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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsSenator Sanders: It's True. He's Not an Obama.
And that's one reason why he's going to have a very hard time becoming the Democratic nominee. Like Obama was, he's pretty much an unknown, but there the resemblance ends. Both have been Senators, though. One was a Democratic Senator and the other is currently an Independent/Democratic Socialist Senator. One is no longer in the Senate. He is the President of the United States.
One spoke at the 2004 Democratic Convention and made a great impression on people. The other has not spoken at any Democratic Convention because he is not a Democrat, and is known really well pretty much only in his own state, one of the states with the lowest populations in the country. Oddly, enough, though, the Governor of that state has already endorsed Hillary Clinton. What that will mean remains to be seen. Citizens of Vermont really like having Senator Sanders in the Senate, and have elected him several times to that office. It's not clear that Vermont will vote for him for President on March 1, 2016. It may, but nobody knows at this point.
Both have had some great ideas. One has managed to get several of those put in place, despite a hostile Congress. The other has not had great success getting his own bills through the Senate, but has voted with the Democrats on most issues. That's in his favor, but his own bills have not done so well. Sanders votes with the Democratic caucus, but has maintained his independence from the Democratic party.
One mobilized a demographic that normally didn't turn out for elections in large percentages, energizing a community that he uniquely represented. The other, we're not sure of in terms of turning out masses of voters to win primaries. He might turn out people who don't normally vote in massive numbers, like millennials, but perhaps not in numbers high enough to overcome a popular Democratic opponent, who also represents an under-represented demographic group, and has high popularity among blacks and Hispanics, as did Obama.
Obama will not be running in the 2016 primaries. He's already in his second term in the White House, and cannot run again. At some point, Obama, who is still very popular, will endorse a candidate. There's no uncertainty about who that candidate will be, and that candidate will gain many votes from than endorsement. The other will not be endorsed by most influential current office holders. That could make a real difference in the primary elections.
Senator Sanders will have me supporting him in Minnesota's caucus and convention system. President Obama had that support as well, in 2008 and 2012. So they have that in common. How important that will be in Minnesota, though, is not clear. My caucus and convention support will probably not be enough to get me to the state convention, where delegates to the national convention will be selected. Hillary Clinton enjoys high popularity in Minnesota among likely primary voters and caucus-goers. She will likely prevail in Minnesota. It would be remarkable if she didn't.
It is correct. Bernie Sanders is not an Obama. That will probably prove to be a drawback in his primary candidacy. Barack Obama won because he is an Obama. His dynamism, relative youth, and skills as a speaker, along with many other factors, led him to two nominations and two elections as President. Being an Obama is a big plus when you're running for national office. It's not a good think that Senator Sanders is so different from Obama. It's a big challenge to overcome, if he can. We'll find out next year.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)Americans want change, real change.
We voted for it in 2008, but got only a small portion.
Bernie clearly represents change, and his views are far more mainstream than those of any other declared candidate, and he's had those same views for years.
The key is in getting the word out.
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)I do reality, instead. It's not always ideal, but it's real.
Exilednight
(9,359 posts)What is makes up our culture.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)HassleCat
(6,409 posts)Yep. That's what the primaries are for, to see who can leap the hurdles. Conventional wisdom says Sanders lacks the charisma and nationwide appeal to get the nomination, but conventional wisdom has been wrong before.
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)at our caucuses and conventions. If he's not Minnesota's choice or doesn't become the nominee, I'll support the person who is that nominee.
TheNutcracker
(2,104 posts)cali
(114,904 posts)I've never seen you say why you support him. I've never seen you defend him against some ridiculous smears- I often see you defend and praise HRC. Extrapolating from your body of posts, not just those on Bernie and HC, it seems you have a much stronger affinity for HRC than Bernie.
You're conflating Obama's record as President with Bernie's as Senator. Seeing as Obama was a Senator, wouldn't it be far more apt to compare their records in the Senate? Of course it would.
From your posts, it's evident that you don't actually know very much about Bernie's record in Congress.
You constantly knock Bernie, on way or another. Constantly praise HRC. It just seem odd that you keep claiming you'll caucus for him without having said why.
Frankly, I think you're much more an HRC supporter. And you know what they say: With friends like you who needs enemies.
I also don't think it's likely that Bernie will prevail, but no one would doubt that I genuinely support him. I imagine I'm not the only person on DU that finds your "support" of Bernie, curious.
onehandle
(51,122 posts)L0oniX
(31,493 posts)brooklynite
(94,592 posts)Response to onehandle (Reply #5)
cali This message was self-deleted by its author.
cali
(114,904 posts)In fact, I have said repeatedly here that I like and respect most HRC supporters here at DU.
So why are you inferring I said anything of the sort, putting the word enemies in quotation marks so it appears that it's a word I used in reference to Hillary supporters? I thought I was clear as to the context of the use of that word in my post.
Care to explain that and what your post has to do with the post of mine you responded to? It would be appreciated.
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)he will enthusiastically endorse Hillary Clinton. So will I. In the meantime, I support Senator Sanders, since he comes closest to my views on almost all issues. I refuse to attack Clinton, though. I cannot do that, and then support her later if she is the candidate. I'm consistent that way.
Despite my support, I do not believe that Bernie Sanders will be the nominee. I can't see any path to that, frankly, but I will be supporting him here in Minnesota, because he represents my viewpoints well. That in no way means that I'll be fighting against Hillary Clinton. Neither will Sanders. We should pay attention to what he is saying and follow his lead in this.
L0oniX
(31,493 posts)cali
(114,904 posts)while using that as a platform to slam said candidate, never defend that candidate against smears, but appear in the smear threads, and "praise" that candidate in a way that comes off as criticism. What's the point?
Maybe OP believes Reaganomic trickledown economics. This appears to be to tie that binds all on DU I personally consider right wing.
I do not understand the reasoning for the trashy support either.
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)every Democratic candidate since my first election in 1966. I have never been a Republican. You do not know me. Truly you do not.
PowerToThePeople
(9,610 posts)my apologies.
edit - dug up from the archives.
foo_bar (4,124 posts)
16. is irony a mineral?
I have no real problem with requiring parental notification or even consent for minors, as long as there is a judicial option for those few cases where incest is involved.
As you may know, I'm not a pro-lifer. I'm not a huge pro-choicer, either. <...>
17 posted on 9/1/2006 3:50:36 PM by MineralMan (Non-evangelical Atheist)
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1693928/posts
Newsbabe alert:
2 posted on 2/9/2006 2:58:52 PM by MineralMan (godless atheist)
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1575339/posts
Obama is an idiot. <...>
114 posted on 9/26/2006 11:04:48 AM by MineralMan (Non-evangelical Atheist)
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1706416/posts?page=113
Obama is not going to be elected President of the United States. The story is irrelvant.
posted on 3/10/2006 9:34:36 AM by MineralMan (godless atheist)
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1593766/posts
IMO, Ahnuld is just a Democrat in Republican clothing. He supports nothing that is Conservative in nature and much that is Liberal.
<...>
At least McClintock is true to his beliefs. Personally, I think we Californians should ask Ahnuld to step out of the race and vote for McClintock.(*)
33 posted on 9/25/2003 2:08:15 PM by MineralMan (godless atheist)
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/989350/posts
SixString
(1,057 posts)"MineralMan wrote:
Hillary is too stupid to be President. Her RFK remark sealed the deal. It won't go away, and will also end any chance she might have had at being the VP choice. Way to go, Hill..."
http://forum.darwincentral.org/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=13378&start=75
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1706416/posts?page=113
That poster is a pathetically transparent mountebank.
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)You can attend my precinct caucus as a guest, and you'll see me supporting Senator Sanders. You won't be able to vote, of course, since that's for precinct residents, but you'll see me supporting him.
I'm a Democrat. During primaries, I support the person I agree with the most. I supported Barack Obama in 2008 and 2012. I'll support Senator Sanders in 2016. If he prevails, I'll support him right through the general election. If he does not, I'll support Hillary Clinton as the nominee.
So, you're not going to see me trashing a candidate I may well be supporting. Not a chance. I love Sanders, because he comes the closest to representing my point of view on many issues. I don't think he'll be the nominee, though. So, I'll support HRC if she is the eventual nominee. I will not, under any circumstances, attack her at any point during the primaries. I leave that to others.
Response to cali (Reply #4)
Marr This message was self-deleted by its author.
djean111
(14,255 posts)Basic LA
(2,047 posts)Humphry, lifelong fighter for unions & the New Deal, wasn't good enough for us, & I personally worked hard for McGovern, who then lost 49 states in the election & gave us Nixon. Here we go again.
jwirr
(39,215 posts)MineralMan
(146,317 posts)I've voted for losing Democratic candidates more than once. I've campaigned for them and have been disappointed when they lost. Politics can be frustrating.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Sure are doing a lot of hand wringing over him.
djean111
(14,255 posts)99Forever
(14,524 posts)I've had quite enough of being manipulated, lied to, triangulated, and stabbed in the back by Democrats pretending to be on my side and then doing the bidding of the .01%.
CountAllVotes
(20,875 posts)and America loves UNIQUE and BRILLIANT = a winning combination!!!
MineralMan
(146,317 posts)That's why I'm supporting him here in Minnesota. I'm not convinced, though, that he has a great chance of winning the Democratic nomination. That's why I'm not attacking Hillary Clinton in any way. Check with Bernie. He's not attacking her, either. He's brilliant that way, too. If he doesn't win the nomination, he'll endorse Clinton and help her get elected. So, I think, should all of us at DU if he's not the eventual nominee. To do otherwise is to hurt the chances of electing a Democratic President in 2016. That's my overall goal.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)...in the eyes of some Hillary supporters.
brooklynite
(94,592 posts)AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Cuz, you know, socialism and stuff...
brooklynite
(94,592 posts)...as opposed to seeing being self-identified as a Socialist as a major impediment to national electability.
AgingAmerican
(12,958 posts)Your 'impediment' theory is hot air.
beaglelover
(3,486 posts)DinahMoeHum
(21,794 posts). . .but regardless of who wins the Democratic nomination, I will support that candidate for POTUS. Even if that candidate is Hillary Clinton. Even if I have to put a clothespin on my nose at the polling place.
Because I will absolutely not fucking stomach a candidate with an (R) after it in the White House .
And I will have no sympathy whatsoever for ANYBODY here who stays home and refuses to vote in the general election because their candidate didn't win the nomination.
"Decisions are made by those who show up."
http://www.truth-out.org/opinion/item/19833-william-rivers-pitt-decisions-are-made-by-those-who-show-up
If you're not at the table, you're on the menu.
Jamaal510
(10,893 posts)a long time before this country sees a candidate as influential and as unique as Obama again (if ever). In addition to his service as a Senator, O had quite the background story. He was born in Hawaii, he spent time as a community organizer and a university professor, and ran to be the first Black president in the nation's history. All of this captivated the media's attention for a while as he ran the first time. He became a household name, inspiring millions (myself included) to become politically-active (in some cases, for the first time). Plus, his campaign was more social media-savvy, and had much more financial support at this point than Sanders does. They didn't have the CU ruling to deal with yet. Sanders meanwhile has more of an uphill climb between the lack of money, the country's misunderstanding about the meaning of socialism, and "Bernie Sanders" still being a fairly unknown name to many non-politicos.
Number23
(24,544 posts)Like you said, it will be a long time before the country sees a candidate as influential and electric as Obama. He has inspired people around the globe and will for a long time.
Cha
(297,290 posts)AtomicKitten
(46,585 posts)... and that's getting voters to trust a candidate again with a record that is as consistent as the day is long. As people get to know him as a candidate, they will know that he is a serial truth-teller and on their side. Hillary is not and all the money she has at her disposal cannot can't buy it.