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busterbrown

(8,515 posts)
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 02:20 PM Jun 2015

Basically 2 type of responses today to this tragedy..

Those who want to just blame hatred..w/o mentioning gun procurement issues in this Country
And people like myself who want to make sure that the conversation is brought to a new level..

Lunacy and Hatred are sure prevalent in this country..But so is the ability for the ones who hate and destroy to obtain the means to do so.

15 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Basically 2 type of responses today to this tragedy.. (Original Post) busterbrown Jun 2015 OP
with wmds like guns Romeo.lima333 Jun 2015 #1
Yup, weapons of mass destruction madokie Jun 2015 #3
Semi. Igel Jun 2015 #12
Ok madokie Jun 2015 #14
What you said. nt flamin lib Jun 2015 #2
I'd argue there's a significant middle ground. Lizzie Poppet Jun 2015 #4
Problem is.. Right Wing although will blame the busterbrown Jun 2015 #5
Yeah...they'd use it to target Obamacare. Lizzie Poppet Jun 2015 #8
I would argue that racists are pushing gun ownership BrotherIvan Jun 2015 #9
Fear of all minorities.. but you're correct as far as I am concerned ..n/t busterbrown Jun 2015 #10
If the person was never seen for mental upaloopa Jun 2015 #6
The problem with this framing is that hateful bigots without guns use bombs and fire Bluenorthwest Jun 2015 #7
I think if you explored statistics on this matter.. busterbrown Jun 2015 #11
Another problem with the frame is that it promotes prohibitionism as a solution Eleanors38 Jun 2015 #13
Well said. nt Mojorabbit Jun 2015 #15

madokie

(51,076 posts)
3. Yup, weapons of mass destruction
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 02:24 PM
Jun 2015

we seen that last night. No matter how anyone wants to or tries to twist this, automatic guns are weapons of mass destruction. 9 dead, need I go further?

Igel

(35,359 posts)
12. Semi.
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 04:24 PM
Jun 2015

And note that he reloaded several times.

These are the kinds of guns that aren't usually covered in "assault weapon" bans, so ... This wasn't an assault weapon?

Still, it was semi-automatic (do they even make fully automatic handguns? ... Ah, Google tells me that the Glock 18 is fully automatic, but such kinds of pistols are "extremely rare&quot .

Sorry, definitions matter if we are interested in communication of thoughts, propositions, and logic and not just emotions or attitudes.

 

Lizzie Poppet

(10,164 posts)
4. I'd argue there's a significant middle ground.
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 02:27 PM
Jun 2015

While this atrocity should bolster calls for a combination of universal background checks and increased access to mental health records* for the NICS database, it's quite possible to do that and still recognize that insane, violent racism was the primary cause.

* I haven't seen anything stating that the shooter had prior mental healthcare involvement and would have been denied the transfer of his .45, but greater access to records and a broader range of disqualifying diagnoses, etc., would make universal checks much more effective in preventing mass shooters.

busterbrown

(8,515 posts)
5. Problem is.. Right Wing although will blame the
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 02:30 PM
Jun 2015

healthcare system.. The Extremists of the NRA want nothing to do with term healthcare..

This is America Baby.. We don’t need intrusion.

BrotherIvan

(9,126 posts)
9. I would argue that racists are pushing gun ownership
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 03:11 PM
Jun 2015

Because fear of black people sells a lot of guns. And both racism and guns are a scourge on this country.

upaloopa

(11,417 posts)
6. If the person was never seen for mental
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 02:44 PM
Jun 2015

health issues there would be no record to check.
Family and friends are the ones who have information about the person's condition.

 

Bluenorthwest

(45,319 posts)
7. The problem with this framing is that hateful bigots without guns use bombs and fire
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 03:03 PM
Jun 2015

Single largest attack on LGBT people was an arson in a bar. Over 30 people killed. Straight people set fire to gay places all the time, African American churches and entire towns have been burned. The weapon most associated with racist violence in the US is the rope. We've all heard about Rosewood.
So yes, guns very bad, too easy too many. But if they all vanished at sundown, the hate would still be taking lives. The problems is a human problem.

busterbrown

(8,515 posts)
11. I think if you explored statistics on this matter..
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 03:46 PM
Jun 2015

and compare the present to yesteryear (up to the 1980’s) Gun crimes against minorities far outweigh
ropes and fires..Sad situation..

 

Eleanors38

(18,318 posts)
13. Another problem with the frame is that it promotes prohibitionism as a solution
Thu Jun 18, 2015, 04:30 PM
Jun 2015

to the huge problem of racism being legitimized in this society.

I wouldn't want to deny Any minority the right to comparable self-defense. It is everyone's choice under the Constitution, and not for anyone to deny.

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