Nice try though

if you're black.

But I certainly wouldn't criminalize it.

The dragon doesn't like it when it doesn't get what it wants. And as time goes by, the dragon gets hungrier and hungrier.

When the dragon is hungry and sets its sights on you... YOU'RE FUCKED.

So yes, I do care that the laws are enforced. That's a far cry from saying someone deserves to die from violating a relatively minor law.
[hr][font color="blue"][center]"If you're bored then you're boring." -Harvey Danger[/center][/font][hr]

the fact he was making a buck the government wasn't going to get its taste of. He was breaking tax law.

I'm not good with that. Some are, I'm not. Seems to me the cigarettes he was selling, if not stolen, had already been taxed. He was breaking a law written to ensure the government always gets its tribute. He broke that law while the dragon was watching, and lost his life for it.

Every LEO on the scene should be prosecuted.

a silent but deadly.

but I couldn't resist

There were videos. It was an illegal choke hold? Who doesn't struggle when being choked and denied air? And for something so absurd...

the choke hold itself is not illegal, but banned by NYPD practices.

Not that excuses the officer not being indicted on at LEAST criminally negligent homicide.

Untaxed corporate profits are more offensive.

a thousand times no.

Two shits, not one shit, nada

So, really, this is a case of double-taxation.

Why not just drop the tax in New york about 4.00 so its not proffitable to smuggle them?

are used to help pay for things that everyone uses in the state, they go in to the general fund. If you eliminate that tax, you need to make up the revenue from someplace else.

asphyxiation without representation.

meanwhile not one CEO has been placed in a choke hold for moving their corporations to a Post Office box in the Bahamas to avoid

any kind of taxes.

A black male.

I don't care who sells what where. It was a guy trying to eek out a living in this economy. But NYC wants every nickle it can get no matter who it damages.

Fair disclosure, I don't smoke and haven't bought tobacco in decades. But if you buy a pack of cigarettes, don't you pay the tobacco tax (along with any sales tax) at the time of purchase? Doesn't it work like alcohol? If you buy a bottle of booze, you pay the liqueur tax at the time of purchase. Resale might or might not require a liqueur license depending on your locale, but the alcohol that has already been taxed isn't re-taxed after the bottle seal is broken, is it? Is tobacco any different?

It would seem to me that if you resell smokes that you've purchased and paid the tax on, they're yours, so why can't you distribute them to others if you want? Any applicable taxes, tobacco, sales, etc have already been paid. If you burn that pack of cigarettes instead, no one questions it in the least because you've purchased them and paid the necessary taxes. WTF?

He keeps it all. Either that or you get the cigs at a very low price.

Indian territory, usually. You buy them on tribal land, paying no tax, then take them outside that area and sell them cheaper than the tax would allow, and pocket the difference.

is built in to the price of the cigarettes. The retailer pays X dollars to the wholesaler, which includes the taxes. The wholesaler is the one responsible for the taxes, as they are the ones who put the state/local tax seal on the packs then seal them up into cartons

I worked for American Tobacco years ago, and I saw how it goes down.

Usually "untaxed cigarettes' are either bootlegged/stolen or bought in a place where there is no taxes and then brought in to be re-sold, with the retailer pocketing the extra money. (this assumes that the retailer got the cigarettes at a lower price than they would normally have, which is likely otherwise it makes no sense for them to buy them illegally in the first place).

Buy a van load in Virginia, and resell in NYC.

concerned.

Last edited Wed Dec 3, 2014, 09:34 PM - Edit history (1)

Or how about the Trust Fund babies/Capital Gains recipients paying their fare share? Can we treat them the same way? Ridiculous!

In the words of Ving Rhames from Pulp Fiction (paraphrased) "Did they really have to go all medieval on him?"

I'd say no.

Store owners complained about Garner because people buy from him instead of them.

He may not have actually been seen selling anything when the cop confronted him.

they issued tickets, parking violations, etc.

They were enforcing a law, but an out of control cop used a banned maneuver.

Priorities!

I do care if someone is breaking the law on a street corner.

In the Garner case, his selling of loosies resulted in complaints from local business owners, from whom he was taking sales from.

We need to enforce all of our laws, even the minor ones.

That does not mean I think that Garner deserved to die at the hands of an out of control NYPD officer using a maneuver that is banned by the NYPD

But no. Individual cigarette's are probably the bottom of the list of crimes I'm concerned about.

That said, it doesn't matter what they were trying to restrain Eric Garner for. I think they went too far.

especially 'loosies' are more likely to be selling them to minors. There is a crackdown on retailers from doing so, and if they get caught, they can lose their license to sell cigarettes.

Look, you know what is way, way more dangerous than cigarettes? Infinitely more dangerous?

A: Being a black man in America.

what the PO did was wrong and at a minimum he should have been indicted for criminally negligent homicide.

That doesn't mean that cops should stop enforcing laws. They just need to obey the laws (and NYPD regulations) while doing so.

your business will get shut down

Have a link?

How hard is it to see if there is a stamp on a pack of cigarettes? You gotta kill a guy?

You sell cigs with no stamp, you risk losing them and paying a fine.

Is that so hard?

No perspective whatsoever by those cops...or the law for that matter.

So, you drive to the reservation in CT, or down to VA, where the taxes are non-existent or much lower, buy a few hundred cartons, and sell them on the street (this works if the tax difference is enough that you can fit your transport costs in between the low-tax and high-tax price points).

And bring them back to NYC to sell one at a time?

What an absolute fiasco on NYPD's part.

I mean, if the guy is kind of flagrantly selling them to minors maybe that would be one thing, but this really seems like more of an issue for the state tax enforcement system.

Last edited Thu Dec 4, 2014, 01:40 AM - Edit history (1)

Actually being prosecuted and incarcerated where they belong

No tax should be greater than the price of the product that is being taxed.

Because those taxes fund the government. So yes, I do have a problem with somebody skipping out on paying their taxes because in the end those programs need to be funded.

You can argue over the notion of a sin tax to punish undesirable products, but at the end of the day we have a society that requires the government spend money which comes from taxes.

It's like how in the long run we are going to need to move away from funding the highway system via gasoline tax as in the future we won't be using gasoline thus leaving a significant funding gap.

that I wanted to buy less than 20 cigarettes at a time. That I couldn't do so was a bit of an irritant. If you're trying to quit, the last thing you want is 19 cigarettes calling out to you, soon to be 17, then 16, etc.

Seems like it should be legal to sell one cigarette at a time.

It's a basic tenant of the party.

for themselves.

1. People who make under $50,000
2. People who win lots of money on Jeopardy

I may agree with you, but I fight to change the laws because once I advocate violating the law for something I believe in, I am excusing the next person for violating the law for whatever they believe in.

Oh, wait.

I meant, in a truly diseased society, such people would be murdered by killers hiding with impunity behind their badges.


That's what I meant.

The places where they sell candy, magazines, cigarettes, et cetera...

I don't think he would have appreciated someone selling loose cigarettes outside his store...

Of course, the police overreacted and were negligent in the young man's death at best and knowingly culpable in his death at worst.

And they killed him for it.

I am concerned with contraband, as taxes are part and parcel of the price we pay to live in a dynamic and semi-free nation and assists in helping the least among us rise above their current status.

However, I'm much more concerned regarding the dramatic decrease of a just, reasoned and proportional response law enforcement is giving to minorities.

How's about they go catch a murder or a rapist instead.

This was stupidity. If that's the biggest thing that force had going on - then they are a bunch overpaid and bored cops who went looking to roll someone.

I am far more concerned about cops that kill people, intentionally or unintentionally, because they lack critical thinking skills.

that's pure sarcasm.

It's right down there with jaywalking for me.

the tax is already paid on them.