...which is the kind of problem made obvious by Syria and other ME nations, and by Iraq, of course. Not that its our job to engineer the globe to our liking, but if it were our job the consensus lately is that we would fail, quickly and completely, regardless of the quality of our intentions.

group to run the country?

You're actually saying that? As some kind of explanation, some kind of excuse?

were to be overthrown, they would likely be replaced by wahhabist clerics. It would be like another Iran.

Because wahhabist clerics have little influence in subjugating the population right now.

Thanks for the information. Now I can sleep better at night, knowing that the House of Saud is protecting the people from Islamic fundamentalism.

People can justify anything.

control the wahhabist clerics right now, use them to control the population.

But things would be far worse if the Wahhabists were the ones in charge.

what is your point?

they'd be more like, well, Saudi Arabia....

Why is everything these days about toppling other countries' governments?

There are other methods for dealing with international disputes.

(I'm replying to the general theme of this sub-thread).

that there isn't another hidden hand one step up the food chain, pulling the Saudi's strings too. For one thing, the Saudis didn't really have a good enough motive for taking down the WTCs, but some in the US certainly did. Also, I can't quite see the fact of Prescott Bush and friends financing and creating Hitler, as a one-time scheme that didn't pay off for them afterward. (I'm sure it did pay off, as planned, and not in an obvious, traceable way.)

Something just tells me, even if the Saudis get caught red-handed at this level, the endpoint of it comes back to the US and/or London, and the bankers.

Then too, I happen to know that the "gas crisis" was phony, because I happened to be driving across country at that time, and strangely enough... the crisis was almost entirely on the coasts in the big cities. There were long lines for gas in California, and I didn't encounter another one until I got back to Maryland. Prices weren't even terribly high in between. The weird thing was, that nobody was reporting that. It was obviously a fraud, but it sure reallocated a ton of money in a big way... out of the pockets of people who earned it, to -- guess where.

And presto! at roughly the same time, terrorism broke out as a new thing internationally, and never quite went away.

Anyway, you never know what will start the web unraveling. If this gets disclosed... let's just say I believe that every now and then, the human race gets lucky, and the balance gets evened up a bit.

interesting post. I can't see that the Saudis had a good motive either, but who in the US did? I've wondered since the towers were associated with the rockefellers, if that played into it, but you think about this stuff too much and it'll drive you crazy.

Nothing else.

which dissolved, and this was it. The MIC needed a new boogeyman so they helped create it.

In political jargon, useful idiot is a term for people perceived as propagandists for a cause whose goals they are not fully aware of, and who are used cynically by the leaders of the cause.

game theory gives people power. Whether people use game theory power for the common good or for selfish aims depends on individuals, their sense of ethics, and their belief systems.

Peter Nonacs acknowledges the evil possibilities of game theory knowledge when he writes, “Morally, of course, games can be tricky. Theory predicts that outcomes are often not to the betterment of the group or society.” Nonacs, Peter. “Cheating to Learn: How a UCLA professor gamed a game theory midterm.” April 22, 2013.

"A 'limited hangout' is spy jargon for a favorite and frequently used gimmick of the clandestine professionals. When their veil of secrecy is shredded and they can no longer rely on a phony cover story to misinform the public, they resort to admitting--sometimes even volunteering--some of the truth while still managing to withhold the key and damaging facts in the case. The public, however, is usually so intrigued by the new information that it never thinks to pursue the matter further."


"All war is deception."
Sun Tzu, 500 BCE

I have to say. Never had one quite like it.

Brilliant, and I agree.

And what about the unreleased section of the 911 report? Ah yes.

Thanks, GTRO.

It seems like any sort of truth is so obscured that it's like looking for Bigfoot.

I appreciate the great work done over the years by this site and it's admins, but if these 28 pages are released, I expect an apology for being made out to be a conspiracy nut, and forced to hold my tongue under threat of relegation to the dungeon, or tomestoned.

And I know I'm not the only one.

You are 100% correct. If it weren't for the publicons coming out and demanding answers the threads and posts would still be locked and accused of being CT.

So sad that DU needed the publicons backing in order to talk about Saudi involvement but it does show that many "dems" allow the rightwing to lead them around by the nose.

I have never even pretended to consider thinking about such things our of fear. You are certainly NOT a nut.

Sunday, 23 September, 2001, 12:30 GMT 13:30 UK
Hijack 'suspects' alive and well



Another of the men named by the FBI as a hijacker in the suicide attacks on Washington and New York has turned up alive and well.

The identities of four of the 19 suspects accused of having carried out the attacks are now in doubt.

Saudi Arabian pilot Waleed Al Shehri was one of five men that the FBI said had deliberately crashed American Airlines flight 11 into the World Trade Centre on 11 September.

His photograph was released, and has since appeared in newspapers and on television around the world.


Now he is protesting his innocence from Casablanca, Morocco.

He told journalists there that he had nothing to do with the attacks on New York and Washington, and had been in Morocco when they happened. He has contacted both the Saudi and American authorities, according to Saudi press reports.

He acknowledges that he attended flight training school at Daytona Beach in the United States, and is indeed the same Waleed Al Shehri to whom the FBI has been referring.

But, he says, he left the United States in September last year, became a pilot with Saudi Arabian airlines and is currently on a further training course in Morocco.

Mistaken identity

Abdulaziz Al Omari, another of the Flight 11 hijack suspects, has also been quoted in Arab news reports.

Abdelaziz Al Omari
Abdelaziz Al Omari 'lost his passport in Denver'
He says he is an engineer with Saudi Telecoms, and that he lost his passport while studying in Denver.

Another man with exactly the same name surfaced on the pages of the English-language Arab News.

The second Abdulaziz Al Omari is a pilot for Saudi Arabian Airlines, the report says.

Meanwhile, Asharq Al Awsat newspaper, a London-based Arabic daily, says it has interviewed Saeed Alghamdi.


Khalid Al-Midhar may also be alive
He was listed by the FBI as a hijacker in the United flight that crashed in Pennsylvania.

And there are suggestions that another suspect, Khalid Al Midhar, may also be alive.

FBI Director Robert Mueller acknowledged on Thursday that the identity of several of the suicide hijackers is in doubt.


http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/1559151.stm

Whether you want to take your first step toward helping declassify the 28-page finding on foreign government assistance to the 9/11 hijackers, or you’re looking for even more ways to chip in than you already have, here are 28 ways you can help us build the movement.

1. Write to your representative or call them at 202-225-3121. Send a letter in minutes with our ready-to-print letters.

2. Write to the president or call the White House at 202-456-1111 and ask the president to keep his pledge to 9/11 families.

3 and 4. Write to your two senators or call them at 202-224-3121 to ask them to introduce legislation similar to H.Res.14. Here’s what to say.

5. Like 28Pages.org on Facebook.

6. Follow @28Pages on Twitter.

7. Contact your favorite reporter, columnist, TV host, blogger or podcaster and ask them to explore the issue.

8. Write a letter to the editor of your newspaper.

9-28: http://28pages.org/2014/08/28/28-ways-you-can-build-the-28-pages-movement/

28 Pages FAQ
http://28pages.org/faq/

For those that say this would hurt the 911 families:

Still Secret: 28 Pages That Could Change Our Understanding of 9/11

A bipartisan group of congressmen joined with 9/11 family members today to renew efforts to declassify 28 pages of a joint congressional inquiry into the worst terrorist attack against the United States.
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/secret-28-pages-change-understanding-911/story?id=28061961

"If you have nothing to hide you have nothing to fear" - so the Proles are told

So many are hooked on the official conspiracy theory, that this came out of the caves of Afghanistan.

IF ever daylight and transperancy were needed this is the case.

the bin laden family was not flown out until Sept 20th, which was AFTER US airspace was reopened.

http://www.snopes.com/rumors/flights.asp

on the 13th.

see snopes article I posted

the anus mundi in every way.