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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsIraq Vet: Small-Town Cops Have Better Armor and Weaponry Than We Carried in a Combat
In my year in Iraq, I lost track of how many times my guys asked me why so many Iraqis viewed us with distrust when we were trying to help them. The question would arise while we were walking the beat with Iraqi police officers, manning checkpoints, or in our forward operating base after we went off-duty.
Invariably, my response went something like this: Imagine that youre back home, OK? Suddenly, you got a whole mess of Iraqi soldiers in your town. Theyre all over the place, doing the same things were doing right now. How do you think youd react? Youd probably get pretty hot, right?
The notion that my illustration would become anything other than that scarcely crossed my mind. Yet, here we are in August of 2014, 10 years after I got back from Iraq, and the police agencies that have patrolled the streets of Ferguson, Missouri until they were relieved of duty on Thursday amid public outrage over their heavy-handed tactics have the kind of armor and weaponry that my men and I would have envied in the performance of our duties in an actual combat zone.
Let me repeat that: the police in Ferguson have better armor and weaponry than my men and I did in the middle of a war. And Ferguson isnt alone police departments across the US are armed for war.
http://billmoyers.com/2014/08/15/iraq-vet-small-town-cops-have-better-armor-and-weaponry-than-we-carried-in-a-combat/
cantbeserious
(13,039 posts)eom
Politicalboi
(15,189 posts)We go with the army we got, and if your parents sent you better armor, you can't wear it. It's not fair, and it shows others how little Bush/Cheney cared for their lives.
rudolph the red
(666 posts)We didn't roll that heavy unless we expected major contact.
The equipment I saw deployed in Ferguson made me ask, where was that type of personal equipment when I was in Iraq?
That type of armor/equipment has no business being in the hands of police forces or being on American streets.
KoKo
(84,711 posts)is it coming from? Is it overproduction that wasn't shipped and so it stayed here?
Wouldn't it have been expensive to ship helicopters, MRAPs back from Iraq/Afghanistan? What about the wear and tear from the desert sand and such.
Are we still producing this equipment and it's just a boondoogle for the manufacturer to call it "excess" when it's still being produced to provide jobs here?
NutmegYankee
(16,201 posts)MRAPs didn't hit Iraq till 2007.
KoKo
(84,711 posts)I was going by the NYT report that that counties had started receiving the equipment since 2006. But, then I remember that the MRAPS were specially designed because the soldiers weren't being protected ...so they wouldn't have had them then and that soldier wouldn't.
But, there is an awful lot of equipment coming in. BTW if you are still in CT (due to your DU handle) it was surprising to see how much in tiny CT. I checked it out because I used to live there. Chris Christie didn't seem to have NJ load up, though. Which was surprising.
My Southeastern County has:
168 Assault Rifles, 18 Helicopters, 4 Grenade Launchers, 4 Night Vision Pieces and 2 Armored Vehicles. Other smaller counties also have surprising sampling of armored vehicles and helicopters.
Random checking around the map it looks like Assault Rifles, Helicopters, Grenade Launchers and Armored Vehicles are all over the country now.
Mapping the Spread of the Militarys Surplus Gear
State and local police departments obtain some of their military-style equipment through a free Defense Department program created in the early 1990s. While the portion of their gear that comes from the program is relatively small (most of it is paid for by the departments or through federal grants), detailed data from the Pentagon illustrates how ubiquitous such equipment has become. Highlighted counties have received guns, grenade launchers, vehicles, night vision or body armor through the program since 2006. AUG. 15, 2014
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/08/15/us/surplus-military-equipment-map.html?smid=pl-share&_r=4
NutmegYankee
(16,201 posts)Most of the Equipment is in Hartford, New Haven, and Fairfield Counties, which contain 77% of the state population. I live in a more rural town, so we don't even have an independent police force. We are still under the resident State Trooper system.
KoKo
(84,711 posts)The CT County can distribute the resources according to Homeland Security/State Designations if you have a Demonstration of National Impact. So the equipment is easily moved from "County to County" within your state according to what Dept. of Homeland Security for your state and your Governor Requires.
If a Riot breaks out in New Haven....then other resources will be employed. And where the most resources are will filter into your particular place. That's how what I've read lays this out.
NutmegYankee
(16,201 posts)Counties exist in name only for census purposes. The equipment would have to be in the hands of town or city police departments.
KoKo
(84,711 posts)The New England "Township System" of Govt. is still there....but how the Federal Government Allocates is still by Counties and CT still has Counties. But, since I lived in CT it seems that two of the counties I lived in have changed their status.
Connecticut's court jurisdictions still adhere to the county boundaries, except for Fairfield, Hartford and New Haven, which have been further subdivided into several jurisdictions.
That still doesn't mean that if Hartford or New haven had Riots that other Counties wouldn't be called in to offer resources by the Governor or Dept. of Homeland Security, though.
That's why we ALL SHOULD BE WORRIED....not matter WHAT STATE WE LIVE IN...because our State/County Laws are subservient to US Govt. and Military Police State.
That's what I think that we are trying to be awakened to....with what's going on with the Militarization of our Police that's been uncovered in Full View in the Ferguson Situation which is getting to the level of what we lived with in the 60's and early 70's.
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Connecticut Counties
List of counties in Connecticut
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
See also: List of United States counties and county-equivalents
Connecticut counties
This is a list of counties in Connecticut. There are currently eight counties in the U.S. state of Connecticut. Four of them were created in 1666, during the first consolidation of the colony of Connecticut from a number of smaller colonies. Two counties were created during colonial times, and two counties, Middlesex and Tolland, were created after American independence (both in 1785). Six of the counties are named for locations in England, where many early Connecticut settlers originated.[1]
Although Connecticut is divided into counties, there is no county government in Connecticut and local government consists of cities and towns.[2][3] County government was abolished in Connecticut in 1960, although the names remain for geographical purposes. Counties are, however, still used by the state to organize its judicial and state marshal system. Connecticut's court jurisdictions still adhere to the county boundaries, except for Fairfield, Hartford and New Haven, which have been further subdivided into several jurisdictions.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_counties_in_Connecticut
NutmegYankee
(16,201 posts)The towns love to bicker and poke each other in the eye. They won;'t share water half the time, let alone toys. I suspect that the equipment is already in the major cities where a riot most likely. The smaller towns just don't have the population or density to support a riot that would require much equipment to disperse.
KoKo
(84,711 posts)in Fairfield and New Haven Counties. Was there when Joe Lieberman was a Dem Activist...early 70's and on.
former9thward
(32,082 posts)Cops are not strolling around with that type of equipment in their day to day business. It is only brought out in a special situation.
NutmegYankee
(16,201 posts)former9thward
(32,082 posts)But you will not see a small town cop or a large city cop walking or riding around with that stuff on a normal beat.
NutmegYankee
(16,201 posts)Gone are the days of an officer knocking on the door to serve a warrant. Now they bust in with flash bangs to "prevent evidence destruction".
pinboy3niner
(53,339 posts)During a May Day march by Occupy L.A. in 2012, police made sure to provide an abundance of riot control protection for banks along the march route. At the Wells Fargo Bank...
A lone protester held a sign and shouted her 99% message at the bank. Does she look dangerous to anyone?
The BofA tower also had riot police posted there, and was surrounded by metal barriers for the day. Police in riot gear stationed throughout the L.A. financial district were just one part of the very heavy police presence that day...
L.A. County Sheriffs staged their armored vehicle and riot control deputies near the post-march Occupy rally at Pershing Square...
NutmegYankee
(16,201 posts)KoKo
(84,711 posts)and we lose the "officer knocking on door to serve a warrant."
That situation in Georgia where the Police through a Grenade into that Toddler/Babies Crip and maimed him for life for no justifiable reason..comes to mind. It was HORRIFIC.
NutmegYankee
(16,201 posts)The American Civil Liberties Union, of which I've been a member for nearly 2 decades, did a great report on it. https://www.aclu.org/war-comes-home-excessive-militarization-american-policing
KoKo
(84,711 posts)I think we agree but are nitpicking?