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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWhen my wife and I were kids this was normal now it is abuse?
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/03/04/dianne-meitiv-child-neglect-cps_n_6800070.html?ncid=txtlnkusaolp00000592Danielle Meitiv often lets her two kids, Rafi, 10 and Dvora, 6, play outside without her supervision. They are even allowed to walk home from the neighborhood park without either parent present. Meitiv believes in "free-range" parenting and encouraging independence.
Unfortunately for Meitiv, the Maryland Child Protective Service doesn't approve. The organization recently found Meitiv and her husband, Alexander, responsible for "unsubstantiated child neglect" because they let their kids walk home one mile from the park in December. In a HuffPost Live interview Tuesday, Danielle voiced her outrage at the decision, which has made national headlines.
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Granted we don't have kids and maybe we shouldn't comment but to me I think we have gone to overprotection to the extreme.
ScreamingMeemie
(68,918 posts)It sounds like a trite story, but we did walk over a mile to school (no hills! and I had shoes!) when I was 5 and my oldest brother was 9. The only crossing guards were other children, entrusted with the duty by the school.
This was posted here before, and it's bullshit. It will likely cause an argument, but no one's been able to change this mother's mind. I let my kids play unattended at those ages as well. I also let my 11-year-old daughter take a 3-year-old brother to the park playground. I should probably be serving life in prison.
In_The_Wind
(72,300 posts)HereSince1628
(36,063 posts)My biggest risk was "old lady Hawkins" who didn't want anyone near her soybean field...
I don't expect many miles to have that risk.
In_The_Wind
(72,300 posts)The neighborhood looks very much as it did over 50 years ago. The Pin Oak is still standing in my old front yard. The house could use a little TLC but it's still standing.
I passed homes and a wooded forest on my way to school. Often I wandered home through the woods. Dad got really ticked off at me when he saw me walking home that way. What did I know about the problems that may have been lurking there.
HuckleB
(35,773 posts)Crime rates have been decreasing for 40 some years, and people are getting more fearful.
Humans are strange.
bravenak
(34,648 posts)I don't even leave them unattended in a car while I run in and get a snack. I look at the Sex offender Registry in my town frequently. So many red dots.
Logical
(22,457 posts)bravenak
(34,648 posts)Logical
(22,457 posts)bravenak
(34,648 posts)But since I live in a state that is high as fuck on the list of child rape, incest rape, and adult rape, and domestic violence and my 9 year old is autistic I think I have a right to be more fucking aware of sickos. Not to mention being a victim of child rape myself. Do you have a problem with that??? You seem to. That is sad.
Logical
(22,457 posts)bravenak
(34,648 posts)Mariana
(14,858 posts)for completely non-sexual "crimes" like peeing in the bushes. There's a tendency for some people to assume every "registered sex offender" is a child molester, but that is not always the case.
Logical
(22,457 posts)840high
(17,196 posts)you. We have a sex offender living in my complex. A couple with 2 younish children moved next to him. It didn't take him long to make advances at the kids.
Logical
(22,457 posts)KMOD
(7,906 posts)Murderers do not often randomly select their prey. Child sex offenders do.
Child sex offenders also have much lighter sentences than murderers.
If someone is sick enough to hurt a child like that, they absolutely should be on a list. If it were up to me, someone who hurt a child like that would never, ever see the light of day again.
It's widely believed that the average pedophile has 260 victims in their lifetime. Most murders are acts of passion. 1 victim and done.
Logical
(22,457 posts)X_Digger
(18,585 posts)bravenak
(34,648 posts)I never told the police and most didn't. He served time for raping a family member got out and continued raping children. He died of aids. We don't know if he pased it to some child out there. That article is no comfort to us.
X_Digger
(18,585 posts)I think you do your kids a disservice if everything is viewed through this lense.
bravenak
(34,648 posts)How many children are you raising?
Logical
(22,457 posts)Aerows
(39,961 posts)since it's right there in her moniker. AK.
bravenak
(34,648 posts)Ed Suspicious
(8,879 posts)on the protective side with my kids but I'm working hard to loosen the reins.
Aerows
(39,961 posts)just go on and do what *you* think is right for your children. Someone on a forum isn't the person that loves your children, and knows them.
bravenak
(34,648 posts)I live in a neighborhood with quite a bit of crime and stuff. Most people only let the kids play in the yard and we walk them to the park.
Dont call me Shirley
(10,998 posts)And I am a Mamabear with my kids. The stat is 1 in 4 girls by the age of 18.
bravenak
(34,648 posts)If everyone did and read the crimes or googled a few of the cases in their immediate area, they might think twice about letting their kids be unsupervised. I also check out weird behaivior of others. Just in case. It seems like more than half the women I know were raped at sometime, most as children and then as adults. I know thats anecdotal but, it means alot to me to have my girls attain their majority rapeless. Make their own decision and keep the power to choose.
Dont call me Shirley
(10,998 posts)X_Digger
(18,585 posts)A few bruises and broken bones along the way, but a clearer indication of what it means to take care of yourself, how to deal with getting into trouble (and more importantly how to get yourself out without parents fixing things.)
bravenak
(34,648 posts)X_Digger
(18,585 posts)Cities big and small, diverse in culture, religions, race, crime, and economic level.
The umbilical cord withers for a reason.
bravenak
(34,648 posts)Look at the rate. Most victims are female like my children. Alaska has been leading the rape olympics for years.
X_Digger
(18,585 posts)Still no problem with riding street cars alone, or walking to school, or going shopping alone, etc.
bravenak
(34,648 posts)Because I watch my daughters extra hard because I live in rapetown usa. And the shrugging like child rape is nothing I should be concerned about. If my daughters end up as statistics I guess I should just shrug? Disgusting!! I already said my oldest is autistic, but you seem to think I should let a very disabled female child walk places alone in a neighborhood full of sex offenders that are on a registry I looked at to see what class of assualt it was. I know what the fuck is up in my state. You look silly shrugging.
X_Digger
(18,585 posts)Of course a developmentally challenged child has special needs.
But an otherwise normally-abled child? Yeah, being overprotective doesn't really prepare them for life, unless you plan on having them live with you the rest of their life.
bravenak
(34,648 posts)Just to make sure I have all th info. Maybe you don't.
She is on a non graduation track and will always need care. But, living where I do, I don't see many kids under 12 or 13 running around alone. Probably because of being the rapeiest state.
Comrade Grumpy
(13,184 posts)I mean, parents are getting arrested and/or investigated for letting their kids walk around free. That seems pretty messed up to me.
bravenak
(34,648 posts)How aware are they of the dangers? How able are they to judge the maturity and ability of their children? Do the children have a way to communicate with mom or dad? Phonebooths don't exist in most places anymore. If they have been warned of the dangers and do not make any adjustments, they may need parenting classes. I took them while I was pregnant.
Things are just not like they used to be. I just read an article about a father beating up the fehicle of his neighbor who had been raping his 13 year old daughter. She was scared to tell for years. Best to keep an eye on your kids. Thinking that the world will be kind is not being responsible.
840high
(17,196 posts)bravenak
(34,648 posts)backwoodsbob
(6,001 posts)he is now almost 26 and completely incapable of taking care of himself.He still lives at home...doesn't work...he is basically worthless.
We have seperated twice over him and the third..and likely last..seperation is coming
bravenak
(34,648 posts)The kids in the story are like 10 and 6. You can't even let kids babysit until 12 in most states. For good reason too.
At 26 he should be employed and self sufficient. I'd move out.
backwoodsbob
(6,001 posts)He doesn't work...his 34 year old boyfriend doesnt work....I'm about done
bravenak
(34,648 posts)People need to spend their retirement money on retirement. I watched my grandma support her grown sons until she died. I'd suggest she get a bit of counseling for herself as I left the home, got into my new RV and left town. I feel bad saying that, but I just could not support a 34 year old man. I'd walk around in a blind rage.
I left what turned out to be a dream and walked into a nightmare.
I'm about done.She knows and told me she will sign off and let me have all my 401k and profit sharing...after taxes i will be set...it will be a not small amount of money
Aerows
(39,961 posts)and agree with you. I'm not a mother, but I love my sister's children like they are my own and I believe in protecting them from people with bad things in mind.
Ignore people that tell you that it is overprotective as if you feel you have to have a reason to protect your children. They can howl all they want to - you are their parent, you love them, and you should always protect them. Anybody that believes any different can go jump in the lake.
Logical
(22,457 posts)Aerows
(39,961 posts)and aware of the area they live in, the place where their children goes to school, and makes sure to know who their child's friends are, that is good parenting.
I also think your children should be vaccinated, eat healthy foods, and you should care for your children.
You know, common sense.
Do you not take a kid to the doctor if they are sick to toughen them up?
bravenak
(34,648 posts)A friend of mine once got separated walking home in sixth grade. Got raped. Never got separated again. People didn't talk about stuff as much back then. We know better now.
We know better now, and employ our greater wisdom by not exposing our children to hazardous situations.
I wouldn't let my kid play around in an asbestos heap, but some kids did, does that make me too much of a nanny? No, it makes me responsible.
Warpy
(111,277 posts)It's time to shoot down the helicopter parenting model. Either those kids will turn out fearful and unable to cope with the larger world or they'll rebel bigtime and get into tons of trouble.
Meitv's kiddies will be fine. CPS should have backed off, there are genuinely neglectful and abusive parents out there they need to concentrate on. These children are not neglected.
nomorenomore08
(13,324 posts)AngryAmish
(25,704 posts)Make them fear us.
femmocrat
(28,394 posts)I think that needs to be taken into consideration for safety's sake.
Assuming that it's a mile through a safe area, I don't see a problem. I saw the mom interviewed a while ago and she mentioned that stranger abductions are extremely rare. Although, now that everyone in the universe knows about these kids, I don't think they are all that safe anymore.
HuckleB
(35,773 posts)femmocrat
(28,394 posts)Someone might have a point to prove. They could even be abducted for ransom, although that is pretty far-fetched.
Weren't they turned in by a "do-gooder"? Twice? That person or persons could believe that the kids would be better off away from their parents, and they are just the "savior" those children desperately need.
Who knows... there are a lot of unstable people out there.
HuckleB
(35,773 posts)Somehow, we have lost perspective.
HuckleB
(35,773 posts)The insularity seems to pervade all aspects of life.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)I hope she sues the pants off of them and wins.
spanone
(135,846 posts)i knew my parents were abusing us.
tularetom
(23,664 posts)every day, to and from school. Like most families of the time we had one car and my dad used it for work.
I don't even want to tell you how far my great grandkids live from their school and how they get to and from the school. You would not believe it.
I don't believe that pedophiles, molesters and perverts are a recent phenomenon. I'm pretty sure they were around back in the 50's as well.
teenagebambam
(1,592 posts)outside in the backyard, and put the dog out there to guard me, then went about her housework. Late 60's. No adult supervision and no sunscreen either!
hunter
(38,318 posts)...but my parents always gave me the tools I needed to stay out of serious trouble many years before I ever needed to use them.
By the time I was twelve I knew EVERYTHING about darker humanity, and I avoided it successfully. I laughed and ran away from a couple of pedophiles, male and female.
In middle school I'd get into some more-or-less trivial trouble, sometimes with teachers who were telling me "to be a man" or other such nonsense, so I'd run off, jump the chain link fence, and be free.
Panicked school officials sometimes called my mom, and she'd tell them I'd probably be home for dinner, which was usually true, mostly.
By the time I was sixteen my time away from home could sometimes stretch for days. I was sharpening my skills as a sofa-surfing or sleeping-in-the-bushes homeless person.
By eighteen my away times could be a week or a month or two, as it has been ever since. People who love me know who to call and where to look. My cell phone might be working, it might not.
My youngest sibling wasn't always so lucky as his older siblings have been. Our parents ran away from home, leaving him to manage the ranch.
Maedhros
(10,007 posts)My brother and I regularly roamed, unsupervised, for miles around our house. Learned to get ourselves out of the trouble we got ourselves into.
ND-Dem
(4,571 posts)wound up getting good and lost, into swamp and nettles, walking for hours, finally coming out of the woods onto a road (luckily one I knew) and walking the road only to get home in time for dinner.
'what did you do today?'
'nothing'
liberal N proud
(60,336 posts)We left the house usually after lunch and back before dark. All our friends did the same thing.
And we never got in trouble.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)That choice of words makes me notice that this piece does not describe the nature of the mile, the conditions the day nor the time of day nor how their habits drew attention in the first place. In someplaces and on some days, a mile is a hell of a long way for a six year old to be taking on. Other days and other miles, with an older kid, very different.
But the exclusion of detail is bothersome.
MFM008
(19,818 posts)ride my bike and walk to school. I was on my bike all the time riding it all over town. Now it was a military base but one of my class mates sister was murdered along with her boyfriend on prom night, so stuff still happened, even back in the 60s.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)on bikes and on foot (barefoot half the time!) We didn't wear bike helmets. Hell, my first bike didn't even have BRAKES lol!
There were creepy guys in the park we lived next to, but we knew to stay away from them.
We had a blast back in the 60's. We walked to school (about a mile). We played in the park, we trick or treated without parents.
Damn, I feel sorry for kids nowadays. Seriously.
We were FREE.
KMOD
(7,906 posts)Many are inside on their computers and Xboxes all day long.
I think that's sad.
loyalsister
(13,390 posts)I have to wonder if the charge would have been leveled if it had happened in April or September. Walking outside for a mile is very different in December- for children and adults. If the basis for this is failing to take weather into account when giving a child permission to spend time outside, maybe it isn't entirely ridiculous.
ND-Dem
(4,571 posts)into the woods, to the gravel pit and dump; the boys rode their bikes for miles to lakes, etc.
it kind of amazes me now how little our parents checked up on us all or carted us around.
it was different, that's for sure.
a mile is really not very far to walk. it's a matter of blocks.
pansypoo53219
(20,981 posts)AND WE SURVIVED!
SheilaT
(23,156 posts)I attended a Catholic School, not the local public school, which was a block from where we lived. Kindergarten was a half day, so I rode the public bus home by myself. Depending on which bus I caught, I either got off a block from home, or about a half mile from home. At the very beginning of the year the bus drivers were a bit startled to see me getting on by myself. I was small for my age, so I probably looked like I was 3 or 4, not the 5 that I was. After a few weeks the regular drivers on the run knew me. In the beginning they sometimes wouldn't stop to let me on, apparently not convinced that a tiny child was really waiting at the bus stop for the indicated purpose. I recall one time, two busses in a row passing me up, and my older brother, who could see me waiting there while he was at the noon recess, came over and made sure the next bus stopped and let me on. He was all of 11 himself, but I recall he more or less read the riot act to the bus driver.
Long before the more protective era came about, I marveled that I could ride the public bus by myself at so young an age.
The next year my younger brother was in kindergarten, and it was his turn to take the bus home by himself.
Blanks
(4,835 posts)Not just siblings, but cousins too. We did all manner of unsafe things from the day we were born until... Unfortunately, until some were put in the ground, but definitely until we went our separate ways.
I see on facebook were people celebrate this unsafe upbringing (riding in the back of pickups for example) as 'the way things should be'.
My wife and I didn't let our kids run around like that. One of the reasons parents let their kids run around unsupervised (50's, 60's and 70's) was because moms were overwhelmed BECAUSE they had so many kids.
I once dove off the back of a baseball backstop (or whatever they're called) when I was in 3rd or 4th grade and my siblings left me unconscious in the park. One of my older brothers friends carried me home where my parents put me on a blanket where I lay unconscious until I came to.
I don't think there's such a thing as watching your kids too close. Even when they're finding their way, making their mistakes, perhaps you watch secretly and quietly, but you watch their back to make certain that they are safe. Not just kids either, we all should be keeping each other safe. Not by tattling to the 'agencies', but by offering to help.
Upward
(115 posts)Cities, not so much.
When I was 6 and wandered a mile away from home with my friends, I got the spanking of my life as a result.
There are neighborhoods in the city I live in now, where the most progressive people live within blocks - sometimes on the same blocks - where gunshots are heard regularly. One would have to be an idiot to let their kids go wander unsupervised in that.
midnight
(26,624 posts)and go back out. I feel sorry for parents today. Everyone has taken their authority over .
Dyedinthewoolliberal
(15,579 posts)As a kid, I was all over the neighborhood and often well over a mile from home. When I'd ask my mom how I could get somewhere she'd reply 'shanks mare' which was something she got from her mother. I believe it's an Irish phrase meaning 'walk'!
whereisjustice
(2,941 posts)this is bullshit.
progressoid
(49,991 posts)But we're getting more paranoid.
840high
(17,196 posts)paranoid. Crimes against children are put on the internet now. Parents worry.
1monster
(11,012 posts)Growing up in Pennsylvania, it always seemed that the worst criminals from Pennsylvania were caught in Florida.
So I kept my son close and watched out for the neighbor kids too.
But it isn't just current times and Florida. In 1965, six year old Kathy Ann Shea from Tyrone, PA, 25 miles from where I lived, disappeared from the few blocks between her home and her school. I have memories of people searching the corn and wheat fields on farms where I lived. No trace of the child was ever found. This was small town rural America where most everyone knew everyone else.
So I kept my son close and safe for those and other reasons I won't go into. But keeping him safe tended to curb his learning independence and self reliance. (Part of that is personality and I'm not sure he would have developed that independent self reliance had things been different.)
I don't have an answer. Life in our modern world has its dangers, but so were there dangers in the past when children were allowed to wander a bit more freely.
KMOD
(7,906 posts)taught_me_patience
(5,477 posts)I was going a lot further than a mile on bike at 10 or 11. I also caught my first city bus ride at age 8. Times have changed, I guess and we're getting a little over-protective.
abelenkpe
(9,933 posts)No one I know would ever think of leaving kids that age alone or to walk freely through the neighborhood. Granted we do live in the middle of the city but it simply is not done anymore. When I grew up yes kids wandered around unsupervised at that age. That's just not done anymore. Parents are and have to be more responsible. Different world. Different times.
Manifestor_of_Light
(21,046 posts)I suffered from extreme overprotection. There is such a thing as too much overprotection. I constantly told my parents they were overprotective and got rebuffed. I was a very bright child (three standard deviations above normal IQ) but I was a status symbol for being smart and playing musical instruments.
This was in cheap postwar suburbia. I grew up in the sixties and I was told not to play outside.
I was told not to play with the neighbor kids. Most of them were real snotty anyway. She didn't want me to dress like the other kids either. She got handdowns that were funny clothes. But she would buy herself purses and hats and belts she didn't need. I constantly asked for an allowance and never got any money. I was told "But we buy you everything you need." I was told I was too lazy to do chores. However, I couldn't clean house because that would mean I would have to throw away some of my mother's junk, and she would freak out over that. So the dishes got washed and the clothes and the sheets, but actually throwing stuff away was not done. She wrapped all the kitchen utensils in plastic bags because we had roaches and rats, and the house was dirty and not sealed. We didn't have adequate air conditioning in a humid subtropical climate so summer was hell. It started in April and ended in October or November. My parents had a window unit in their bedroom and a window unit in the front office. Because of the heat and humidity and a nearly 12 month growing season, I had a perpetually runny nose from allergies but they didn't have any medicine for it back then.
If I snuck outside, that was BAD. My mother would use a shaming tone of voice and scold me for "RUNNING OFF".
A few times she or dad would run outside with a bamboo switch shrieking my name looking for me. I would hide between houses with my friend and laugh at her because she looked like a complete idiot. I think I was in high school at the time. I was terrorized by them with a bamboo switch but I could run faster than they could.
When I was in fifth grade I went to a Girl Scout meeting with another kid. I begged her to join because it was the only time I could be around my peer group and not get picked on, because there was adult supervision. Nope, she had a problem when she was running a Brownie troop when my older sister was little so she would not let me. So she didn't want to provide me with alternatives for kids to hang out with.
I didn't babysit either, because I knew nothing about babies or children. The first time I changed a diaper in my life was when I brought my child home from the hospital after childbirth when she was four days old.
Part of being in a dysfunctional family is isolation. My mother was a hoarder. I couldn't have my own bedroom. I couldn't have friends sleep over because there was not an extra bed. I couldn't have friends over for birthday parties. Mom had taken over one of the three bedrooms with her junk. I slept in a double bed with my sister. Didn't get my own room until she went off to college, which was when I was in about the 9th grade.
I read lots and lots of books because there was nothing else to do. Or else practice my musical instruments. I also got very depressed in the summer because I had no friends where I could hang out at their houses. I cried a lot. We didn't go on vacations because they were frivolous and cost money. The only social life I had was in orchestra in high school.
My parents drove me to school and picked me up. Which was OK because it was too far to walk in junior high and high school. I didn't want to ride a bus because I would have undoubtedly been picked on just like I was picked on at school.
Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)When school was out, they walked to visit their friends and visit the park and playground.
I think this is an errant misuse of authority.
Hell, I think half of us were in the woods after school and on weekends at those ages.
Half the problem with obesity in kids today is that they're not let outside!!