contact st louis regional crime stoppers

the Smoking Gun comment about checking the ink is perfect.

The Smoking Gun is remarkable. Surely there is some recourse....but the powers that be in Missouri are unlikely to act.

Disgusting that they used her as a witness. They had to know her background.

That gal belongs in a psych ward not in a grand jury witness stand. And now she belongs in the psych ward of a federal prison for lying to federal agents.

There's quite a number of other witnesses that corroborate Wilson's version of events and which also match the forensic findings.

FPD didn't do the investigation either.

http://documents.latimes.com/ferguson-grand-jury/

Witness 40's journal entries and the 90 minute long interview in which she was hammered about her racism and hinted at whether or not she was actually there at all were all presented to the grand jury before she testified. You can argue whether or not the witness should have been used at all but not that she was presented as truthful or credible because she was presented as both a racist and a liar (which she certainly is).

Last edited Tue Dec 16, 2014, 06:40 PM - Edit history (1)

"How odd. I would have thought the prosecutor presenting a witness that corroborated Wilson's account who was presented to the grand jury as a racist and a liar would have been high-fived here."

What I read here, on DU, is the exact opposite of your statement. Not many here high-five DW or his supporters.

Last edited Tue Dec 16, 2014, 05:41 PM - Edit history (1)

testimony on the charging scenario. 3 with this one in question, how is that,"quite a number. You also provide a link where witness 40 is expunged I have the GJ records also......most said he had hands up, not charging, three, that includes the racist, said he was charging.......

Some said he charged, some said he moved slower. The point is that Wilson ordered him to stop and Brown kept moving toward him, that he didn't put his hands up in surrender or get down on his knees, etc. Not all of the witnesses saw everything and not from the same vantage point. Most of them corroborate most of Wilson's account.

All of the witnesses that claim Brown put his hands up/went to his knees in surrender were friends or family members of either Brown or Johnson. Their stories aren't detailed, some admit that they recited things they heard rather than saw themselves (#16), get the number of officers wrong (two cops in the car - Wilson and another), get the color of the Monte Carlo wrong, claim they were watching something else for the same amount of time the entire incident took place, otherwise change their stories, etc.

The link is all the documents from the grand jury. I don't know why there isn't a document of a police interview with Witness #40, but apparently from what was said in the YouTube link of the interview there was one and it was presented to the grand jury along with her racist journal entry and before she testified. The YouTube link goes through all of that.

Hey, I'd be MORE than happy to go through every single witness account both police interviews and grand jury testimony. I'd have thought that once the documents came out that people would actually be interested in that. Fat chance... nobody here gave a crap about evidence at any time to the present in this case either eyewitness or forensic. And there's a damn good reason why no one is... the witness accounts don't portray what they'd like them to.

I just don't get the hoopla concerning Witness #40. The grand jury was presented with the information about her that makes her not a credible witness as well as a racist. Obviously, they would have discounted her.

Last edited Wed Dec 17, 2014, 12:20 PM - Edit history (2)

to the end of the earth. No matter what you say or what 'proof' you have rationalized as justifying a "good shoot", wilsonthepig executed Michael Brown. Youtube? Obviously witness 40 was not discounted because her testimony closely resembled and dovetailed perfectly with the contrived story of wilsonthepig. I understand, you must defend wilsonthepig at all cost to uphold whatever principle or expediency of 'justice' in this case that is a must in your world. Hey it's okay, it was JUST a black person laying in the street, bleeding for 5 hours after being shot dead while unarmed and in surrender, WITH HIS HANDS UP. You have your agenda and that is all that is possible for your judgement that execution was necessary in this case. Your GJ people all had a chance to read wilsonthepigs version events and the reason(s) he had to execute Brown right there in the street....the prosecutor made sure of that along with providing misleading information IN DEFENSE of wilsonthepig...too much of wilsonthepigs's version was out there BEFORE the GJ was empaneled...period. You have to realize that other people DO have critical thinking skills and the ability to analyze the 'jaundiced evidence' presented IN DEFENSE of wilsonthepig,also. Wilsonthepig is a murderer and by his exoneration, a state sanctioned executioner who now gets to live a life of relative luxury for his deed of removing another 'thug' and 'threat' to the privileged of amerikan society. That's amerikkka for ya! Just got love it, huh.... Look here, Nov 4, 2014 explained to me how much americans analyze important information and are able to use critical thinking skills in that analysis. For sure not enough to swing the election(s) in a way to ensure that fascist like wilsonthepig won't be roaming the streets looking for others to murder/summarily execute. When more and more people of the privileged class are shot down, then I'm sure the 'proper' outrage will be displayed and a 'solution' found.....

Oy.

I'm not the one here with an agenda. I'm not the one who immediately out of the gate before an investigation even STARTED was making erroneous claims about what happened based on one person's inconsistent story to the media. I'm not the one who systematically ignored the evidence when it did come out, and not the one pretending it says something it doesn't or making biased claims about the prosecution or witnesses or the grand jurors.

Like I said, nobody here has any desire to actually delve into the evidence because it doesn't say what they'd like it to and like you just rant about dumb jurors and "corrupt" prosecutors and now want to hang their hat on one racist boob of a "witness" that was PRESENTED as a racist boob and ignore all the other evidence that shows Brown attacked Wilson in his car, ran when the first shot was fired there, and for whatever reason turned around and continued toward Wilson in some manner ignoring Wilson's orders to stop and that he didn't put his hands up or kneel down in surrender.

I don't even know whether or not there was nothing to indict him on since that was for the jurors to decide according to the law, and I've never once said it was a "good shot" or anything similar. I'm probably more of a mind with Witness #14 who didn't think the last volley of shots was necessary. I don't know, I wasn't there and didn't see it and don't know exactly how the law applies. But I'm the last person here injecting any bias or agenda into this case, and you just spewed more of it while claiming I'M the one with an agenda. Pfffftttt.

Let me know when you're interested in going over the actual evidence. I won't hold my breath.

convince everyone you're right when most everyone else knows you're wrong, but keep chugging along, sooner or later someone will believe you, here, I'm more than sure..... I have been over the 'evidence' and nothing you can show me will change my mind about the murder/execution, by wilsonthepig, of this young man, Michael Brown. NOTHING...yeah, don't hold your breath, for sure.

whether it bears on the material here, other than to supply further corroboration that McCulloch and his staff of little Eichmanns had no business allowing the St. Louis County Grand Jury hearing the Michael Brown homicide any information from this racist whack-job.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025902241

... is beyond belief. It was quite clear this DA had absolutely no interest in indicting Wilson .... and was heavily invested in destroying Michael Brown..It is sickening

It was very hard to follow, I don't know how the jurors gave her testimony any weight at all. Sounds to me like she needs to be visited by the FBI again.

After reading more of the transcripts and hearing anyone commenting on how wilson was "being attacked" I want to just shout at them and say "You didn't read the transcripts!" or they have very bad reading comprehension!

I don't know legally how to bring this back to the grand jury, but it needs to be done! This is a travesty of justice and cannot stand.

of limitations for murder (although there is a 3-year SoL for 'manslaughter'). So, in theory, there is nothing preventing a new Grand Jury under the auspices of a Special Prosecutor from convening to take up anew the Michael Brown murder in the future. Before this can happen, two conditions must be satisifed:

1) St. Louis County District Attorney Robert McCulloch must formally recuse himself and his staff from any role in the case
2) MO Governor Jay Nixon must be prevailed upon to name a Special Proseutor (ideally, from outside the region and with no ties to local law enforcement) to take over.

Since McCulloch was just re-elected by a largely white population in early November, the chances of his voluntarily agreeing to recuse himself seem slim (at least to my mind). But popular pressure can make strange things happen. Not holding my breath, mind you.

'usual suspects' to arrive with discounting, distracting and diminishing while at the same time make 'logical', 'non-emotional', explanations of why poor wilsonthepig is not guilty of any crime.....

I don't watch TV so I don't know, but I am sure they are all over it...

The Twelfth of Never.

Finding ways to charge the cops. Not one case?

fabricated to indict Brown and let Wilson off the hook.

The prosecutor put this crap in front of the grand jury knowing it was completely fabricated. He deserves jail time.

I take it The Smoking Gun is not satire? For some reason when I opened this I thought TSG was a satire type outlet. Are they a legitimate news outlet? Maybe I am thinking of the Onion, and another like that so if anyone could clear that up for me quick I would appreciate that.

*Also on a sidenote does anyone know how many posts you are required to make before you can start a thread of your own? I had something I wanted to share & ask... Thanks..


Now, on to this witness testimony, and first of all I mean can this really stink any worse? What a shame this entire process has been, especially given the high profile nature of the case, and with what happened in Florida not too long ago. I know a previous unrelated case, and other 'outside incidents" should never influence any other case itself, but there are some steps that can be taken in order to restore some confidence in the public. I believe that is why McCulloch decided to unveil the process being ultra-transparent even though that is not proper procedure in Missouri. This should and could have restored some confidence in the justice system for a certain segment of the population which unfortunately believes things are far worse than they really are. Unfortunately almost everything other than the transparency was a complete, well, joke I guess would be the best way to describe it.

There was another board I was a member of which had a great contributor with deep legal knowledge who I would love to see this, but unfortunately it has turned into a zoo. I am new here so hopefully there are some others here who have been following this closely, and perhaps have some legal background. Now this article here from The Smoking Gun uncovers some potential problems, and even bias with witness #40. This is certainly troubling news, but (and correct me if I am wrong please) I believe witness #10 also corroborated this line of events. Not only that, but I believe there may have been a few others who had as well as I did hear on Hannity along with some others that most of the witness testimony did back up this account. Of course that is Hannity so that would need double checking for sure, and complicating things further some liberal posters (on that other site etc) along with MSNBC have claimed that only one witness (that being witness #10) had given such testimony, while the other "9"? claimed otherwise. This of course couldn't be correct unless The Smoking Gun article is wrong.

So can anyone clear this up? Does this article & these revelations really mean all that much if the other witnesses who were deemed "most credible" also corroborated this line of events?


*Ooops I had to re-logon an accidentally posted in the duplicate thread.

Can you add those details to your query?

in order to dilute the testimony of the majority of witnesses who said Brown's hands were up.

There's an About tab on TSG's page.That explains clearly what it is.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/about

"This should and could have restored some confidence in the justice system for a certain segment of the population which unfortunately believes things are far worse than they really are. Unfortunately almost everything other than the transparency was a complete, well, joke I guess would be the best way to describe it. "

Really??? I'm a segment of the population who believes things really are far worse than what the media reports but, "worse than they really are?" Whatever the hell does that mean?

Please explain this comment...

gee….imagine that.

.

Excuse me?

You two must think pretty highly of yourselves, that's great, but I don't have a clue who you are.

I am going to get some sleep now myself, I guess you will have to wait a little longer. heheh

"as I did hear on Hannity.."

Interesting how you conveniently leave out the following sentence. Perhaps you are just as sketchy as Hannity....

Noted.

does not work. Half of the states in the US do not have any Grand Jury system. MO should abolish their use of a Grand Jury as it is obvious that it does not work there. But I doubt they will. This is what fosters our distrust in the system of law. Using antiquated system that have been proven not to work is bad enough. Using it to obstruct justice is a whole rotten mess.

far he was standing from the events in question). McCulloch cited witnesses who 'changed their stories' as a reason why those who said Brown was surrendering were not believed (and Wilson not indicted). Strangely, McCulloch had nothing whatsoever negative to say about pro-Wilson Witness #10 changing his story.

Witness #10 is a very slim reed upon which to hang corroboration of Wilson's self-serving account.

Copied and pasted this from the other thread where I originally posted it

Link: http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2014/12/hannity-favorite-witness-40-in-wilson-grand-jury-is-a-liar-and-convicted-felon-report/

Ari Melber who was co-hosting for Chris Hayes last night brought before the viewing audience the official of the Cleveland police association and if people were to see this interview in its entirety its speaks volumes of what is happening in this country and the mentality of law enforcement from the grand jury system in Missouri, Ohio and others places to the killings of human beings for justification by law enforcement.
Basically you as an individual are guilty by the police and officials in law enforcement even before evidence or procedures are used.

organization that demands respect it has not earned, can break the law at will stealing and lying. The military has some rules.

and the interview sickened me

that Michael Brown was evil and got what was coming to him.

I knew the "evidence" in support of Wilson would eventually crumble like Charmin in a hurricane; I just didn't think it would be this quick.

I just googled it and yep he sure did. WOW

before the grand jury, He did it for one reason, to get Wilson not convicted. The grand jury should have heard truthful witnesses only. Prosecutors are the most criminal because they cannot be charged.

case be initiated. A second one to determine if the Prosecutor engaged in a crime by presenting such a witness. Did he know her background?

Last edited Tue Dec 16, 2014, 01:53 PM - Edit history (1)

take on reality. Of course she'd be able to testify...to the GJ....in ferguson.......:

read some of the comments at the links relating to the whole story of the 'witness'. How competent were the federal investigators after this has been revealed, is the question I'm asking.....

For some reason people are having a problem with this here. I would have thought people here would have been thrilled that the prosecution presented a witness that corroborated Wilson's account as a racist and a liar along with the documentation showing that to the grand jury.

Anyone that actually read the grand jury documents would have known all this anyway.

considering she is a "racist and liar." Why would a prosecutor discredit a witness then have that witness testify under oath to tell the truth? I see a real conflict here and I think that's exactly why the prosecutor had this witness testify, so the GJ would be conflicted also. The prosecutor got the non indictment he wanted and got to tell the world how "transparent" this kangaroo court was.

A grand jury can be a kangaroo court if the prosecutor leads them in a direction to draw a false conclusion.

And that is what McCulloch did. At least that much seems transparent.

led them to exclude her as a witness, instead they deemed her "most credible".
Lol, at anyone who doesn't see the racism operating at every level in Ferguson, including the jurors, and people who are not outraged at the whole GJ process.

Wilson walked up to him and shot him while he was on his knees with hands up. I hope the murderer gets his in the end.

There is so much false info on this case and an amazing amount of people ignoring evidence that doesnt support their view on what happened.

It is safe to say that none of us truely know what actually happened that day.

And all of the witnesseson both sides who changed their story.? Even Brown's friend changed his story and was very inconsistent.

the 'hands up in surrender' though......keep rationalizing, one day wilsonthepig's karma will come due.....

If you think Browns MURDER was justified perhaps you are on the wrong message board.