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WingDinger

(3,690 posts)
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 07:56 PM Apr 2012

The reason why Z is charged with murder two is

If it can be proved, that it is T begging for his life, either on 911, or by witness and it went on for some time, Z killed T in revenge, for beating his stupid ass.

All that has to be proved is that Trayvon begged for his life. Begging, proves that T was no longer a threat.

Simple as that.

T had a perfect right to drop Z and even kill him, if that one punch did it. As Z had confronted him, after glaring at him from his truck and being made by T, even asking if he was following. Then pursuing on foot. Especially then reaching for his pocket.


I most certainly would have.

17 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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The reason why Z is charged with murder two is (Original Post) WingDinger Apr 2012 OP
In all of this time, they may ferreted through the words of the neighbors who claim to be witnesses. freshwest Apr 2012 #1
That's a possibility. Without that, IMO, 2nd Degree is really really pushing it. MidwestTransplant Apr 2012 #2
I agree and I think the audio of Trayvon crying for help is devistating for Zimmerman Quixote1818 Apr 2012 #3
The Cries for Help mista411 Apr 2012 #4
they already are doing forensics on the tapes. We will know who it is. for sure. robinlynne Apr 2012 #5
Let Zimmy try to replicate it even while hearing it with headphones. WingDinger Apr 2012 #10
It's already been proven by around a 99% probability that it's not ZMan on the tape uponit7771 Apr 2012 #16
I am a little confused as to why it was only murder two, pennylane100 Apr 2012 #6
One reason, H2O Man Apr 2012 #7
If the prosecutor has any doubts that the grand jury would refuse to indict, amandabeech Apr 2012 #8
murder one is a much higher bar to prove magical thyme Apr 2012 #9
For 1st Degree murder, you have to be able to prove it was pre-meditated. That would be difficult sabrina 1 Apr 2012 #14
To me that makes it Murder One. MoonRiver Apr 2012 #11
I'm grateful he got charged, period Typical NYC Lib Apr 2012 #12
UM, you have less to worry about, as he will be forbidden to own a gun, or chase anyone, for any rea WingDinger Apr 2012 #15
Prosecutor is hoping that Zimmerman... -..__... Apr 2012 #13
+1 uponit7771 Apr 2012 #17

freshwest

(53,661 posts)
1. In all of this time, they may ferreted through the words of the neighbors who claim to be witnesses.
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 08:05 PM
Apr 2012

I am sure they can't arrest in a high-profile case like this without being able to prove reasonable cause, no matter what the public thinks, says or feels.

He can defend himself now in safety and with an attorney present, instead of by hearsay and rumors. This is the best outcome for everyone, including him.

Being on the run is no way to live, especially if one has children, too.

Quixote1818

(28,968 posts)
3. I agree and I think the audio of Trayvon crying for help is devistating for Zimmerman
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 08:17 PM
Apr 2012


If they didn't have that audio I don't think anything would have happened and Zimmerman would have been let off.

mista411

(11 posts)
4. The Cries for Help
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 08:33 PM
Apr 2012

I expect that Z's attorney will try to persuade the jury that it was Z crying for help. If the jury finds otherwise, he's done.

 

WingDinger

(3,690 posts)
10. Let Zimmy try to replicate it even while hearing it with headphones.
Thu Apr 12, 2012, 12:15 PM
Apr 2012

Then, analyze it. If the glove doesnt fit, throw the book at him.

uponit7771

(90,364 posts)
16. It's already been proven by around a 99% probability that it's not ZMan on the tape
Thu Apr 12, 2012, 02:45 PM
Apr 2012

The tape is damning, I doubt it would be allowed

pennylane100

(3,425 posts)
6. I am a little confused as to why it was only murder two,
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 08:35 PM
Apr 2012

It seems clear that Zimmerman was armed and following Martin. The last eleven times he had called 911 to report what he thought was suspicious activity, the people he was checking on were all black. There is no way that can be considered a coincidence. He was racially profiling the people in his neighborhood. When he finally went too far and killed one of them, how is this not a hate crime.


 

amandabeech

(9,893 posts)
8. If the prosecutor has any doubts that the grand jury would refuse to indict,
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 08:42 PM
Apr 2012

then the prosecutor would charge him or her self, as Ms. Corey has done.

By not going to a grand jury, the prosecutor does not risk losing the case before it can get going.

It may also be that the evidence does not support a charge of murder one.

Really, we'll know more later when the prosecutor has to make a filing including the particulars of the charge and the evidence supporting the charge.

 

magical thyme

(14,881 posts)
9. murder one is a much higher bar to prove
Wed Apr 11, 2012, 08:51 PM
Apr 2012

Any profiling was due to the fact that there were burglaries in the neighborhood by a suspect who was black.

Zimmerman has a history of having helped a black homeless person in the past, and other history that suggested he wasn't a racist.

That he was armed and following Martin doesn't prove he did so with the intent to kill him. His history of wanting to be a cop suggests he could have planned to apprehend him and turn him over to the police when they arrived.

Better to go with the charges you can prove in court than risk losing. Even more so, given that there is a parallel investigation by the federal government. They can bring their own hate crime charges if they find the evidence they need.



sabrina 1

(62,325 posts)
14. For 1st Degree murder, you have to be able to prove it was pre-meditated. That would be difficult
Thu Apr 12, 2012, 01:08 PM
Apr 2012

not just in this case, but it's almost always difficult. And juries don't like to convict someone when the charges seem to exceed the crime so Prosecutors go for what they think they can prove.

MoonRiver

(36,926 posts)
11. To me that makes it Murder One.
Thu Apr 12, 2012, 12:18 PM
Apr 2012

But I understand why they couldn't go there. I'm grateful for Murder Two.

 

WingDinger

(3,690 posts)
15. UM, you have less to worry about, as he will be forbidden to own a gun, or chase anyone, for any rea
Thu Apr 12, 2012, 02:38 PM
Apr 2012

reason having to do with playing wannabe cop.

Oh, and I believe that manslaughter of any flavor, in Florida, is a 9.5 year mandatory.

The truly dangerous shit was because poppy had sheltered junior from legal jeaopardy has whole life. Therefore, he was clean as a whistle. Ish.

 

-..__...

(7,776 posts)
13. Prosecutor is hoping that Zimmerman...
Thu Apr 12, 2012, 01:08 PM
Apr 2012

will plead down to a lesser charge of manslaughter and avoid a trial that might not
end up with a guilty finding of 2nd degree murder.

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