That's why there is such a push by GOP governors to break or curtail them.

They can't win on policy or ideology, so the lie, cheat, and steal to fix the process before the voting starts. Keeping the other side in turmoil is their only hope because the raw numbers are against them over the long haul.

that includes all trades. That could produce, eventually, a political and economic change of direction.

Unions (existing or new) should start being the business owners. Wealthy people who claim to be "big union supporters" could give multi-million dollar low/no interest 10-year loans and get together with unions and have a billion dollar fund. Split it into 3 parts (or 2 or more)

1) start buying franchises - all profits are split between workers and the fund

2) start buying companies. instead of letting rich guys buy failing companies and sell off parts, rebuild them. Also buy non-failing companies that are in a good position to be bought - the way many wealthy people get more wealthy. Split profits between workers and the fund.

3) create a venture capital group - the founders will get a big payout if their idea succeeds. after that profit is split between workers and the fund. There won't be an IPO - the fund pays the founders (one time or yearly %) then keeps profits. Provide all of the expertise, contacts and other assistance that other VC funds have.

4*) have a business support group - lobbyists, lawyers, management/marketing/franchise/... experts.

The fund will eventually have companies/workers covering a large number of industries/trades. And be large enough to buy GM (or another car company) the next time it fails.

It's not a quick fix. But it can be done within the current system and there don't appear to be any quick fixes by creating new laws within the system. Most huge companies didn't become huge overnight. The founder started with one store/restaurant/factory and built it over decades. And they did it with far less starter money than is available to unions & union supporters.

to associate unions with Democrats, an ideology that he has also been taught, is out to ruin him. We can't have strong unions again without regaining the trust and support of the blue collar workers who have been systematically reprogrammed to vote against their own best interests.

Last edited Wed Apr 1, 2015, 07:41 PM - Edit history (1)

Unfortunately that turned out to be more important to them than pay, working conditions or the collective bargaining that made them possible, so they voted for Reagan, and he destroyed the unions.

...because Dems are now beholden to some of the same corporate money that is trying to eliminate unions.

We have a winner

but I think you've got it backward.

The destruction of unions have caused democrats to turn to the same funding source (corporations) that the republicans use.

Which creates 2 problems:

1) The democrats don't govern any differently when they're elected.

2) The democrats don't have a significantly different platform than the republicans, so they lose elections.

Apparently, based on the various Democratic Party emails that they send me, they expect for me to step up and contribute as much as the Koch brothers.

They need to convince voters that when a candidate spends a lot in advertising (like Tom Cotton did) that candidate is owned free and clear by SOMEONE, or in most cases a bunch of corporate someones.

The unions didn't disappear overnight anymore than corporate donations exploded overnight. Every bit of private political donation above and beyond what our poorest citizens can afford distorts campaigns.

The rich being able to buy disproportionate influence is anathema to unions. When one is on the wane, the other will wax.

but while it was a political strategy on the part of the republicans to tear down the unions, the democrats have a choice in how to respond to that strategy.

What they've chosen to do is become 'republican lite' in the hopes of finding new employers/donors (aka corporations). I'm suggesting that what they should be doing is something different. It's a positive feedback loop: the more unions are destroyed, the more we get corporatist democrats.

I think they'd do better if they stood up to the monied interests and stood up for the working/middle class.

I'm not sure we can even credit the GOP with a strategy of union-busting, as that impulse emanates from the ruling class, of which the Republican Party is but a tool.

But it's a sort of chicken-and-egg question.

I specifically credit Scott Walker (because he's the one we hear about the most) and he is a republican, but they've been at this for a while. He just happens to be the most famous, because of his recall election.

It is the big money backers like the Koch Brothers who have actually brought it into being, but while the republicans have pretty much led the charge, that doesn't mean it is their plan.

If we go by his facial expression, the Kochs have cold hands.

Be specific.

Cause you spout some crap that insinuates elected Democrats are out to trash unions just like Republicans.

...the Democratic agenda morphs to fit, and though "just like Republicans" is an overstatement, here we are with very few politicians on the national scene emphasizing the need for stronger labor unions and/or legal protections for unions.

I believe all those can be answered "yes".

Which part is missing from the discussion.

Obama said that wherever a union was on a picket line he would be there to support them. He never came withing 500 miles of Wisconsin; never said the name of that state.

And so the organizations which support Republicans thrive, while the organizations which support Democrats wither and die.

thrown out to the public and unions are just as bad.

Unions have been under assault since Reagan (that's as far back as I can remember).

They've done little to really counter the Right's strategies.

Maybe at some point the pendulum will help as it swings back to worker's rights and organization.

But I think Unions are self-serving and too much involved in their own political squabbles.

nt

Unions.

with real people on DU. Most real people (meaning not paid to post RW shit) on DU are probably not in a union because there isn't a union to be had, thanks to RW suppression and job offshoring.

of the employees. Management just hates that.

Long-time member of the IBEW and the Teamsters, so don't start with me.

IWA, I still have my card.

It's not unlike the problem we have with our politicians, and it happens when the members don't throw them out for it.

Unions, at least, provide a benefit for their damage. Republicans only provide damage (unless you're with the .01%).

Corporations ( or the private sector et. al. ) have no less proclivity to dishonesty, corruption, inefficiency than a labor union, or even government.

But so many put business at the top of the list of the 3 as most likely to be virtuous.

and almost half of those are public employees, and the latter has been screwed badly in recent years.

I doubt we'll see a resurgence anytime soon, no matter how much it might help.

Fortunately, I think most, but certainly no all, union members -- and sympathizers (which is a much larger group) -- lean Democratic. Of course, many of those traditionally vote Democratic, anyway.

http://www.bls.gov/news.release/union2.nr0.htm

I think the ultimate "union," one with greatest chance of success right now, is a strong Democratic Party.

and ~10% of the employees bother to sign up to pay dues. All they have time to do is bitch about is management and how the union does nothing for them. All most like management knows only 10% work force walking out will do nothing. The American middle class worker works hard at everything but collective strategies to make their lives better. Most likely because from cradle to grave we are taught that hard work is rewarded in our society and to pick yourself up and do it alone. The guy that did it on their own is the patron saint of America. The backs he climbed over to do it on their own are the forgotten story. I don't know how to change the narrative, but the myth of self-empowered betterment in the American work force is strong.

Unions supported nixon. He even had some of the fools parading around as "Hard Hats for nixon" threatening anti-war protesters. It didn't stop there. Plenty of union members supported and voted for reagan.

If union members in significant numbers supported right wing republicans, the message to Democratic politicians was pretty clear.

That's why they offshored our manufacturing base and outsourced all the jobs.