much and it would be difficult and expensive as well. And requiring people to read Plato? Just wtf.

Possible solutions for both problems. I am sure there are other, perhaps even better ways to get people engaged, and to think critically. This is just an idea.

The problem needs solved.

"History has tried to teach us that we can't have good government under politicians. Now, to go and stick one at the very head of government couldn't be wise." Mark Twain

IIRC, he once described a political editor as being almost perfectly suited for his job, needing only a stay in a penitentiary to become perfect.

Not the precise phrase, but I believe it was the gist.

Required voting MIGHT work.

I would argue the act of not voing can be a form of protest and as such it should be protected under the first amendment. People should have the right to vote, but also the right not to vote.

If we don't get involved in politics, the corrupt and venal (who ARE involved) will use the system to fuck the rest of us, sideways.

There are lots of laws against harming yourself on the books already. This is just another one.

Look at the participation rate over the past 75 years-see the ebb and flow. Then look at what happens when people choose not to vote. The common person takes the hit.

You are quite right that the law exists elsewhere. I'd prefer it not have to be done here, but I can't think of another way we can drive turnout: at least, in the face of that enormous skulk of foxes that are currently running our collective henhouse.

Doesn't matter if they vote Democratic Party, Tea Party, or Lemon Party. (OK, maybe not that last one.) Just the fact that they got out and participated SOMEHOW. Even if they do a write-in for Pee Wee Herman. Incentivize them somehow. Give them swag, like stickers or a backpack or something, ANYTHING, some sort of carrot on a stick.

Heck, how about a voucher for free ice cream? Get Baskin-Robbins (do they still exist?) to participate. Free ice cream if you voted. You don't get your free ice cream if you don't show up at the polls, because if you don't eat your meat, you can't have any pudding. Have some contest entries to win a vacation, or an iPad, or, heck, a date with your favorite politically-active celebrity.

Or, you know how, kind of like when you're caller number 10 on a radio show and you win a smaller prize at that point, then you're entered automatically in the pool for a bigger prize? You call up the station and win a Neil Diamond CD, but you're also entered to win the grand prize: an all-expenses-paid trip to NYC to go see Neil at Madison Square Garden and reservations at the Plaza Hotel, where you and a friend or loved one get transported in a limo to the show where you get front-row seats. That's what we need to do. Make it fun. Make it a prize. The "gift" of participating in democracy just isn't cutting it anymore. We need Neil Diamond to come to America.

.......that are critically important to you but not necessarily to someone else do you want the government to make mandatory for everyone else? Would you be agreeable to having the government mandate the priorities of others on you?

Personally, I agree that voting is a terribly important right that we're afforded in this Country and I never, ever fail to vote in any election. But personal freedom and personal choice are far more important IMO. So yeah, I have a huge problem with your suggestion. You live by your priorities and allow others to live by theirs.

Non-involvement isn't just personal: it impacts us all.

Chances are you're just going to have to accept that fact.

People had the right to blow their cigarette smoke in our faces, and that has been taken away in many locations. Because individual rights do not always trump the rights of the rest of us.

People had the right to not wear seatbelts, and that has been taken away in many locations. Because individual rights do not always trump the rights of the rest of us.

People had the right to dump antifreeze and used motor oil in ditches to keep the weeds down, and that has been taken away in many locations. Because individual rights do not always trump the rights of the rest of us.

When society and law reach a common consensus, the law of the land is made to reflect that consensus. But until activists work to build that paradigm, nothing will change.

I have a cause and will fight for it. Others will do as they see fit, of course.

I am going to turn in a blank ballot.

OK, so next you make it illegal not to make a selection in every race. In that case, I will write in a fictional character in every race.

So then, make it illegal to spoil a ballot with fictional characters or unqualified individuals. In that case, you would need to match my ballot to me in order to prosecute. Which is the end of secret balloting. So I quit voting altogether, get fined, fight the fine, and then refuse to pay the fine.

Your intentions are good, but this is a BAD idea.

Elitist and misogynist.

The effort and engagement, critical thought are the takeaways SFAIK. No ivory tower vision of a utopian system is gonna work.

Same with Twain: I certainly don't buy every one of his ideas. But to read him is to have your horizons expanded and to think in a different way.

And that was the point of the OP. Voting and to think about your vote.

In all fairness the guy was a radical feminist in his age, as he acknowledge women could rule when the dominant opinion of ancient greece was that the smartest woman was only as intelligent as the dumbest man. Not up to our standards, but he was goddamned space age for his time.

But I still wouldn't want to live in his Republic.

They consistently have turnout in excess of 90%. The more you can do to encourage voting the better for everyone.

Are we going to lock people up for failure to vote. Is not voting in a primary or midterm just a misdemeanor, but failure to vote for the president a felony? Do we need to organize and fund a new government agency, maybe the Department of Voting Enforcement? Maybe they too will procure some military surplus items. Nothing says freedom like federal government agents armed with automatic weapons and checking your papers at your local polling place. If voting is mandatory, I'm certain no one here would then object to national voter photo ID cards to prevent fraud and criminality?

Also, if voting is actually mandated in Australia, a 10% noncompliance rate isn't all that impressive.

In any event, last I checked, we did not live in Australia and have a number of constitutional provisions that would prohibit mandatory voting, to the extent such a law could ever pass Congress.

Lastly, why necessarily would universal, mandated voting be "better for everyone." Would you still feel the same if more of the conservative half of America turned-out to vote and Republicans dominated all the levers of government?

The reason the Teapubbies have taken over is that most of the Wingnuts are voting and the moderate majority aren't.

Increased participation tends to result in a more diverse electorate.

Moreover, would you care to show aggregate polling data that indicated most Americans hold left-wing views. The fact is that most Americans are really quite "moderate," in that they hold a range of views that cannot easily be categorized.

Simply, not only is mandatory voting in the USA likely unconstitutional, very unpopular across party and demographic lines, would probably result in further disenfranchisement and imposed criminality on minorities and the poor, it could very well produce results that are decidedly not progressive.

I, and many others, have no objections to policies that actually encourage voting, such as making election day a federal holiday, expanded voting by mail, etc. However, I see no need to actually compel people to engage in civic participation, nor expand the federal criminal code.

Or get left behind.

with two weeks to mull it over and mail it back. That's how we do it in Oregon, and it really is nice. We usually have voter turnout of 70-80%.

in high school curriculums and make them one of the mandatory courses needed to graduate. The lack of understanding of governance at all levels is breathtaking, imo.

I found this interesting site that tracks voter turnout in many countries and it shows the drop in midterms becoming noticeable around 1974, Presidential elections turnouts have dropped but marginally in comparison. Here is the link to the site in case your interested:

http://www.idea.int/vt/countryview.cfm?id=231

Note: the column with the voter turnout is the second column, they have another column called VAT which I have yet to figure out exactly what the percentages mean.

to not be able to vote

this post is so fucking stupid.

of the bible and Fox on the Internet.

Since reading those books is apparently mandatory, what do you do when the Republicans insist on adding other books to the list? Say, Democracy in America? Or perhaps the Federalist Papers? Or I don't know how full of themselves they'll get, but what if they insist that people read and test out on Limbaugh's books?

What a bunch of crap. No thanks.

to vote FOR?

Most of us are really sick of the current situation. I'd love to walk into my polling place, for example, and get the choice of voting out capitalism.

I'd vote for National Health Care, paper ballots with hand counts, and the abolition of the two-party system, myself.

Teabaggers would find a very different set of incentives. So would anarchists, and so on.