addressing this issue in a tasteful manner:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=6405584

Touché!

That's why I deign or rise to post here, depending on one's perspective , to bask in the glow of the privileged.

creative ways'.

WE know that. I didn't hear anything other than telling us what we 'need'.

Compare that speech to eg, any one of FDR's speeches addressing similar issues.

First he acknowledges what people surely knew, followed almost immediately with well-thought out solutions which he then managed to force Congress into implementing.

Whenever I hear a politician say 'we need ..... ' not followed by what should be the most important part of any speech, it sounds like rhetoric to me.

Her reference to 'public and private' funds, worries me a lot. And should worry any Democrat since that is a Heritage Foundation policy, for Public Funds to be taken over by Private Institutions.

Public funds should not be controlled by any Private institution. We've seen what happens to them when they are.

And everybody here is cheering!

It you sure that you are on the correct board?

BTW ... Such comments say way more about you than about the presumed candidate.

That I have always cared about the plight of the working man/woman? well yes.

"HRC is a sociopath"?

Okay.

Even though they can’t treat psychopaths effectively with therapy, it doesn’t mean we can’t protect ourselves, the most important factor in keeping psychopaths at bay is to know your vulnerabilities. We need to realize our own potential and maximize our strengths so that our insecurities don’t overcome us. Because, a psychopath is a chameleon who becomes an image of what you haven’t done for yourself. Over time, their appearance of perfection will begin to crack, but by that time you will have been emotionally and perhaps financially scathed. There comes a time when you realize there’s no point in searching for answers; the only thing is to move on.


Glibness and Superficial Charm

Manipulative and Conning
They never recognize the rights of others and see their self-serving behaviors as permissible. They appear to be charming, yet are covertly hostile and domineering, seeing their victim as merely an instrument to be used. They may dominate and humiliate their victims.

Pathological Lying
Has no problem lying coolly and easily and it is almost impossible for them to be truthful on a consistent basis. Can create, and get caught up in, a complex belief about their own powers and abilities. Extremely convincing and even able to pass lie detector tests.
Does not see others around them as people, but only as targets and opportunities. Instead of friends, they have victims and accomplices who end up as victims. The end always justifies the means and they let nothing stand in their way.

Callousness/Lack of Empathy
Unable to empathize with the pain of their victims, having only contempt for others' feelings of distress and readily taking advantage of them.
Believe they are all-powerful, all-knowing, entitled to every wish, no sense of personal boundaries, no concern for their
impact on others.

Irresponsibility/Unreliability
Not concerned about wrecking others' lives and dreams. Oblivious or indifferent to the devastation they cause. Does not accept blame themselves, but blames others, even for acts they obviously committed.

Lack of Realistic Life Plan/Parasitic Lifestyle
Tends to move around a lot or makes all encompassing promises for the future, poor work ethic but exploits others effectively.

Criminal or Entrepreneurial Versatility
Changes their image as needed to avoid prosecution. Changes life story readily.

Psychopaths have only a shallow range of emotions and lack guilt, says Hare. They often see themselves as victims, and lack remorse or the ability to empathize with others. Psychopaths play on the fact that most of us are trusting and forgiving people, The warning signs are always there; it’s just difficult to see them because once we trust someone, the friendship becomes a blinder.

Source: http://chericola57.tripod.com/infinite.html

I invite you to review, by your definition, the history of FDR, another "sociopath".

[font size=3]Spare the insulting, lying Third Way rhetoric, Hillary. Your predatory TPP will slash jobs and cut wages. [/font size]

[font size=3]Hillary's TPP will mean a pay cut for 90 percent of American workers.[/font size]
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10023661805

The verdict is in: most U.S. workers would see wage losses as a result of the Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP), a sweeping U.S. "free trade" deal under negotiation with 11 Pacific Rim countries. That's the conclusion of a report just released by the non-partisan Center for Economic and Policy Research (CEPR).

One cannot simultaneously want the TPP and economic justice for the 99%
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=4318351

One cannot simultaneously want the TPP and economic justice for the 99% [View all]

They are violently mutually exclusive.

They absolutely know it's awful for the already-eviscerated 99%, otherwise they wouldn't hide behind an unprecedented veil of secrecy. They are sociopaths.

Wake up! We are being disembowled by sick, sick people. If we don't fight back, and quick, we will be dinner.

Hillary Clinton's leading role in drafting the TPP
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101667554

Hillary Clinton and Trade Deals: That “Giant Sucking Sound”
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1016101761

Oh yeah, "democracy" is just as beautifully exemplified by the negotiations for TPP as Mrs. Clinton's deep, deep concern for "income inequality" is in this steaming pile of a speech.

We have had enough of corporate predators in Democrat suits.

We have had enough of Third Way secrecy and lies.

Bait and switch is the corporate MO, as we have learned well in recent years. Corporate Republicans and Third Way "Democrats" are liars and predators. The Third Way has NEVER been a grass roots movement in our party. They are a Wall Street-funded, deliberate infiltration of our party by corporate predators, working with corporatist Republicans to usher in the dismantling of our democracy itself.

Hillary is an author of the antidemocratic TPP, a cozy war profiteering buddy of Kissinger, and the Kevin Bacon of Wall Street, with close connections to virtually every corporate predator in the .1 percent.

Creepy interactive graphic of Hillary Clinton's connections
to the Forbes top 400
http://www.forbes.com/sites/carolinehoward/2013/10/30/one-degree-of-hillary-how-clinton-is-connected-to-the-worlds-most-powerful/
(Load the link twice if necessary.)

This nation cannot endure four more years of predatory corporatism and warmongering.

Hillary statements will actually be in the final treaty.

intellectual property chapter which expands corporate rights and diminishes the rights of consumers to the ISDS. I really hate the ISDS. It's been used HORRIFICALLY under other trade deals.

Oh, you don't know what the ISDS is? Look it up. From your question, I'm assuming you actually know something about the TPP.

thing that comes up on google.

I did read the information and of course it mentioned NAFtA many times but since the TPP is negotiated in secret I am withholding my opinion. Leaks are not always reliable but time will tell.

That's the whole point of fast-track authority. It's about pushing this thing through with no amendments allowed, limited time for Congressional debate, and not enough room for the public to absorb it and digest its implications and weigh in on the discussion.

Leaks are all we have at this point -- and though they don't represent final versions, nobody's disputing their accuracy.

Leaks are not always accurate and just as in the case of the ACA, the GOP had many statements about it which was not true and they had the documents, as you can see there are some who wants to deliver information they want others to believe, I would rather go with the truth.

Because universe knows the loudest voices on this message board have a proven record with their predictions and speculation.

Even where they post link upon link of analysis, they are proven wrong by reality.

I have the right to wait until the contents are released before I make my decision, again I am waiting until the contents are released before I make my decision. I do not have any concern about the loudest voices and their predictions and speculations.

I should have inserted the sarcasm thingy!

Though I have yet to state an opinion on the TPP, other than to state I cannot form an opinion on something that isn't at this point, I have been called all kinds of "vile" names and cast as feeding on the flesh of the American worker, for merely pointing out that TPP is still being negotiated and that the US negotiating Objectives are inconsistent with the analysis that the anti-TPP crowd uses.

Until the final is out they are jumping into the same pool as RWers.

Same fear-mongering, same opinion passing as concluded fact; but more, same brow-beating for non-compliancy.

1. I will grant you that Barack and Hillary BOTH love the TPP. They are two Third Way peas in a pod that way. However, it is flat out disingenuous to try to deny Hillary's major role in drafting this piece of predatory shit:

The Warmongering Record of Hillary Clinton "I urged him to bomb..."
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026219783

Hillary Clinton criticizes Obama's foreign policy 'failure'; strongly defends Israel
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014867136

Hillary defends Israel on Gaza carpet bombing
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025274041

Hillary tacks right of Obama on foreign policy.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024707589

Dissecting Hillary Clinton's Neocon Talking Points - Atlantic Interview
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017209519

NYTimes notices Hillary's natural affinity toward the neocons.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025205645

Hillary Clinton, the unrepentant hawk
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024876898

Hillary Clinton Praises George W. Bush and the Art of Compromise
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026394878

Hillary Clinton's role in right-wing Honduran coup and aftermath
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025601610#post29

Hillary Clinton's Horrifying Iraq War Vote Still Matters.
http://nationalinterest.org/commentary/hillary-clintons-iraq-war-vote-still-matters-9737

Secret recordings show US military and a Democratic congressman distrusted Hillary Clinton on Libya (lying, manipulating intelligence)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10026157088

Hillary Clinton Blasts ‘Unfair’ World Reaction Over Gaza, Cites Anti-Semitism As Factor
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025364869

Obama didn't go as far as Hillary now says she wanted to go in smashing Syria
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251375376

Hand in Hand With Kissinger: A Review of Hillary Clinton’s Review
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1016102317

Hillary Clinton Serves Us KISSINGER KOOL-AID
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025504036

MJ - Hillary Clinton Praises a Guy With Lots of Blood on His Hands
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025493748

AWESOME menu, UhMerica.

When are we going to start taking elections seriously in this country?

Is GOTV worth it if all the candidates inevitably suck?

Now I understand that most of the secrets are unknown, but the free trade movement is just as bad as right to work movement.

Perhaps Hillary will do something similar.

Yeay Bill.

He may have supported it but he certainly didn't cause it.

an act which provide low level employers like walmart mikeyd's and whole host of others with a forever supply of near slave labor

maybe you don't remember but I do just prior to that 'reform' those same employers were having to offer their prospective employees all kinds of stuff they never had before like paid holidays and higher wages in some cases higher than they maybe now at least in the case of fast food places in my area

Thank you. Watch the actual policies they support, not the pretty rhetoric.

Nothing is more important than stopping Hillary or any other Third Way corporatist in a Democrat suit from being shoved down our throats as the Democratic nominee in 2016.

Corporate Republicans and the corporate Third Way are not just another flavor of politician within an essentially functioning representative government. They are building perpetual war, a police and surveillance state, and using our own laws and intelligence agencies to empower corporations over the will of the American people to dismantle democracy itself.



Hillary Clinton's leading role in drafting the TPP
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101667554

Hillary Clinton and Trade Deals: That “Giant Sucking Sound”
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1016101761

Hillary Clinton Cheerleads for Biotech and GMOs
http://www.democraticunderground.com/112772326

Dissecting Hillary Clinton's Neocon Talking Points - Atlantic Interview
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017209519

NYTimes notices Hillary's natural affinity toward the neocons.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025205645

Hillary Clinton, the unrepentant hawk
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024876898

More from Hillary Clinton's State Department: The fascistic TISA (Trade in Services Agreement)
http://m.thenation.com/blog/180572-grassroots-labor-uprising-your-bank

How Hillary Clinton's State Department sold fracking to the world
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1251376647

Hillary Clinton Sides with NSA over Snowden Disclosures
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101695441

On the NSA, Hillary Clinton Is Either a Fool or a Liar
http://m.thenation.com/article/180564-nsa-hillary-clinton-either-fool-or-liar

Corporate Warfare: Hillary Clinton admits role in Honduran coup aftermath
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025601610#post29

The Bill and Hillary Clinton Money Machine Taps Corporate Cash
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025189257

Hillary's Privatization Plan: TISA kept more secret than the TPP
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014829628

Hillary Clinton criticizes Obama's foreign policy 'failure'; strongly defends Israel
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1014867136

Some of Hillary Clinton's statements on Social Security.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10024379279

Hillary Clinton's GOLDMAN SACHS PROBLEM.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025049343

Ring of Fire: Hillary Clinton - The Perfect Republican Candidate
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017209285

How Americans Need Answers From Hillary Clinton On TPP, KXL, Wall St & More
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1017181611

Hillary Clinton Left Out By Liberal Donor Club
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025809071

Why Wall Street Loves Hillary
http://www.democraticunderground.com/1016106575

Hillary Clinton: Neocon-lite
http://www.democraticunderground.com/101684986

Interactive graphic of Hillary Clinton's connections to the Forbes top 400 (Follow link in post)
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10025824981#post9

that won't ruffle Wall Streets feathers.

Public-private partnerships? Well, we could try selling all the revenues from parking meters to a private company for 75 years for a fraction of the income stream. I can't see how that would ever fail.

Great idea, huh?

Last edited Wed Mar 25, 2015, 08:42 AM - Edit history (2)

The Clinton Foundation's theme song should be Les Miserables' Master of the House.

Master of the house
Doling out the charm
Ready with a handshake
And an open palm
Tells a saucy tale
Makes a little stir
1 percent appreciates a bon-viveur
Glad to do a friend a favor
Doesn't cost me to be nice
But nothing gets you nothing
Everything has got a little price!

Master of the house
Keeper of the zoo
Ready to relieve 'em
Of a $mil or two
Skimming off the top
Making up the weight
Pickin' up their knick-knacks
When they can't see straight
Everybody loves a landlord
Everybody's bosom friend
I do whatever pleases
Jesus! Won't I bleed 'em in the end!

Residents are more than welcome
Bridal suite is occupied
Reasonable charges
Plus some little extras on the side!

Charge 'em for the lice
Extra for the mice
Two percent for looking in the mirror twice
Here a little slice
There a little cut
Three percent for sleeping with the window shut
When it comes to fixing prices
There are a lot of tricks he knows
How it all increases
All those bits and pieces
Jesus! It's amazing how it grows!

It was Occupy Wall Street that got that ball rolling, and now even the Clintons are playing along.

It is selling snake oil to marks to get more power.

That is why I say the Clints are playing... didn't say fighting for, did I?

My point is to make sure folks realize how much impact Occupy has had. It's a shame Occupy wasn't embraced by many more, but then as long as the bank cashes your paycheck, what is there to worry about?

Also, water is wet.

Then this: "But do it in a way that lifts everybody up to deal with the overriding issues of inequality and lack of mobility."

It sounds disturbingly like "a rising tide lifts all boats".

She ignores a basic principal of economics: "zero sum". you can't lift all boats, you can't lift everybody up.

To improved the lives of the dispossessed, you have to shift wealth.

You'll never hear it from her.

Right now I'm pretty undecided about who I'll support in 2016.

We need as many people talking about this as possible so we can all work together to develop solutions.

The more people we have discussing income inequality, the better!

she starts devoting those $200,000 speeches at Goldman-Sachs to the subject.

not going to convince voters without specifics this time Hillary. We want to be in on the plan. No secret deals.

The moment is more than ripe, it's passed it's due date. The moment has gone from bad to worse, it's a rotten pile of refuse.

But yes since your running for POTUS let's bring it up now.

You heard it here first. lol.

very poor attempt.

So if she's talked about it before, what's she done about it. Where's the affect? I promptly lost my job after NAFTA, that was an effect.

She's a Third Way tool.

But do go on and convince me she's a progressive left leaning liberal.

Oh and if you happened to "miss it", see post #9. I'm sure none of that matters huh because "Go Hillary"!!!!!!

It is a great time for her to bring it up. It's always a good time to bring it up. It's why she talks about it. Sorry about your employment issues. NAFTA hurt a lot of people. I don't need to convince you she is a progressive. She clearly is. No secret there. "Third Way Tool." Always liked that one.

Nothing.

I was particular struck by "We need to think hard about what we're going to do ... But do it in a way that lifts everybody up."

There's a huge gap between thinking about what to do and doing "it" in a way what lifts everybody us. What's the "it" that should come in between? She doesn't say. Just that it will be good for everyone.

And though she's not wrong to focus on the cities, the real problem there has to do with the way gentrification is squeezing low-income residents out of the inner cities where the jobs are -- while public transportation is either not being constructed all or not being constructed where it would serve the people who are being displaced to the decaying inner suburbs.

Housing and transportation are the key issues, and no amount of focus on "jobs" in the abstract or public-private partnerships will address that.

Fucking hilarious to see Cruz talking about wealth disparity. Go Hill!!!!!!!!!!

away that is.

That is a very good thing for our party. We are now in year 14 of honoring the love of the wealth gap at the presidential level. Hillary is out there talking about it. Great for her and us. I know. You hold here completely accountable for NAFTA. I hear she is going to renegotiate NAFTA. Wait. Your right. That was someone else.

Rah rah rah sis boom bah!

You obviously didn't read #9 or if you did you've chosen to ignore it. That speaks volumes.

and one more non sequitur in order to make a legitimate point. I get it. Obama and Hillary are turd wayers. lol. Your brilliant retort helped me to form my new position in solidarity with you. Obama, Hillary, turn in your democratic credentials, with a complete lack of respect, phlem/traveler. Going to mail that to her campaign and the WH now. I will use the proper number of ha ha's and non sequiturs.

You just proved to me the clear lack of critical thinking from the Hillary crowd. Go on now, travel.

We are a really good group and would love it if you would tag along. You can ha ha and non sequitur all the way. We will keep you company.

"One of these things is not like the others,
One of these things just doesn't belong,
Can you tell which thing is not like the others
By the time I finish my song?"

have a beautiful day.

I do like being sang to. Maybe you can sing it for me.

Nothing. <- copy and pasted that from somewhere. ha ha ha ha ha ha <- for dramatic flare.

wow that stung. Good on you!

Seems you are walking away from the claim. "speaks volumes" <copy and paste

your making sense. You still haven't answered if you read post #9. I asked 1st. Either be honest or end this.

I'll read you response later as I have a life to lead right now.

This post was probably under thirty minutes ago. I can see why life is now important for you. The ha ha's and non sequiturs have run their course and their is nothing left.





"One of these things is not like the others,
One of these things just doesn't belong,
Can you tell which thing is not like the others
By the time I finish my song?"

I see your just full of , you know. Through out our discussion you have not provided one shred of fact, just babble.

The thread speaks for itself. Buh by.

I was responding to ha ha's. Not much to work with. I will still forward our letter to Obama and Clinton letting them know they are third wayers. Hillary, Warren, Sanders and Nelson would truly love your support. They are great D's. It's better than supporting the other team. Have a blessed day.

Jeesus Fing Christ.

That's it!!!????

Send them all fucking letters you want.

but as you can see in this thread, complicating things would have been much worse. It's 15 to 20 minutes of my life spent in crazy that I'll never get back, and I just wanted it to be done.

Thanks for noticing bud.

I would like to be paid US$300,000 for this plan.

You're welcome, Madame Secretary.

She wants "creative" solutions like all of the peons agreeing to move to 200 sq foot houses so Wall Street can continue to get rich off us. And the military industrial complex can continue to do it's thing (newest target: IRAN).

Good luck w/all that Mrs. Clinton.

This is why I'm baffled when people think that all we need to do is elect Warren or Sanders and everything will be all better.

Republicans would never raise taxes on the wealthy/corporations.

It's important to GOTV.

...when the Democratic nominee is pretending not even to have thought of such a thing.

Our next president isn't leading yet on this issue.

It's early yet, but I'm not very hopeful.

The Republican-controlled Congress would never pass anything like that.

That's why I said it's important to GOTV and get them out of there.

It won't matter who the President is, Republicans will NEVER raise taxes on the wealthy/corporations.

I disagree, except with your notion that the president's identity isn't so important.

We would have to demand such a thing in great numbers--so much so that filibustering it becomes politically dangerous.

But your call to "face it" sounds too uncomfortably like not facing the problem. We must lobby unceasingly.

It would have to pass a GOP-controlled House and Senate.

Good luck with that.

We could demand it all we want, but Republicans would never pass a bill which raised taxes, even temporarily. It doesn't matter how much you lobby them.

The only solution is to GOTV and get them out of there.

I agree that it's vital, but we need to get our lobby on in between elections. We need to lobby on both sides of the aisle to pull the center leftward.

They are constantly moving to the right.

Getting them to agree to tax hikes would be like getting the Pope to convert to Judaism.

It's not going to happen.

There's only one solution.

GOTV.

We just haven't done a good enough job of it yet.

We need better Republicans, but might have to settle for more Citizen's United Democrats. We need better Democrats, too, who will say what Secretary Clinton will not.

These are the same folks who shut down the government and nearly crashed the global economy during the debt ceiling and budget fight in late 2013....all because they wanted to repeal Obamacare.

You think it's possible to lobby these folks and get them to move left and raise taxes on the wealthy?

Cruz won't be president, and if encouraged by enough demand, even he will find a weasel way toward letting some sort of tax increases happen. He could even be intimidated out of a filibuster, if he gelieved his career was on the line.

Possible doesn't mean likely, and our track record of polite requests wouldn't seem to make a sea change in politics inevitable. I'll note, though, that simply voting in more of the same old Democrats may not accomplish much more--unless we've made it perfectly clear what we need from them, and that our vouces trump their dollars.

The candidate who can credibly lead on this issue has a huge advantage WRT becoming the next President.

They were dead broke when they left the White House.

Last edited Wed Mar 25, 2015, 08:40 AM - Edit history (1)

Funny thing - how did all these foreign nations ever manage to make any charitable contributions re national disasters (like Haiti) before Bill showed them the light?

This thread brought them out in droves.



Sis

The/a reason cited for a Sanders and/or Warren primary, has been (failing the more progressive's win) it would pull presumed Candidate Clinton to the left and get her talking about income inequality.

Now that presumed Candidate Clinton IS talking income inequality ... it's not believed or good enough or just another reason to gripe.

Funny how that works, huh?

when it comes to devising schemes to equalize income more equitably.

Honey, if you can't do it with all that brainpower on your team, you certainly won't be doing it as president.

Presumed Candidate Clinton should open up her playbook {Edited to correct my darned Too Smartphone's typing} before announcing her candidacy.

That's some brilliant campaign strategy, right there!

typed "playboy" instead of "playbook" ... I apologize on behalf of the phone.

Why should she say anything other than generalities before she announces her candidacy ... and even then, before she faces an opponent?

Cheers.

Is there anything presumed Candidate HRC can say that would win you over?

what you want to hear before saying you don't believe her and moving on to the next thing that you want to hear, but won't believe her if she said it.

Note: I use the "you" in its generic sense ... I really suspect that those most critical of what HRC isn't saying, would be unswayed were she to recite chapter and verse of their progressive manifesto.

This would be a fundamental shift in her perspective

Believe me when it starts hitting the wealthy in their own pockets with taxes they will sing a different tune on things like raising the minimum wage.