whether they deserve it or not.

That they continuously abuse. They should never be referred to as NY's finest. Especially as long as their police association has jerks like Lynch heading them.

I'm not impressed by fair-weather labor supporters on a Democratic board. Such comments also are eerily reminiscent of conservative complaints about how the teachers unions have too much political power, and how it hurts our children. We should endeavor to see all unions as powerful as the police unions in NYC.

In any event, the police unions (which are very distinct from the NYPD itself) in NYC are powerful because of strong public support, not the other way around. Despite the opinions of many here on DU, as a lifelong and politically active NYC area resident, I can assure you that the NYPD is indeed very popular, although admittedly not always with certain demographics.

Whether you or I like Lynch's comments (and I most certainly don't) is not the real issue. What's important is how well the sentiment reverberates among New Yorkers. Mayor deBlasi is not calling for a pause in protests for no reason. He can read the polls and sense the political winds, and does not want to be a one-termer like David Dinkins.

"certain demographics"?

Is it reassuring and fun that the less pigmentally challenged and the poors get beat up, locked up, and killed with abandon and without consequences?

Liberals my ass. Kudos to them for not being a forced ultrasound loving bigots but most of us call that not being given a piece of shit. Monsters can be secular too.

The police have become a self-serving criminal gang, and we need to apply the Reagan solution and fire them all and start over.

This is going to be really interesting. in a sad way, but watching Pat Lynch, I am not willing to believe that he has such power of the NYPD with DeBlasio as Mayor.

That is hardly news. However, you cannot compare the relationship of Giuliani and Bloomberg to the NYPD to that of Dinkins and now deBlasio.

It can even be argued that Dinkins' horrible tenure as mayor was the result of his handpicked police chief and law enforcement polices, and what made Giuliani the more attractive candidate and perceived as far more successful in keeping NYC safe and secure. Events like the Crown Heights riots and Korean boycott irreparably damaged Dinkins, and deBlasio clearly wants to learn from Dinkins' mistakes. Hiring Bill Bratton, Giuliani's police commission, was obviously step 1. He probably now wishes he could have provided more nuance concerning his remarks after the grand jury did not indict on the Garner matter, and his call today for a pause in protests, at least until after the police funerals, is likely a public expression of very bad private polling and political advice.

However, when our side paints one of the most diverse police forces in the world, with 34,000 officers, with a broad and unflattering brush, it would be asinine to not expect the police and their numerous supporters to use similarly broad and unfair generalizations about the protesters and mayor in the event of a tragedy like the shootings.

Politics, particularly in NYC, is hardball.

when conservatives proclaim that "the teachers union protects bad teachers, that is their main purpose" when the next Republican governor tries to pass new right to work laws.

Unions exist to protect and advocate for the interests of their members, and only their members, both good and bad. In fact, treating members differently is a breach of their fiduciary obligations. I should know, I worked on such claims at the NLRB (Region 29 - Brooklyn) while in law school.

teacher multiple times and the teacher still has a job I will say that teachers union is fucked up also.

connections it still has with police unions. As one of my Socialist comrades recently noted,

And not assume that all police unions cultures are exactly the same.

New York City two days ago. I assume you're not advocating building bridges to the NYPD's PBA?

I guess you must have known what the Republicans wanted for Christmas this year.

I just want the pigs gone. I've seen you posting in several threads, talking about how you don't like the police union either. You always follow that with a full-throated defense of said union--neat trick. Fuck the police. I said it before Saturday, and I have no plans to stop now unless and until I quit seeing police brutality in my newsfeed on a daily basis.

It's irrelevant whether I like the police unions or not. However, I do respect the fact that they have very strong and popular unions, and the labor movement should learn from their successes. And for the record, my problems are with Lynch's statements, not the entire union, because I believe them very counterproductive to both the union's and general public's goals and interests. I'm also not going to advocate the elimination of hard won union protections, no less constitutional rights, simply because this particular police union president is a moron.

You can "want the pigs gone" to your heart's content, although that sounds like a tired 1960's matra, and is not a sentiment shared by anything close to a majority of the public. However, their strong unions and incredible solidarity render the prospects of that happening downright laughable. I hope all unions are watching and learning.

There are many avenues to address racial disparities in the justice system. Attacking unions and proclaiming "fuck the police" might make you popular on DU, but will produce nothing positive in the real world.

progressive labor movement, as represented by unions like SEIU and AFSCME, should have nothing whatsoever to do with police who attack workers and protect the interests of the bourgeoisie, your slur and slander notwithstanding.

than other labor unions and no doubt that is because the 1% covet them. We need to keep the discussion going with the police and other powers that be. If not we are ceding a part of ourselves. Which is the whole point of the demonstrations...the police serve and protect us. We have a right to non-violent protest. Organizers should put out a call to all followers to turn in anyone who demonstrates and calls for violence against the police. Or anyone who does anything to the police. The demonstrators have to police themselves too. And the police-government need to discuss amongst themselves and search their souls for answers, all the while listening to the people. We need to engage each other in listening. Hard. Not create wedges that only benefit the GOP and do not help either the people or the police.

Like you and I, though they may have started out that way. Their job is to serve and protect the status quo, as determined by the wealthy, connected and powerful; despite how unfair, corrupt, opportunistic that status quo may be. There is good reason that military is not unionized, because given their fire power, they'd be running the government.

The nypd has been proven time and again to be protecting their benefactors at wall street, not protecting protesting workers, or those who want change.

Police unions are a part of the machine, and therefore should be smashed along with the rest of it.

only their labor to sell and do not own or control the means of production. That said, though, they sell their labor to the very elements (bourgeoisie) devoted to smashing workers and keeping them divided and suppressed. As such, the progressive labor movement should have absolutely nothing to do with them.

Quoting another Socialist comrade,

And to the gasps I hear from the "labor can do no wrong" section, I fart in your general direction.

despite, their already awful and unaccountable behavior with missing aboriginal women, G20 protests, and failure to investigate parliamentary scandals etc. Do you think that their constitutional right to bargain collectively is more important than their duty to uphold the laws of Canada on an equal and consistent basis?

Don't get me wrong, I am 100% pro union: except when it creates a criminally negligent cartel of connected insiders.

a good thing. We live in a pretty safe country. Ive experienced evil crimes. But that is not the police fault but an act of god that created an animal called a psychopath. On the whole Canada works hard to be the safe country we are. So someone is doing something right. And those unsolved cases missing aboriginal women number about 150 women. The other 1000 cases are solved. They have gone back and counted all the murders or missing from 40 years. Still not acceptable. And I would think there should be a study. Do not know if it should be a public enquiry. I am not sure which would be more effective at stopping crimes against women.

I do not know about you but if I was living in a remote area of Canada and patrolling the highways and towns...alone.... NIGHT AFTER NIGHT, I would think that is all the qualifications one needs to have the right to unionize.

Just because it's a union, that's no guarantee. It is hilarious to watch you trying to defend police "unions", which have been one of the major forces of repression here, as being the ones oppressed, it's just classic victim blaming.

How exactly is that revelatory?

I wonder if you'll feel the same way when the teachers or other liberal unions complain about deBlasio when even he will not concede to all their compensation and other demands and it's written about in the NYT? Contract negotiations, particularly in places like NYC, are very adversarial.

There are certainly ample legitimate criticisms of the police unions, but their zealously, even ruthlessly, fighting for the highest possible compensation for their members, is something to be commended, not criticized.

as much as I support unions, cop unions suck.

Police are out of control.

to do anything they want, right or wrong, just or unjust, legal or not, with the mayor's unconditional support. Very bad idea particularly in light of the twisted views of some of their "leaders" like Lynch in NY and Follmer in Cleveland.

Last edited Tue Dec 23, 2014, 01:23 PM - Edit history (1)

so the community probably turns a blind eye to a lot of the corruption and bad behavior.

I think that's called a "protection racket."

Ugh.

first African American mayor.
some in the police crowd referred to the mayor as a "washroom attendant".

http://www.nytimes.com/1992/09/27/nyregion/rally-puts-police-under-new-scrutiny.html