If not, what would be one thing you disagree with him on?

Mine would be his pandering to gun nuts to get elected to the Senate... he is not above playing politics.... So, I think we can all get over putting him up on some pedestal like he is the only true one... We did this in 2008 already.

For some here, I believe his support for Israel's actions against Gaza would be one?

Bernie has an F rating by the NRA.

However, it is true that he voted against the brady bill.

The NRA was in love with Bernie which is not the case, In my opinion and speaking for myself only I will back Bernie Sanders until further notice, with money and our votes and I speak for my whole family.

... but, in return, is more liberal in other areas.

He voted for protecting gun manufacturer's and sellers from lawsuits back in 2005. It was quite a stunning defeat to gun-control groups.

Personally, I find O'Malley to be the most consistently liberal of the three, but that's tempered by the fact that he's completely unelectable.

with the least restrictive gun laws possible(within the federal limits).

Guns aren't a huge issue for me so it isn't something that offends as same with Dean & I'm consistently liberal. One of the most progressive states also favors gun rights. Same here but it is a very secondary issue, doesn't swing my vote either way.

For those sites.

- he is supportive of the Iran deal. On Israel/Palestine, it is impossible to find a Senator who would NOT support Israel. I think he, like most Senators, backed the 2 state solution.

In 1993, Sanders voted for a National Rifle Association (NRA)-supported bill to restrict lawsuits against gun manufacturers and against the Brady Bill.

That would be like suing a car manufacturer for someone who was run over by a reckless driver. He was correct in voting against it.

The pony, rainbow pooping unicorn memes were something DU's right made up to bash DU's left with. They were never the reality.

It's not nice to hold others to a standard one does not hold themselves too.

If never, isn't your directing me to stop something I never did misleading?

How could you vote for her?? I mean TPP TPP TPP TPP TPP is the end all be all and how you could you possibly be for someone who "might" support that? It is so undemocratic and unliberal!

You're right, I never see that standard being applied.

I did at some point, don't you think?

I don't accuse you of every behavior of every Hillary supporter on the board that displeases, do I? That's bizarre.

I treat you as an individual, not as a poster child for every bad behavior of every Hillary supporter.

cheers!

as much as supporters of anyone else, if not more so.

There is a difference between my making a general statement about Hillary supporters a group and your posting to me "Don't do X."

BTW, what is the point of this tedious game? If it's about getting the last word, it's yours.

So, I asked...

I'm not playing any game.

Correct.

and no, this isn't meant as a sleight to the person that made the typo.

so you don't need to continue to make shit up- poorly. this is a real issue and I think Bernie is flat wrong on it.

(oh, at least Bernie was mildly critical of the Israeli attack on Gaza when he called it an overreaction. Hillary? Uh no You will never find a critical word from passionately pro-Israel Hillary. )

So go do your own research, but here's what to type into google search: Bernie Sanders F-35

I do not agree with Bernie on Israel. I think it's perfectly valid to bring it up- though as Hillary is even MORE pro-I, it's kind of pointless.

I do not agree with Bernie on the F-35. I believe his position is flat out indefensible.

He has not been strong on federal gun control- though he has supported background checks, he thinks most gun control should be a state issue. I agree with him on this, but others certainly don't.

But I'm nothing like you. I don't live in denial and I don't make stuff up- like laughably claiming that Bernie is just copying Hillary in opposing Citizens United.

I don't agree with Bernie on everything. But I do think that what he supports he honestly believes and has strong reasons for doing so. I think he is honest in stating those reasons. But for the most part, he represents my values very closely.

And I think that political expediency is not in his makeup. I don't think he has or will sell out. That is very rare these days and is one of the reasons for all the enthusiasm since his announcement.

Which candidate represents your beliefs?

I voted for Edwards in the primary and Kerry for president.

So, what does that tell you. I assume a lot of people criticizing Hillary voted for one who drafted the iwr and another who also voted for it.

The other was 100% correct that the war was an abomination, would create ISIS, would kill a million innocent people, and would and did take away from social programs and the good of the people in this country. Not to mention that we had no right to invade a country which had not attacked us as Hillary clearly states in her speech. If you think Clinton did not vote for the war because of political expediency, then why was she so wrong when millions of people knew everything she said was untrue?

I am saying that claiming that one is supporting Clinton because she is a strong fighter and can raise a lot of money is fair. She has proven that. But acting like her record is anything but what it is is entirely disingenuous.

You're right in that this election might come down to IWR again, in which case Hillary is screwn and Jeb wins. But let's hope it doesn't.

Not the strongest logic I've ever seen. But the last few days have been historical in that regard.

Make it 20 if you like.

I am 99.99% sure that he will be. And that is the argument of why people don't need to support Clinton just because they are afraid of a Republican winning. I think that Jeb is so awful a candidated, detested by anything to the left of McCarthy and loathed by conservatives. I can't see any blue states breaking for Jeb and they absolutely must for a Republican to win an election. I don't think independents will break for him either.

That is why whomever wins the Democratic primary wins the election. I am speaking with other Hillary supporters in other threads just today that a Democrat walks into the general with 257 votes and a Republican walks in with 149. A Republican would have to win every swing state and a solidly blue state to get to 270. Short of election theft on a massive scale or a huge October surprise (entirely possible) it is almost statistically impossible for a Republican to win the presidency for the near future. It's simple arithmetic.

That's why it is possible for a liberal/left-leaning progressive to win this time. Obama ran as a solid liberal and had a pretty easy time of it, Republican cash not withstanding.

Sorry no sale. Bernie could be a super guy but he's a long shot to win and we don't need to mess with a sure thing at this moment.

p.s. Clinton has one vulnerability and that's IWR and I don't think it's an accident that an otherwise improbable candidate comes along who can hold that against her. I'm not saying Bernie's a player but I imagine he'll get the attention of the usual suspects.

I think that's a fair and honest reponse. If you back Clinton because you think she's the only one who can win, I know that her ability to raise a lot of cash is formidable.

It says quite a lot that we are supposed to only think people who can buy the presidency are even eligible.

Did you vote the Kerry Edwards ticket?

I thought that he was not a good candidate for a national election. He was the establishment candidate and did not generate enthusiasm. People seem to forget that that is important. You can have all the money in the world, but you can't buy that.

I voted for Edwards. It obviously wasn't a make or break for me 11 years ago and isn't today either.

I'm sure it wasn't a make a break for many people back then either including yourself.

Yes, it was important to me then because I think that any leader who was so wrong about it, when so many other Democrats had the courage to vote against it, was too entrenched or severely compromised. Hence, the lack of him being a candidate that created enthusiasm. He was running against the war, or he could have, if he had not voted for it.

Do I think IWR is make or break for non-political junkies in 2016? No. Do I think the appearance of representing the establishment is? YES.

I'm just trying to understand people's motivations for backing a candidate. The best and frankly most honest one I have seen is that Hillary has the ability to raise the most cash which is absolutely necessary to win. I think I have raised very important facts that refute that, but if that is the reason, fair enough. What doesn't work is when people try to claim she is the most liberal, progressive candidate running. She isn't. As I said, I admire and expect people to be honest and forthright. I think Clinton supporters would get a lot less pushback if they would just be honest.

I support Hillary Clinton. I took the time and answered you and it just wasn't good enough I suppose.

She is a liberal and progressive and a democrat. Dennis Kucinich was also regaled as the most liberal progressive choice around here. People can support who they like. I'm not concerning myself as to someone's personal motivations.

I like Hillary and think she will make a great President.

That's what usually passes for discussion.That is what civil discourse is about: people presenting their arguments and then debating the issues. I think good reasoning stands up to vigorous debate.

supported the IWR. And you voted for at least one as well.

I told you it wasn't a deal breaker for me in response to your inquiry regarding it.

I'm not sure how much more help I can be or how much more clear I could be.

Most American support it.

He's not running for president of the gun control minority of America.

Still, he supports magazine limits and I don't:

http://www.ontheissues.org/domestic/Bernie_Sanders_Gun_Control.htm

Love it! And, we will win.We will all win when Bernie wins!

Your suit may be snazzier but I bet my dresses are

I feel all warm and comfortable now.

-- Mal

Meanwhile, America will hear him.

Either way, my support of him is a great investment for me.

If supporting him is not a good investment for you, don't support him.

Funny and profound all at once.

And oh yes the promise to run a clean campaign, immediately followed by a deep dive into Clinton Cash. Or maybe it would be best to avoid the subject altogether as it's already a little shopworn.

The precursor of better things to come. And better than the honest truth, is damned hard to imagine.

I'm glad Bernie had the great good sense, to run on the democratic ticket.

I think the man is electable.

Is he perfect? No mortal man is.

We wanted hope and change in 2008, I think we still do.

That makes it sound like either the "sex talk" or the "stranger talk." Maybe it's the "DRUG TALK"




good grief!!

What a nice black and white victory picture, from the past, too.

I had no idea he was THAT much of a believer in anything political.He has researched Bernie's entire political career and agrees with everything Sanders has stood for. It's very inspiring to me..

if anything he strikes me as a competent politician.

I don't have kids, but I have nieces and nephews and great nieces and nephews. They all need to be part of the discussion. I plan to talk with the whole lot of them. GO BERNIE!