it supposedly caught it on tape, so we'll find out soon enough.

Meanwhile, have you seen the picture of the airsoft gun that was recovered at the scene?



Can you tell the difference?
If I saw that, I would think it's real, and I have 40 years in the Army handling a wide variety of weapons.

But as the mother of two boys, how difficult is it to "Knock" that orange plastic tip off???? Was the TOY made in the USA? I only remember one USA company that advertised it's product as "indestructible" - Timex!! How many times does the toy have to be dropped??? How many times does it have to be "banged" against the door frame??
I think sometimes we're forgetting what it's like to be a child, which is such a shame. We are holding them to adult standards - that adults can't meet themselves.
The police told him to "drop the weapon and put his hands up". Imagine the terror of being yelled at by the police, our children have been watching the news reports, old style and new style media, so they are aware of the deathly danger the police pose to young people, especially young men - red, yellow, brown, black and white. A lot of the responses here are from adults who are in a state of terror and panic, making a speech in front of a live audience in public. Stop this is nonsense.
If we as adults can't deal with children, maybe we shouldn't have occupations where we must come, the horror, into contact with them - ever!!!

Point is that the kid was told to raise his hands, instead he reached for the gun in his waistband, whether to show the cops that it wasn't real, in confusion, who knows at this point, but if the cops story hold true and the video supports their story, then this was a justifiable homicide and there will be no charges filed.

to cover up for his cowardly over-reaction. Just one possible scenario, but certainly no less likely than others.

Every time I read one of these threads, looking for news, there you are, and your pal branford, spewing the same propaganda.


I bet I'm not the only one who sees you both in all these threads, saying the same damn thing but never speaking to each other. Interesting.

don't read what we're saying or.......hit the ignore button, your problem is solved.

I can be a responsible adult member of this community and point out fraudulent information put out by people with an obvious agenda.

Now here's a solution for you: pack up that carpet-bag and report to your fellows that you failed.

what fraudulent info?

So, again, if I bug you this much, I would urge you to use the ignore function here and you won't have to read anymore of my accurate posts.

by those that see through you, so you can continue to spread propaganda.

I have no intention of making your job easy, so you can stop "instructing" me on how to take out the trash.

then, carry on.

I was never a cop, I'm a retired Army Attack Helo driver.
OK?

whats with all the emotion?

it dovetails nicely with "Commitment". Both are the children of Outrage.

I did that myself once with a fake gun that was part of a Halloween costume before I knew what the purpose was of the orange tip. I have no excuse to not have realized at the time the purpose of the orange tip and should have seeing as I was an adult at the time. I'm still mad at myself for doing that figuring that out.

Turns out I ended up deciding on a different costume anyway and the toy gun never left the house. I may even still have it somewhere since I've never been very good at throwing stuff out if it fits somewhere.

This was a tragic death of a 12 year old child that shouldn't have happened.
The 911 info about the gun possibly being fake wasn't relayed to the responding officers, the child shouldn't have reached for the gun, and whoever removed that orange tip is hugely responsible for this poor childs death..

Now another family has to plan a funeral for a child all because some fucking jackass removed the one thing that could have identify the gun as fake and 911 didn't pass on pertinent info.

If it fired any sort of projectile it wouldn't have had the orange tip nor is it required to. Last I heard it was a BB gun, but I still don't know what sort of gun it was. Yes, if it was a legally defined toy gun that had an orange tip that was removed than whoever did it was an idiot.

Seeing as I made the mistake of disguising the orange tip of a toy gun because I never considered the reason the orange tip was there or why there should be a giant warning notice on the tag or packaging of toy guns. I got mine at a Halloween shop though and it had no packaging or tag at all. None of the larger toy guns did. Come to think of it, I don't think the smaller toy ones did either.

I disguised mine with black nail polish never imagining what the purpose of the orange tip was though I should have thought about that first. I never noticed that all the toy guns also had these orange tips, and if I did maybe I would have wondered about the purpose then. Since I made that mistake and did disguise the orange tip and so easily I'm sure that others would have as well never figuring out why as I did.

Since I never ended up using that costume and it never left the house, I was lucky that nothing happened to me because of it though I would think with the costume to match, it being Halloween, and the style of the gun was obviously one from the early 1900's even if I had used it for that party likely it would have been assumed that it wasn't real.

So I can see an adult seeing the orange tip, not realizing what it's purpose was and not really thinking about it might disguise it or whack it off. But not if it looked like an authentic bullet firing gun because then I WOULD have thought, "Crap, what if someone thinks that it's real?" and not want to take that chance. Generally, I'm adverse to toy guns (legally classified toy guns) and had I had children it wouldn't be something I'd get them anyway - I would never want my child to believe that guns are fun particularly in the society we have today.

appear to be so terrified of everything, it makes you wonder WHY they are out there, scared to death, even of children, armed to the teeth and itching to fire.

Is there ANY other civilized country in the world where anyone would even try to justify that?

A child is dead, he was a kid. I know dozens of people who would not have been scared to ask that child 'is that a real gun, or a toy gun'?

This country gets scarier by the day.

It doesn't matter if the gun was held by a 12 or 22 year old, if it was real and fired, you would be equally dead or severely injured. Moreover, simply watch or read the news to confirm that 12 year olds are more than capable of carnage.

You don't get to judge the police officers by what you know now, only by what the officers knew at the time of the incident.

Did they reasonably believe their actions were necessary to protect themselves and other innocent bystanders, including other children. If their story is accurate, and we have the benefit of a video, the answer clearly appears to be "yes." That does not lessen the tragedy of the the child's death, only exonerates the officers of any wrongdoing.

If you wish to approach unknown 12 year old boys with real or realistic guns, particularly in response to a 911 call, good luck. However, you have no right to insist that others, including the police, needless gamble with their lives.

I have faced far more threatening situations that that in my life, and managed to NOT SHOOT A CHILD.

However, until such time that you can virtually guarantee that 12 year old boys are incapable and unlikely of possessing a firearm and shooting other children or adults, causing serious injury and death, the only life you're allowed to gamble is your own.

I would stress, however, that just because this shooting appears justified under all laws and relevant procedures, does not mean shooting all children who appear to possess a firearm is mandated in all situations. In fact, if the officers' account is true, if the boy simply raised his hands when ordered to do so, a very reasonable, easy to understand, and entirely expected demand under the circumstances, he would be alive and unharmed today. It's not like the officers showed up at a playground and just started shooting at kids.

Discretion and prudence is certainly required in all circumstances. I just simply do not understand the knee-jerk and unqualified outrage at the officers' conduct given what we currently know. It appears that to many, the only way any officer could prove he acted properly is if he's shot. Police procedures and the law are designed in such manner to keep officers and innocent bystanders unharmed when faced with an armed suspect. It's also only appropriate to judge the officers on what they knew during the incident, not withthe benefit of later investigation, insight and extended and relaxed introspection.

There is a fair chance that I've seen that kid before.

This is a tough area - it's not far from the area where the three women were abducted by Ariel Castro and held captive for ten years. Just a few years ago a police officer was shot and killed in the same neighborhood. Also in recent years, a convenience store nearby was robbed; the clerk and a customer were shot dead (customer was a mother who just went in to buy baby formula while her husband waited in the car). My home has been burgled twice; all of my neighbors' homes have been burgled. There are teenage kids who roam the streets looking for trouble - and they usually find it, like that evening a couple of years ago when a cluster of teenaged boys went down my street kicking in screen doors (including mine)...just for the fun of it. A neighbor of mine was working in his yard last summer when a group of mid-teenagers 'out for a stroll' ambled by calling out "hey motherf*ckers"...etc. and laughing about it (I saw this happening). The neighbor adminished them for their foul language and they piled up on him. It goes on and on.

This kid probably had anything to do with any of those things, but there a lots of kids here who are astonishingly hardened and insolent (the adult role models in their lives, such as they are, are responsible for this) The law-abiding people who live here -and the law enforcement who serve here- are not going to assume that a youth with a gun is merely playing with a toy. This is a tragedy - of environment.

No doubt it will be ignored because it makes sense.

First, any gun that fires any kind of projectile is not classified as a toy. Therefore, it is not required to have the bright orange tip. No toy guns made outside of the country are allowed in the country if they do not have the bright orange tip. The obvious problem here is that any projectile firing gun that by law is not classified as a toy whether or not it fires bullets should never be thought of as a toy nor handled as a toy.

Manufactures of toy guns classified as toys have no problem making them with the bright orange tip whether foreign or domestic since their business is to sell actual toy guns that do not fire any kind of projectile and for which they do a very tidy business. If they want to sell any kind of gun that fires some kind of projectile other than bullets they aren't required to have the orange tip nor are they required to make it look like a toy in any other way because it isn't classified as a toy. So of course they have an interest in making such guns look like authentic bullet firing guns since that is what makes them so popular thus more sales.

Second, anyone allowing their child to walk about in public with a gun that appears to all the world as a bullet firing gun whether it is one or not that does not have the bright orange tip is a fucking idiot putting their child in danger and possibly causing real fear among the public.

Third, anyone allowing their child to have a projectile firing gun whether it fires bullets or something else that does not have the orange tip without teaching the child to handle it appropriately and always under adult supervision is an idiot. As far as I'm concerned buying such a gun for their child is idiocy all by itself since children can't be trusted to understand the importance of appropriately handling such a gun nor why.

As for the police, they are required to assume that a gun that appears to be a bullet firing gun is one whether it is one or not. The risk of not doing so is far too great since there is no way to know if it is real or not and that it COULD be real. A gun that appears to be a bullet firing gun in the hands of a child is more of a danger because children can't be expected to know or understand how and why to appropriately handle it nor the importance of following police orders immediately.

Who is most at fault in this incident is the parents of this child that bought them a gun that appeared to all the world as a real bullet firing gun yet did not keep it away from the child to ensure that it only be used by the child under adult supervision and in such an area that would not arouse fear in the public nor did they teach the child to handle it appropriately or the child was too young and immature to understand any such teaching.

The events occurred as they did because a young child had a gun that appeared to be a real bullet firing gun and who was allowed to handle it alone and out in public when they obviously either weren't taught to handle it appropriately and why or the child was too young to understand any such teaching added to the child being allowed to have the gun without adult supervision.

Children far younger than this one have killed with real bullet firing guns either because they didn't know how to handle one appropriately or why and because one was available to them with or without supervision and some have also shot real bullet firing guns at people on purpose. Therefore, it is never safe to assume that a bullet firing gun in the hands of a child is not a danger. Cripes, everyone with a functioning brain knows that a gun in the hands of a child is a danger and why guns in homes with children in them need to be securely locked away from their being able to get their hands on them. There are more than enough deaths of children or adults by children who were able to get their hands on a real bullet firing gun to get that though to people yet all the time people still are so careless with their real bullet firing guns around children and react in surprise when a tragic shooting by a child occurs.

I'm of the opinion that any sort of projectile firing gun should never be allowed in the hands of a young child with or without supervision. Children should be taught that guns are dangerous, and that shooting them or pointing them at anyone isn't FUN. I don't see a problem with teaching children to hunt as long as they are adult supervised and that anything killed is for eating but that killing an animal for food is not FUN but a necessity of life. Killing even an animal should never be considered FUN.

I think that it is abundantly apparent that guns that are not classified as toys but don't fire real bullets that look for all the world as real in the hands of children or idiots that don't understand how that gun will be viewed by the public and the police is a major problem. And we already have a major problem when it comes to real bullet firing guns that get into the hands of children or adults with no appreciation of handling or using them appropriately.

When guns are made readily available to children by careless and stupid adults and that gun is used by a child who shoots someone accidentally or on purpose whether they kill them or not there should be major penalties to the gun owner that includes jail time instead of treating it as a tragic accident for which compassion only is given. Cripes, when a child is struck and killed by a car because said child ran into the street after a lost ball and the vehicle driver is subject to criminal charges, why the hell are people who leave guns out for children to get a hold of not also facing criminal charges when a child gets one in their hands and shoots someone including their own selves?

I think the OP is stupid as it once again puts all blame on the police even accusing them of lying about the incident. Any dope should understand that no one - especially the police - has or SHOULD have the luxury of assuming that a gun in anyones' hands that looks for all the world as a real gun is a toy or non-bullet firing gun. The risk that hoping it is a non-bullet firing gun is obviously far too great. A civilian is free to take that risk if they want, but a police officer cannot and SHOULD not.

REALLY - your throwing up this same argument in another thread with me and I keep asking you why you never show the picture of the Little 12yr old boy and you only post the picture of the gun

Is it because in your world 12yr old Black Youth don't matter and only Guns do ? Or is it in your world 12yr old Black youth don't matter and only Cops do?

Either way its pretty apparent to you 12yr old Black Youth do not matter

is that gun was pointed at you?

All this "Thinly Veiled" KKK like behavior is getting pretty old around here

Brave on that keyboard.

I think you'd run like hell.

You certainly don't know me. You should be a bit more cautious before implying cowardice, whilst hiding behind your own monitor.



Since you brought up opinions, I think you're a very rude person with little awareness of any reality that doesn't match pre-conceived notions.

I happily lived over 10 years in a neighborhood "affectionately" labeled The War Zone. I have been awakened to the screams of a woman across the street who had just stabbed her boyfriend to death. I was 20 feet away when two rival gang members shot each other car to car because they recognized each other on a major thoroughfare. I've intervened when a prostitute was having the crap beaten out of her by two pimps in my front yard. I've watched kids running from a neighborhood celebration ditch a gun in the neighbor's yard. I've stood up to dealers and pimps on my street and had my life threatened by them.

There are many of us who would NOT run like hell. There are many of us who talk to a kid with a weapon. There are many of us who find out the facts. What's going on? Is the kid playing? In trouble? Sorry to bust your world view that everyone's a coward or should be, but if you live in a tough end of town you get a sense really fast about what's a real threat and what's not, and you develop some compassion and common sense about dealing with the people around you.

And told me he would blow my fucking head off if I moved. He and his friend proceeded to take my purse and drove off in my car. He was arrested in his 5th grade class, it turned out the gun was not a toy, but I would not have known that at the time. So, no I didn't laugh and point my finger back at him and say "Bang." And you sir would be a fool if you didn't do likewise.

Where did this picture come from??? Is it proper police procedure to unofficially distribute pictures of evidence??

They go to extremes to put out propaganda supporting the killing of Black Youth

Last edited Mon Nov 24, 2014, 09:25 AM - Edit history (2)

Below you will see the tip of an airsoft handgun that is similar to the picture of the gun in the box, you will notice that the orange tip is a colored tube, a piece of colored plastic. It CANNOT be scratched off. The orange of its tip can't be scratched off. It might be broken off or otherwise removed. But scratching off? No it's not a painted or laminated covering.

Now the toy alleged to be present at the homicide may not be an 'airsoft' but as abcnews reports rather 'an airsoft type' spring powered pellet gun which may be different





The picture you show is what the police want us to know. And it doesn't reveal any of the critical detail of the muzzle so we can't be sure what it looks like. So far I haven't seen a report of the manufacturer and model type of the toy.

Frankly what we have is a picture, and it might not even be a picture of the toy involved. We as readers of the internet actually don't know the provenance. And critically we don't know what the muzzle looks like...nothing is in that picture that suggests an orange paint or laminated plastic was scratched off or that an orange plastic barrel tip was removed.

We do know that this is a piece of evidence being displayed for the purpose of 'clearing' the officer. In that sense it's potentially being presented in a biased manner that leads us to conclude that the officer believed it was real

But, here's another thing, considering how guns are tucked into the waist of a pair of pants muzzle first, the tip actually -isn't- visible.
The reporting says the officer shot on seeing the boy 'reach' toward something in a waistband that was perceived to be a gun.

We are led to the reasonableness of that claim because the reporting also says that the officer -saw- the boy tuck a black gun in his waistband.

Only the officer knows what the officer thought he saw, for us to know what he thinks he saw it must be assumed that he has reported that. He's clearly not an unbiased reporter.

And it's clearly in his interest and the interest of his department to say he thought there was a real gun present. The police releasing that claim about what the officer saw did so to turn public opinion.

So what we seem to have is the police presenting to the public a preliminary conclusion "of facts" by releasing three details of evidence that can't be challenged, and they did so for the purpose of supporting a police officer through prejudicing public opinion.

Its a toy gun.

I can't understand the pushback you are getting.

I lived in that neighborhood as a kid and when police shot a troublemaker there was celebration, rather than demonstration.

The only thing that's for sure is that some people are shooting themselves in the foot!

That gun looked real. There are pictures all over DU showing it. Before going further take a look at the gun. Plus he sawed the orange clip off so he probably wanted it to look real. This is not even close to Zimmerman or Brown cases.

a citizen has his doubts but a trained officer doesnt? the officer apparently wasnt even told that the caller said it was probably fake from dispatch.

id like to know how much time the officer allowed the kid to surrender before shooting. did he give him any verbal commands? was it like the wall mart killing where the cops just ran up and started shooting without giving the victim a chance to do anything?

sounds like a few things happen to end up with this kids death but none of them the fault of the kid cept maybe removing the orange plastic thing.

Look at the damned photos I posted in this thread, I've handled firearms my whole life, recreationally and professionally, I can't tell the difference, especially in a high stress situation like that.

Read the story, they approached the kid and told him to raise his hand above his head, instead, for whatever reason, he reached for the gun in his waistband, causing the officer's to fear for their lives.

a very realistic looking gun.
The only bigotry is yours.

and from your extensive arguments all over this forum for all intensive reasoning it appears you fully support that

got any explanation before you slither out of here

You're full of it.
I never said that, so you are lying and if my post gets hidden, so be it, but I won't stand by while the likes of you lie about what I said and congrats to being my very first person on ignore.
Bye Bye, enjoy your naked hatred for all things cop.

You fucking bet I'll admit to that

If this was the first incident of Cops killing children over a toy you or the cops your defending might get a pass. But its not - this same "Get the Brown Skinned before they get you" shootings keep happening all over this country again and again and again.

ITS A FUCKING BADGE

Not a license to shoot Black and Brown Youth at will for no fucking reason for Criste sake.

You would think with all the other cases of this happening in the country ANY REASONABLE officer would be on guard for this tragedy not to happen to him.

BUT NO - THE KILLINGS KEEP HAPPENING AGAIN and AGAIN and AGAIN

Looks real, so cops are justified with impulsively firing lethal hits into a 12 year old boy sitting on a swing???

Your analogy is absurd.

Your off your game lately...I still love ya.

...but...

That makes no sense...

Even a child knows...

*opens mouth and promptly shuts it*



I tell myself that you know how .. mmm... silly that is and you are just lashing out because your emotions have gotten the better of you. That's pretty much the only way to justify something as ... fanciful.. as that.

They no longer employ thought or standard of service to the community they are paid to protect. They have become tin soldiers....

It sounds like he got shot when he moved his hand in the direction of his waistband.

The cop shot prematurely. And a 12-year-old boy is dead.

they can respond?

When the person has the gun squarely pointed at them? Once a round has been fired? How about several to make sure it wasn't an accident...

The time from draw to fire is less than a second... but I'm sure you would have seen the innocence in his eyes or some such...

but in this case, with the available info so far, it seems that the cop acted out of self preservation.
If the video shows different, I'll acknowledge it and be the first to call for charges against the officers.

What "training" would permit the officer at the time of the shooting to be able to ascertain whether the gun was real other than its appearance? Particularly without the orange plug, it was designed to look identical to a real firearm. As you note, the officers were also not informed about the doubts expressed by the 911 caller, nor the basis for the doubts.

If the boy actually moved his hand toward what to any reasonable person appeared to be a real gun, rather than raise both his hands as allegedly directed by the officers, the police response appears appropriate, if tragic.

If the police story is accurate, the boy had a chance to surrender when he was told to raise his hands.

As I indicated earlier, the video should put most, if not all, doubts soundly to rest.

Why do 'publicons have such problems spelling that word?

In any event, there is at least one video, and additional evidence and testimony will likely soon be available.

In addition to the officers' account, a photo of the Airsoft gun, with the previously removed orange marker, has already been released. It is indistinguishable from an actual firearm.

However, I doubt that even multiple clear high-definition videos corroborating the officers' stories will satisfy the demands by some for "justice."

I look forward to the release of the video.

The officer's story doesn't paint the kid as a deranged maniac, stop with the bullshit.
It's wholly possible that when the cops told him to raise his hands, he became confused and attempted to pull the gun out of his waistband to show them it wasn't real, at that point, the cops felt their lives were in danger and took appropriate action according to their ROE's.

That's just as possible as your "scenario".

that they HAD to draw their guns and shoot him dead, because he had a b-b gun,
then they should not be serving on a police force in the first place.

Police are expected to face REAL dangerous MoFos, with REAL guns; and to
be smart enough to know the fucking difference between them and a 12 y.o. with a b-b gun.

He hadn't fired a deadly weapon at the police. If he HAD "fired" the police
would have instantly known it was just a b-b gun.

But no, they had to just unload their guns on the kid without taking cover and
talking to him, like adults.

What happened here is fucked up. It's not right.
I cannot sign on for this kind of malfeasance to pass as legitimate "police work".

according to you, the police have to wait to be fired upon before they can return fire.

I guess you're not as dead if a 12 year old shoots you?

They didn't "unload their guns" on this kid, 2 shots were fired, not a whole magazine.

I guess you didn't read the story, your clear bias has already made your mind up that the cops murdered this kid.

.. to say hell no, and to push back on the current police crusade to empower themselves to usher in a draconian POLICE STATE, with Police fully empowered to assault, kill and maim citizens at-will, to seize citizens' property at-will, to break down our front doors at 3 am with SWAT goons and attack dogs at-will under specious pretenses, and so forth.

That is my bias and I own it, proudly.

I think we need to scrap our system of policing and corrections and contract it all out to the Dutch.
http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/world/europe/article4201509.ece

Do you really believe a cop should need to be shot BEFORE shooting to defend themselves?

but I bet if it had been a 12 year old blonde WHITE girl the cops would have
been a bit slower to start shooting. I'd bet money on it.

Did you read about how dangerous that neighborhood is? Apparently there is a lot of gunplay in that area.

The police apparently believed he had a real gun. It was an Airsoft replica with the orange plug removed. It is indistinguishable from a real firearm by visual inspection, particularly without the plug. Have you seen the pictures?

Also, you are just as dead or injured if shot by someone who is 12, 22 or 92. The bullets fired by a minor do not hurt less, and juveniles are certainly capable and willing to engage in carnage. You simply have to turn on the news for proof.

after first being fired upon? That is ludicrous, contrary to police procedures and prudent tactics everywhere, and will result is lots of very innocent and very dead police officers.

Some folks here are very clearly of the mindset that some dead cops would be better than a dead kid or young adult no matter what they did to precipitate it.

Their job is to enforce the law...

As sad as it is, with the story as reported, the kid's own actions mandated the lethal response from the Officer.

That's why police are trained and we have laws in place to deal with these situations.

If the accounts by the police officers are proven true, they had a more than sufficient fear for their lives and those of innocent bystanders to fire on the boy. The shooting can be both entirely justified and very tragic.

There is no jurisdiction in the USA where a police officer has to actually first be shot at as a condition precedent to firing on a suspect.

It's horrifying that some people appear to believe that the lives of police officers are little more than disposable.

There appear to be a number of poor choices that led to the unfortunate death of the boy, but again, if the officers' story is accurate, their decision to fire appears appropriate under the circumstances. The officers can only be judged on the information they knew at the time of the shooting, and a 12 year old with a gun is more than capable of causing severe carnage at a playground during the afternoon.

Rather than casually dismiss the lives of police officers, look to the manufacturers of "toys" indistinguishable from real guns, the individual who removed the orange plug denoting the gun as a "toy," the people who provided the "toy" to the boy, the parents or guardians for lack of appropriate supervision, and even the boy, who at 12, was more than capable to knowing not to wave an Airsoft around a playground, no less disobey or ignore orders from a police officer.

but don't just gun the kid down when you don't yet know what/who you are dealing with.

or at least relevant scholarly citations, to indicate that the best, safest and most prudent procedure when dealing with armed juvenile suspects who do not obey police instructions is to always permit them to fire first?

And yes, the 12 year old was in fact a "suspect." The scare quotes add little to the discussion. The police were called to the playground due to a 911 call indicating someone was waving around a gun. They quite correctly identified the boy with the gun. He was therefore a suspect. Just because someone is a suspect, does not make them guilty of a crime, justify shooting them without appropriate cause, or lessen the tragedy of their death.

Note that children much younger than 12 have been suspects (and actually convicted) in a whole host of crimes, including possession and use of a firearm.

but other kids around on the playground make it another question.

That's not impossible. A 12 year old with a gun is more dangerous than a 33 year old without one.

from "proving" that it's even remotely likely to occur.

Nothing is impossible That doesn't mean police are entitled to
gun down 12 year olds for waving around a bb gun, however
"realistic"

it being a BB gun. At least judge them fairly based on what they knew at the time.

I'm convinced that if the 12 year old had been a WHITE Blonde female, the cops
would not have ASSUMED she was "dangerous" so quickly and started firing.

risk it. Not in this case anyway. In the Brown or Zimmerman scenarios.

One school shooter was a girl, so if it appeared a girl had a gun and was going to shoot, that'd be believable too.

I get that police would feel threatened and that a bullet from a 12-year-old is the same as from a 40-year-old, physically speaking, but if a 7-year-old girl is on the playground and holding what looks to be a gun, why not shoot her too? Would they handle the situation that way? What about a four-year-old?

The thing is, at some point, we expect people, including police, to assess the intent, capacity, responsibility, etc. on the part of the "gun" holder and in the case of a 7-year-old to think of ways to disarm them that don't include killing them. In fact, the first goal I thought was to disarm them to protect them from harming themselves.

My concern is that they unconsciously imputed intent to an African American male (and then went to fear, and then went into hyper defense, and thus went into aggression) in a way that they wouldn't with a blonde 12-year-old girl.

and she reaches towards her waistband when the cops arrive, then you're going to have a shot blonde girl.

The problem with having so many guns in this society is that there have been young shooters and it's not impossible for some kid to have one and be shooting. There was the Jonesboro shooting, for one example.

A four year old would create a different circumstance to judge them on. The four year could be not strong enough to pull the trigger. And is small enough to sneak up on before they can.

They have to make that judgment so quickly, it surprises me sometimes how much we second guess them and how much we are willing they should die in the process. It's not as if there is no way anyone would shoot a cop. There's a reason we have the term "suicide by cop." People shoot at them.