruption is all bad?
So, a military not controlled by the elected executive? Where have we seen this before?
If true, this is a serious breach of the constitution, folks.
Ichingcarpenter
(36,988 posts)and connected to this story.
chimpymustgo
(12,774 posts)So who exactly cleared this?
BillZBubb
(10,650 posts)go ask Mommy. Or vice-versa. Whichever is the most accommodating. Netanyahu knows who will give him what he wants without any discussion.
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)not the President's call? This is congress's call as pointed out in this article:
http://www.truth-out.org/news/item/20347-pentagon-approves-record-sale-of-advanced-arms-to-countries-at-war
CONGRESS has to approve (or not) arms deals.
KoKo
(84,711 posts)They don't know much about what's going on. They couldn't keep on top of the NSA Spying. They just okay what their funders tell them to...and move on...until the stuff hits the fan.
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)why I'm pointing out this is nothing to get excited about. It's not the President's call. It seems pointing that out has caused a hissy fit among some posters.
KoKo
(84,711 posts)I see concerned citizens wondering why their President didn't know since he is the Commander-in-Chief and we are at War, which Congress gave him authorization for. So, the buck stops with him for knowing. And, if he wasn't informed then WHY?
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)But when I pointed out this was not the President's call on another thread a prolific poster started whining "well, he's make it his call " - as if breaking the law helps his cause. We are not at war with Israel which is what this thread is about. Congress has the responsibility for approval or not on arms sales, not the President. That fact seems to be upsetting some.
Fantastic Anarchist
(7,309 posts)... but don't we also have laws governing the sale of weapons to countries who violate human rights and disregard international law? If that's the case, then the president can exercise his authority to execute the laws of the US and to conduct foreign policy.
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)and exactly which governing body has determined that any human rights violations occurred that the US government would adhere to?
Fantastic Anarchist
(7,309 posts)... which is the convening authority derived by the UN to make those calls.
Edit to add: And it's the president's job to faithfully execute the law. Not Congress'. Being a signatory to Geneva Conventions and a member of the UN, and treaties thereof confirmed by Congress are the law of the land.
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)when the US decided to use the IRC as a governing authority. Do you have a link to that?
Fantastic Anarchist
(7,309 posts)ICRC is the only institution explicitly named under International Humanitarian Law (IHL) as a controlling authority. The legal mandate of the ICRC stems from the four Geneva Conventions of 1949, as well as its own Statutes. The ICRC also undertakes tasks that are not specifically mandated by law, such as visiting political prisoners outside of conflict and providing relief in natural disasters.
The ICRC is a private association registered in Switzerland that has enjoyed various degrees of special privileges and legal immunities within the territory of Switzerland for many years.[when?] On 19 March 1993, a legal foundation for this special treatment was created by a formal agreement between the Swiss government and the ICRC. This agreement protects the full sanctity of all ICRC property in Switzerland including its headquarters and archive, grants members and staff legal immunity, exempts the ICRC from all taxes and fees, guarantees the protected and duty-free transfer of goods, services, and money, provides the ICRC with secure communication privileges at the same level as foreign embassies, and simplifies Committee travel in and out of Switzerland. On the other hand Switzerland does not recognize ICRC issued passports.[20]
Contrary to popular belief, the ICRC is not a sovereign entity like the Sovereign Military Order of Malta and also it is not an international organization, neither of non-governmental nor of governmental type. The ICRC limits its membership to Swiss nationals only, and also unlike most NGOs[citation needed] it does not have a policy of open and unrestricted membership for individuals as its new members are selected by the Committee itself (a process called cooptation). However, since the early 1990s, the ICRC employs persons from all over the world to serve in its field mission and at Headquarters. In 2007, almost half of ICRC staff was non-Swiss. The ICRC has special privileges and legal immunities in many countries,[which?] based on national law in these countries, based on agreements between the ICRC and the respective governments, or, in some cases, based on international jurisprudence (such as the right of ICRC delegates not to bear witness in front of international tribunals).
Legal Basis[edit]
ICRC operations are generally based on International Humanitarian Law (IHL), the four Geneva Conventions of 1949, their two Additional Protocols of 1977 and Additional Protocol III of 2005, the Statutes of the International Red Cross and Red Crescent Movement, and the resolutions of the International Conferences of the Red Cross and Red Crescent.[21]
International Humanitarian Law (IHL), Treaties and Customary Law International Humanitarian Law is a set of rules that come into effect in armed conflicts. It aims to minimize the harms of an armed conflict by imposing obligations and duties to those who participate in armed conflicts. IHL mainly deals with two parts, the protection of persons who are not, or no longer taking part in fighting and restrictions on the means and methods of warfare such as weapons and tactics.[22] IHL is founded upon Geneva conventions which were first signed in 1864 by 16 countries. Traditions and Customs had governed the conduct of war until then, which varied depending on the location and time. The First Geneva Convention of 1949 covers the protection for the wounded and sick of armed conflict on land. The Second Geneva Convention asks for the protection and care for the wounded, sick and shipwrecked of armed conflict at sea. The Third Geneva Convention emphasizes the treatment of prisoners of war. The Fourth Geneva Convention concerns the protection of civilians in time of war. In addition, there are many more body of Customary International Laws (CIL) that come into effect when necessary.
Wikipedia
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)Congress (there is simply no way the President will make this kind of call himself) to adhere to the UN - an organization that ALL republicans and not a few Democrats have no use for whatsoever. And believe me, if it means pulling out of the UN, the clowns in congress will do just that. They will NOT allow the foreign policy of this country to be taken over by the UN (which, frankly, would make me queasy also).
Fantastic Anarchist
(7,309 posts)My only point, is according to the law, the president has the authority.
Not sure why you're getting snippy about, too.
I could give fuck all what congress thinks. Congress has shown it needn't be trusted anyway.
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)Congress makes the call. And I disagree about the President having this authority. Congress approves arms sales. Period.
Fantastic Anarchist
(7,309 posts)leftynyc
(26,060 posts)answer to the UN. Period.
Fantastic Anarchist
(7,309 posts)leftynyc
(26,060 posts)found Israel to have broken? That you think the President is going to override Congress (as well as the majority of Americans) is a delusional fantasy. When are people on DU going to realize they comprise a very small minority of Americans? Is the bubble you stay in really that small?
Fantastic Anarchist
(7,309 posts)The IRC derives its authority from the Geneva Conventions, which the US Congress ratified.
Please quit being obtuse.
brentspeak
(18,290 posts)using the name "leftynyc".
Can you explain this to us? Maybe you thought we would be fooled.
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)right wing views from everyone while posting on DU for over a decade. The only fool is someone who thinks just because I don't line up to your cartoon version of a liberal means I'm right wing.
brentspeak
(18,290 posts)Last edited Fri Aug 15, 2014, 12:54 PM - Edit history (1)
In fact, you've made them crystal clear to everyone:
leftynyc: "I hope Bradley Manning spends the rest of his life in prison."
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022956846#post18
leftynyc ridiculing the fact that hundreds of thousands of people have participated on behalf of OWS (while simultaneously impugning and dismissing the entire movement because a few lone idiots who claimed to be part of OWS burned the US flag):
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=256156
leftynyc: "The Occupy movement is dead...The never had a simple coherent message, they never had a decent spokesperson and now this crap. I hope the Democrats are smart enough to stay away from this."
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1002959033#post71
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)out of my over 12,000 that don't line up with your cartoon version of a liberal.
brentspeak
(18,290 posts)leftynyc
(26,060 posts)and all of them reflect right wing views? Is that your story? And I still have managed to be here over a decade (and 2 years longer than you). Is that really the story you want to go with? Do you really want to drive every Democrat that has a different version of liberalism out of the party? You know what? Don't bother answering. I've just concluded I really don't give a shit what you think.
leftynyc
(26,060 posts)I find your obsession with me absolutely adorable.
KoKo
(84,711 posts)3,495 Comments
Firedup 5 minutes ago
As a lifetime employee of international shipping agencies inside the USA and a frequent last gateway for shipment of defense articles, I can tell you that Israels close relationship with the United States prompts many people to believe they can dispatch anything they want to Israel without the proper government authorization. When they get friction, they change the articles name and ship it anyway. Rarely are there any prosecutions that result in more than a surcharge on the articles themselves. It has been this way for over 40 years that I can remember and maybe more.
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Juan
Like I have said before Israel's wish for "security assurances in exchange for agreeing to a long term deal with Hamas" is nothing short of blackmail and a shakedown. Israel will not agree to stop killing Palestinians unless America first agrees to reimburse it for the full cost of the war. This is exactly what happened in the 2012 conflict where America had to pay Israel for every bomb and bullet it fired in the conflict. This is one of the reasons there will never be peace in the area, because the American people always end up paying the billions of dollars Israel spends on its wars. The fact that weapons were given to Israel without Whitehorse knowledge and approval demonstrates that Israel's interests have taken over parts of our government.
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fareastX 6 minutes ago
While people takes this article as another excuse to bash an early lame duck, we are missing the point of this article.
"illustrated that the White House and the State Department have little influence over the government of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu,"
Stop thinking in terms of red and blue but USA and Israel, if our president, the leader of united states (personal opinion on him aside) has no say in Israel outright just take what they want from us without our permission than who does? Who is really in control? This is the real issue here.
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LooniDaisy90699 3 minutes ago
Pentagon could not have supplied arms if it were against the rules. Whether the White House likes it or not is a different matter altogether. It only shows that the White House isn't serious about arms control reg. Israel. Let us face it, it is a fact that U.S.A. is not going to let Israel lose a war, come what may. Israel knows it, Arabs know it, the world knows it, so does Mr. Netanyahu. So Mr. Obama is at the mercy of Mr. Netanyahu and the latter has not missed any opportunity to set aside Mr. Obama.
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Seneca 32 minutes ago
White House is not in the dark! Nobody sells military equipment without control.
They pretend that they are in the dark, they didn't want to upset Jews on one hand and didn't want to cooperate openly in the other hand to upset Palestinians and world community.
Typical hypocrisy.
indepat
(20,899 posts)JEB
(4,748 posts)hifiguy
(33,688 posts)normal people treat the drive through window at the local burger joint.
Ichingcarpenter
(36,988 posts)who has an unchecked allowance, a BMW, has no respect for his parents and is arrogant and disrespectful to his willingly enabling parents creating a psychologically harmful
codependency.