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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsCollege Students Refuse To Read Award-Winning Novel Because It Violates Their Christian Beliefs
Well, if they do not like it--IMHO--then they should critique it--be part of a discussion. Don't have to like it. But going to a University should open the mind. Not close it.
http://www.thenewcivilrightsmovement.com/davidbadash/college_students_refuse_to_read_award_winning_novel_because_it_violates_their_christian_beliefs
by David Badash
August 24, 2015 8:37 AM
College Students Refuse To Read Award-Winning Novel Because It Violates Their Christian Beliefs
Some freshmen students at Duke University are protesting the assignment of Fun Home, claiming reading it would violate their Christian beliefs.
Fun Home is an award-winning, New York Times best-selling graphic novel and memoir that was adapted for the theatre and recently won five Tonys, including the coveted Tony Award for Best Musical. The book and the Broadway show both deal with the very personal, challenging, and emotional issues of its author, Alison Bechdel, including growing up, discovering she is a lesbian, and learning her father, who commits suicide, was gay.
The book was assigned to incoming Duke University freshmen as part of their summer reading list, but as Claire Ballentine at The Chronicle, Duke's student newspaper, reports, several Christian students strongly objected to the book and refused to read it, citing their deeply-held religious beliefs.
I feel as if I would have to compromise my personal Christian moral beliefs to read it, Brian Grasso wrote on the Duke University Class of 2019 Facebook page, a closed group. He cited its graphic visual depictions of sexuality, as part of his reason. Duke did not seem to have people like me in mind, he added. It was like Duke didnt kno
.....................
Reading the book will allow you to open your mind to a new perspective and examine a way of life and thinking with which you are unfamiliar, freshman Marivi Howell-Arza wrote.
Iggo
(47,571 posts)Fucking idiots.
Nuclear Unicorn
(19,497 posts)Johnny2X2X
(19,118 posts)The norm today is for them not only to refuse to read it, but for them to demand that no one else reads it either.
Blue_Tires
(55,445 posts)or mommy+daddy scratched out a big donation...
ANYTHING that challenges them, that requires them to think, violates their beliefs.
They are taught to question nothing and reject anything that questions the world view they've been conditioned to.
Iggo
(47,571 posts)yardwork
(61,712 posts)Why bother?
LWolf
(46,179 posts)The status that comes from having gotten that paper. It represents power.
I deal with these people all the time. I'm a teacher. There are parents every year that don't want me teaching their children to question. It's an issue every year, because that's the foundation of my classroom. So far, I've had admins who back me. I've been lucky.
My students aren't adults, so their parents have more influence. I have to work with them, and am pretty good at doing so.
College students are adults. There shouldn't be any pandering to their need to be insular.
Warpy
(111,359 posts)or the commission as an officer in the military (more likely) because WAR is never against their Christian beliefs.
They really all need to go to bible schools and leave the state schools and name schools like Duke to people who want to think.
thesquanderer
(11,993 posts)Remember it's a graphic novel. While ironically "graphic" does have an alternate definition of "explicit," in this case it means "illustrated." So while it may be an "explicit" novel as well, what they are objecting to is that it is an "illustrated" novel. Note the quote from the article (I know, almost nobody ever actually reads the linked articles before commenting on them...)
The nature of Fun Home means that content that I might have consented to read in print now violates my conscience due to its pornographic nature,
(emphasis added)
It's the visual images he is objecting to, as pornography. He was open to reading it otherwise.
TheBlackAdder
(28,222 posts)ProgressiveEconomist
(5,818 posts)but rather recommended summer reading, if I read the OP correctly. Challenging your professor in this way is something very few grade-grubbers would dare attempt IMO.
Betty Karlson
(7,231 posts)Hence their insistance that it violates their beliefs: reading this would reduce the insulation. This is also behind all that silly "no marriage licence for you" language.
---
Of course, Christians wouldn't mind reading the book, or issuing that licence, since they know it is possible to honestly disagree with government policy, even on hot-button issues.
And quite a few Christians will be happy to broaden their mind by that book, and delighted to send a same-gender couple of to their buptials.
There are people of hate, people of faith, and people of good faith.
Orsino
(37,428 posts)Students who've led very sheltered lives might not feel ready for it--but I'll go ahead and assume homophobia.
awoke_in_2003
(34,582 posts)A piece of work that gives fiction a bad name.
bulloney
(4,113 posts)Only hear, see and read what you want to hear, see and read. God forbid if you're exposed to something that makes you uncomfortable or you don't agree with.
Gman
(24,780 posts)ladyVet
(1,587 posts)Nobody is asking them to live the scenario in the book, just read it for future discussion, leading to a grade. So they can pass the course. And graduate.
"Deeply held religious beliefs" should be ground for immediate dismissal from the school, so more deserving students can have a chance.
I hear Liberty University is still around. Maybe these students should go there.
Jamastiene
(38,187 posts)If they start pulling their "deeply held religious beliefs" to refuse to learn or participate in their coursework if it happens to involve any gay themes, they should be shipped off on the first bus to Liberty University. Why should the majority of people have to put up with their insolence? They make a big stink about anything and everything to do with gay people and half of them wear mixed linens and/or eat at Red Lobster. They are only making a big to-do about it to out-Christian each other. They are proud of themselves for that nonsense. It's all about their pride. Seems they haven't read their Bibles either, or don't understand it.
Bettie
(16,129 posts)Give them a zero for that assignment.
They chose their action, they can accept the consequences for it.
They should get an "F" for freedom of choice
Gman
(24,780 posts)earthside
(6,960 posts)The 'book' sounds like trash to me (call it a 'graphic novel' ... it's a comic book).
From the reviews I've read the story line sounds like a wallowing in everything that so-called 'political correctness' is infamous for attempting to foist on the public.
But the students are wrong to default to their 'Christianity' as an excuse not to look at the comic book at all. They ought to read a chapter of two and if they don't like it, write or report their critique.
Of course, the teacher or professor ought to also be open-minded enough to accept that some students might indeed think that this comic book is trash. Open-mindedness does go both ways.
Blue_Adept
(6,402 posts)Because that's what it is.
A comic book is the monthly single issue floppies that used to be released to newstands.
Graphic novels are either the compilations of them or the original works that are created and sold in bookstores. Like the John Lewis multipart series that's topping the graphic novel best seller list on the New York Times among others.
mahatmakanejeeves
(57,621 posts)Dukes 2015 summer reading selection is poised to generate interesting discussion when the freshmen arrive on campus this August.
Fun Home by Alison Bechdel was chosen by the Duke Common Experience selection committeea group composed of faculty, students and stafffor first-years to read during the summer. The book is a graphic memoir that deals with weighty topics such as suicide, sexual identity, death and abuse, and it will serve as a focus of conversation during the Class of 2019s orientation week. The decision came after the committee debated six other final selections.
I was hesitant at first to support it as a welcoming text to Duke University, said junior Ibanca Anand, a committee member. Then I realized how critical these discussions are for so many of us, and it's important that we establish this school as a place that is open and unafraid to talk about things that affect people." ... She said the committees decision was not as easy as last year when Americanah by Chimamanda Ngozi Adichie was selected unanimously.
Fun Home follows the story of Bechdels childhood as she comes out as lesbian and finds out that her father was gay. After his apparent suicide, she embarks on a process of reflection and discovery that leads to revelations about her father and her relationship with him. In its review, the New York Times called it a comic book for lovers of words.
Freshmen skipping Fun Home for moral reasons
For some members of the Class of 2019, the choice of Fun Home as a summer reading book was anything but fun.
Several incoming freshmen decided not to read Fun Home because its sexual images and themes conflicted with their personal and religious beliefs. Freshman Brian Grasso posted in the Class of 2019 Facebook page July 26 that he would not read the book because of the graphic visual depictions of sexuality, igniting conversation among students. The graphic novel, written by Alison Bechdel, chronicles her relationship with her father and her issues with sexual identity.
TheSarcastinator
(854 posts)that you are more qualified to make the reading selection for incoming University students than the faculty at Duke. If only they had your finely tuned critical senses and could determine what is "trash" and what is literature without even reading the book in question or having a clue as to its genre and impact, they could live up to your amazingly high educational standards.
alarimer
(16,245 posts)Saying "it's only a comic book" implies that it's for kids. Many of these graphic novels are not intended for kids at all.
Literature is more than just all those dead white male authors that we call "the classics." People haven't stopped writing, so teaching only those classics leaves out a whole lot of other stuff that is just as worthy.
DetlefK
(16,423 posts)The medium (a series of images and text) is the same, but the content is different. That's like sorting all movies into the two classical theater-play categories of comedy and drama.
Comics are light entertainment. Graphic novels tell deep stories. That's the difference.
For example: The "Rohrschach"-issue from the "Watchmen"-series.
A Rohrschach-image is mirror-symmetric. In this issue the panels on each double-page were mirror-symmetric. The layout of the novel itself mirrored the artistic content! You won't find that in "comic books". This is attention to detail and message.
earthside
(6,960 posts)So, it's a "tragicomic" book.
Orrex
(63,225 posts)The only people I've ever seen get upset about the distinction, in fact, are artists or fans who are for some reason ashamed of their chosen medium.
It's like science fiction authors who insist that their science fiction novels aren't science fiction, such as Atwood and Ellison.
DetlefK
(16,423 posts)We can argue what genre a piece of art belonged to when it was created, but that would be useless. It only matters what genre a piece of art belongs to in hindsight.
Orrex
(63,225 posts)For that matter, comic books were "funny books" for decades.
I would be interested to review the yardstick by which one work is anointed as "a graphic novel," while another is denigrated as "a comic book." Surely there must be an unimpeachable source for this information? Who has authority to hand out these ironclad and inviolable designations?
More to the point, what is the value of arbitrarily assigning these labels?
DetlefK
(16,423 posts)I see no use in calling an unfunny "graphic novel" a "comic".
I see no use in calling a Garfield comic-strip something else but a "comic".
Orrex
(63,225 posts)As long as we don't pretend that the distinction has any real meaning beyond "personal preference at a given moment," then there's no problem. But when people insist that this title is a "graphic novel" while that title is only a comic book, then it's simply an exercise in public masturbation.
surrealAmerican
(11,364 posts)You're judging a book you haven't actually read as being against your beliefs. It's just that your "beliefs" in this matter are that graphic novels are trash not literature.
earthside
(6,960 posts)I don't have to read all the way through a Barbara Cartland novel (for example) to decide that it is pulp romantic fiction not worthy of my time.
Highfalutin comic books called 'graphic novels' are fine for what they are -- the particular work in question just sounds politically trashy to me from reviews I have looked at.
All I am saying is that the Christian students are wrong in a college setting to use their religious beliefs to boycott the book completely. They should use reasoning and critical skills to object ... and the instructor should be fine with that because higher education is all about being open-minded.
starroute
(12,977 posts)And though you might read partway through a Barbara Cartland novel before deciding it's not worth your time, you don't even have to go that far with a graphic novel. You know they're jumped up gutter trash without taking a look. And you believe that if the college students had just used their "critical skills" to explain why they were refusing to read the book, the teacher would have been fine with it.
A couple of points. One is that there's an emerging genre of intensely serious graphic novels, many of them autobiographical in nature, that includes titles like Maus and Persepolis. Here's a listing of some of them: http://flavorwire.com/451552/25-essential-graphic-novels/view-all
Second is that the visual style of these graphic novels is very far from the neo-pulp of most comic books. They're often a bit gritty, typically in black and white, and without the idealizations and exaggerations of superhero comics. Here's a page from Fun House:
And third is that graphic novels are increasingly where the action is. They're where writers with something important to say know they can say it in a way that will make an impact. And any college reading list that attempted to stick to print-only works would be cutting itself off from something very vital and creative.
RadiationTherapy
(5,818 posts)The two work synergetically, as they ought.
Hekate
(90,829 posts)I'm an old print on paper aficionado, but have to say graphic novels are quite an emergent art form in literature.
Hissyspit
(45,788 posts)Puzzledtraveller
(5,937 posts)beerandjesus
(1,301 posts)....and it's very good.
Not the greatest thing ever written, but nowhere near as bad as some of the crap I read in school!
yardwork
(61,712 posts)It's a coming of age story not unlike most others. It's not particularly political at all - not "politically correct" either. Just a story about a person growing up and coming to terms with an eccentric family.
beerandjesus
(1,301 posts)yardwork
(61,712 posts)Rhythm
(5,435 posts)...a talented storyteller as well as an illustrator.
I read this in my Modern Literature class at WVU a few years back.
Weirdly (because i was such a fan of her ~actual~ comic strips in the '80s/'90s), i didn't know that Fun Home existed until i saw it on the book list!
cali
(114,904 posts)And it has fuck all to do with political correctness.
niyad
(113,582 posts)haele
(12,681 posts)Along with "Persepolis". But I wouldn't expect a 10-year old to enjoy or understand either.
Look I consider Ayn Rand trash, but we still had to read "The Fountainhead". Holder Caulfield in "Catcher in the Rye" was a whiner, and don't get me started on Faulkner. Pilgrim's Progress or Milton? Arrgh!
I think I understand where you're coming from, but I beg to differ. I come from a classical education background; open mindedness in a college class is not two way issue; the instructor intentionally assigns reading assignments that are challenging for a reason.
The student is there to learn how to defend their position in class when they come across a topic or assignment they don't like, not to have their personal opinions and comfort zone re-enforced.
Earlier this year, my ethics instructor actually marked critiques and argument discussion papers down if the student(s) seemed to be using the same logical arguments for every situation.
It didn't matter if she agreed with your position or not, she wanted to see that you understood the situation laid out by either the facts in hand or the author of the argument, and that you were able to address what was presented to you rather than what you believed was the right answer.
College is not supposed to enforce "black and white" thinking, it's supposed to get a student to think outside their experience and understand where the root causes of different situations, whether or not they personally agree with a situation or experience.
It's not a matter of political correctness or "touchy-feely", it's about understanding that there are other cultures. habits and ways to look at things out there in the real world, and it's best to know what you are actually dealing with other than trying to script other people's lives to match your own reality.
To live in your own head and not see other people is not only selfish, it's dangerously limiting.
Haele
Codeine
(25,586 posts)but something that incorporates all those art forms at once can't in itself be art?
malaise
(269,187 posts)let them go to Falwell's fake university and the other quack colleges.
Not one fugging student is telling me what goes on a course outline or reading list.
Fuck them!!
Nuclear Unicorn
(19,497 posts)I'm sure if the script were flipped you would be demanding tolerance.
KittyWampus
(55,894 posts)of a work. If they haven't read the book, they don't know what it says.
It'd be one thing, as a poster above said, if they read to a certain point and then found it objectionable and used that as their basis for a review.
Nuclear Unicorn
(19,497 posts)Whenever speakers or material is deemed offensive to some the speakers are disinvited or shouted-down or the students are given "safe spaces" to tend to their outraged sensibilities. When these stories were playing out I said it was a bad idea, that it set a bad precedent. I was castigated every time.
These students are simply not participating while the rest of the class carries on and those who demanded others be shut down are upset that some are not participating. It's strikes me as amazingly hypocritical and a little on the fascistic side.
HFRN
(1,469 posts)because that, can't be tolerated
Nuclear Unicorn
(19,497 posts)Blue_Adept
(6,402 posts)Same thing here.
tkmorris
(11,138 posts)They are free to critique the hell out of the book. They can rip the bloody thing to shreds if they desire, but what they CANNOT do is refuse to complete coursework the school has assigned and expect to remain in the class.
Nuclear Unicorn
(19,497 posts)Can they? Or maybe they'll be hauled in front of student government for hate speech. I know it's only a matter of time before someone in this thread accuses me of being a hate-monger/homophobe. There may even be an alert in the offing.
As to my defense of the practice of non-participation, please see Post #20.
Generic Other
(28,979 posts)They haven't even arrived on campus yet. I say rescind their offer of admission, refund their tuition, and move down the list. They can re-apply when they are college ready. Or not.
Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)as a part of orientation. I'm glad they have the guts to say no. Students are just being taught to be doormats nowadays.
no_hypocrisy
(46,202 posts)This reading exercise may introduce critical thinking skills to them.
KittyWampus
(55,894 posts)My guess is the Christian Fundies have never been taught independent or critical thinking.
no_hypocrisy
(46,202 posts)My professor kept me after class, played my composition, and criticized me for both not taking responsibility for my work and denying her a teaching opportunity. Turns out I was the only one in the class who produced the work exactly to her specifications.
Critical thinking means accepting flaws in one's logic as well as learning from one's success.
KittyWampus
(55,894 posts)at some card games. I learned by playing with good players and losing a lot and observing how I was beaten.
In Tai Chi, when you come to 'sparring' in push-hands with a partner, you have to learn to allow yourself to be uprooted and pushed over without getting upset.
In cloth doll making, I used to teach how to needle sculpt faces. Many were afraid to do that cause they'd sew one head and freaked out cause they wanted their first one to be 'perfect'. So my advice was to sew and stuff at least three and use the first one as a "victim" to get the feel of it and experiment. Almost always, that gave people a sense of freedom and fun and their first attempt was usually pretty darned good.
Sorry for the long-winded reply. Just musings on a Monday.
It's okay to make mistakes. Being criticized is an opportunity to self-reflect and either modify or solidify.
progressoid
(49,999 posts)likesmountains 52
(4,098 posts)DetlefK
(16,423 posts)pipoman
(16,038 posts)And seeing the threads about "micro aggressions" treated as if that ridiculous shit is brilliant, warranted, and justified....
We are in an era which could result in the end of liberal education environments. Limitations on speech and justified refusal to do what is required based on feelings is a slippery slope.
riversedge
(70,310 posts)for America. The slippery slop gets slippy-er day by day
TexasProgresive
(12,159 posts)In my day the professor would've said, "OK, you have choices. 1st do the work assigned, 2nd don't do it and get a zero for that work and 3rd see if you have time to drop this course since you are unable to do your assignments. Use the door you entered in by and do it quietly."
a la izquierda
(11,797 posts)If a student objected to reading it (I also assigned it for a different class last semester), that's their problem. Not mine. Don't read or do the work? Get a zero.
I care not.
TexasProgresive
(12,159 posts)a la derecha. I am glad that you are a strong teacher.
a la izquierda
(11,797 posts)I don't have time for students who get offended because something challenges their beliefs. I don't get offended when students challenge MY beliefs (and it happens every semester).
Either grow up or don't go to college if the intent is to never leave one's comfort zone.
Rhythm
(5,435 posts)Hekate
(90,829 posts)Currently I'm reading 3 memoirs of women who served in WWI -- two nurses and one F.A.N.Y. I downloaded them for free from Project Gutenberg, but at least one has a subsequent edition for sale on Amazon.
I want to audit your class, please!
a la izquierda
(11,797 posts)The original author was Catalina de Erauso, but I can't remember who translated it offhand. It's great!
I teach mostly race and gender in Latin America (I specialize in indigenous populations), but this semester, my students will read this in a survey of Latin America.
alarimer
(16,245 posts)I've always found this argument baffling. "I can't read this because of my Christian beliefs." This makes no sense to me at all. What are they afraid of? That they read (or watch, or hear) something that might change their mind about their beliefs? How fragile is their belief system if that is the case?
We all know that critical thinking puts the lie to religion. Once you start to think for yourself, you see what a bunch of bullshit religion really is. I suspect THIS is what they are afraid of, why their preachers and parents have enforced this on them. They are not allowed to see anything that might challenge their beliefs, because they know it will fall apart. It's the only way religions keep the majority of their adherents, but outlawing those things that challenge them. The Catholic Church was opposed to the printing press and printing bibles because of this.
ladyVet
(1,587 posts)They believe that if they are exposed to sin, then they will fall, and go to Hell. They can't trust anything that isn't in the bible, because Satan is always tempting them.
It's a fucked up way to live, but there you are.
I hope Duke stands fast and delivers a firm message: do the work, don't do the work and fail the class, or drop the class. The more we kowtow to these people, the worse this country gets.
yardwork
(61,712 posts)No grades, not part of a class assignment, totally voluntary. The students who code not to read the book were treated respectfully, according to the article in the student paper, The Chronicle.
fbc
(1,668 posts)underpants
(182,904 posts)F^<< DUKE
CanonRay
(14,119 posts)Maybe they can transfer?
SheilaT
(23,156 posts)want to read. But I'm not a college student, and when I was, I did the assignments.
In addition, I am not fond of graphic novels myself. I grew up reading comic books, as well as regular print books, and the times I've dived into a graphic novel, I try to read it as if it were a comic book, and you just can't. They tend to have a density of words, pictures, and ideas that force the reader to slow down, and read carefully. I just can't break my comic-book reading mode, and I'll admit I haven't really tried. The problem is me, not the literary form.
But I do wonder why schools keep on assigning books that are almost bound to create an uproar. I gather this was required of all incoming Freshman, not just those in a particular lit class. But this kids were all accepted into a good secular school, so they should get over themselves and read the book.
TexasBushwhacker
(20,219 posts)Maybe they assigned it because it's contemporary and thought provoking. Isn't it funny that they could probably assign books that included rape, torture and murder and no one would bat an eye.
LittleGirl
(8,291 posts)I had to read parts of the bible for my christian university religion studies (as an atheist) and it didn't change my world view, it deepened my atheism. Idiots, all of them.
TlalocW
(15,392 posts)And we were part of a program called the Honors College - students that got various scholarships and had to take slightly more advanced non-major classes. The book was, "Siddhartha," by Hermann Hesse. Two ladies objected to it because the various religious ideas in it weren't Christian.
As for me, I had started picking up and reading a different newspaper unavailable to me in my hometown, and it had a slightly different comics section so reading that at the same time as Siddhartha made me notice the similarities in terms of blissfulness and following your own path between the main character of the book and Zippy the Pinhead.
TlalocW
Botany
(70,589 posts)Gee, if you don't read the material then you fail the class end of story.
Years ago @ Ohio U aka Harvard on the Hocking if you took a freshman
english / comp class you had to read "The Metamorphosis," by Kafka which
I didn't like but I would not have dreamed of telling the instructor that I
wouldn't read the book.
EL34x4
(2,003 posts)...in a class that you have the option of not enrolling in.
It was assigned to all incoming Freshman.
yardwork
(61,712 posts)It's just kind of silly to do so. Kind of goes against the whole idea of going to college.
Botany
(70,589 posts).... to read.
Bluenorthwest
(45,319 posts)retrowire
(10,345 posts)they merely refuse to read it, which is their right.
they aren't calling for it to be removed or censored.
personally I think that's close minded of them but it is their right. refusing to read the book infringes on no one else's rights so I see nothing wrong with this.
in the end this thread is calling them out for public mockery which is wrong of anyone to do. let them believe and live as they please.
tabasco
(22,974 posts)You seem to suffer the same faux persecution as many Christians these days.
retrowire
(10,345 posts)give legitimate reasons.
tabasco
(22,974 posts)and then refuse to do so because of their religion/superstitions.
In the development of an open, democratic society, religion has always posed a threat to free expression and free thinking. It's a fundamental conflict present in much of our history. In this day and age, we see the pressure of religion in our education system, most evident in the denial of the science of evolution. Religion has posed a threat to free thinking for centuries. Perhaps read a history book sometime.
[font size=6]HOPE IT HELPS![/font]
retrowire
(10,345 posts)calm down.
everything you just said, I know. so I'm sorry you wasted your time thinking you've just enlightened someone today.
that said, in my democracy, in my country, all are permitted their pursuit of happiness so long as it doesn't infringe on others pursuits.
these Christians aren't infringing on anyone else's right to read the book. leave them be.
tabasco
(22,974 posts)Here, I made it easier to read for you:
[font size=4]Some freshmen students at Duke University are protesting the assignment of Fun Home, claiming reading it would violate their Christian beliefs.[/font]
They are protesting that the book was on the list. They want the university to "disappear" the book. They are crying about it on Facebook and in letters to newspapers. So, yes the innocent little darlings are infringing on others' right to a well-rounded education.
Now, more right-wing crazies are getting involved.
However, a conservative think tank argues the graphic novel has content too graphic for college freshmen.
...
South Carolina lawmakers threatened to cut funding at the College of Charleston two years ago when the book was put on a summer reading list.
Duke, a private university, issued the following statement about the book selection: "We do understand that the novel may make some readers uncomfortable. It may create arguments and conversations, which are important to a liberal arts education.
http://www.wral.com/controversial-summer-reading-assignment-raises-concerns-at-duke/14713290/
Good on Duke for standing up to these intolerant Puritan wannabes.
Psephos
(8,032 posts)When exactly did protesting become an infringement of *others'* rights?
We each have a right to protest and voice our beliefs. Meanwhile, others have the right to act or not act upon those expressions.
bvf
(6,604 posts)The idiots in question just happen to be christian.
yardwork
(61,712 posts)They are college students. They are supposed to be stretching their minds and becoming exposed to new ideas that cause them to question their beliefs.
The fact that students at a highly selective university are using religion as an excuse not to do their homework is deserving of ridicule.
Orrex
(63,225 posts)Last edited Mon Aug 24, 2015, 11:32 AM - Edit history (2)
You're correct in that they're free to refuse to read it, but if it's required for the course then they need to accept the penalty for refusing to do the work. Let's wait for the end of the semester when they sue Duke because they got a failing grade after failed to complete the required reading.
retrowire
(10,345 posts)geek tragedy
(68,868 posts)while refusing to do the required reading
retrowire
(10,345 posts)LittleBlue
(10,362 posts)Many universities have optional summer reading, which has no influence on their grades.
As incoming freshmen, none have even attended a single class.
tabasco
(22,974 posts)If it's too late to withdrawal from the class, tough shit. Fail the assignment.
Geronimoe
(1,539 posts)I would just give them an "F" for refusing to learn.
They can not learn if they already have a belief system that cannot be challenged.
I on the other hand do not believe in Christianity but have no problem reading the Bible.
packman
(16,296 posts)with all its "Christian" values - murder, sodomy, incest, mass murdering of children, vengeance, etc,, etc.
Jerry442
(1,265 posts)14 And Moses was wroth with the officers of the host, with the captains over thousands, and captains over hundreds, which came from the battle.
15 And Moses said unto them, Have ye saved all the women alive?
16 Behold, these caused the children of Israel, through the counsel of Balaam, to commit trespass against the LORD in the matter of Peor, and there was a plague among the congregation of the LORD.
17 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.
18 But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.
Orrex
(63,225 posts)Generic Other
(28,979 posts)That left a stain. My childhood Bible has only these kind of passages marked out. Can you cite chapter and verse so I can go underline it?
Jerry442
(1,265 posts)Teamster Jeff
(1,598 posts)Nuclear Unicorn
(19,497 posts)mountain grammy
(26,655 posts)Baitball Blogger
(46,758 posts)of racial tension occurred when the newspaper suggested that our churches could help alleviate the misunderstandings.
Really? Have you looked into the belief system of some of these churches? In some of them, blind obedience to autocratic leaders is imperative. Personally, I think blind obedience to autocratic leaders IS the problem.
Initech
(100,104 posts)Then why are they there?
xocet
(3,873 posts)xocet
(3,873 posts)Here is a piece from Democracy Now! that describes the associated musical:
Alison Bechdels "Fun Home": The Coming-Out Memoir That Became a Hit Broadway Musical
In a Democracy Now! special, we look at the acclaimed Broadway musical "Fun Home," which swept the Tony Awards last month. Composer Jeanine Tesori and lyricist Lisa Kron made history as the first female duo to win a Tony Award for Best Original Score. "Fun Home" is also the first-ever Broadway musical to feature a lesbian protagonist. The musical is based on the 2006 best-selling graphic memoir by Alison Bechdel, "Fun Home: A Family Tragicomic." The memoir is a poignant exploration of family, memory, first love, coming out and a daughters relationship with her father. The title comes from the Bechdels nickname for their family business: a funeral parlor. Throughout the memoir, Bechdel the artist and protagonist sketches out her hazy memories of growing up in rural Pennsylvania and coming to terms with her sexuality as she tries to make sense of her fathers suicide. Her father was secretly gay and took his life shortly after Bechdel came out as a lesbian. We speak to Bechdel, Kron and Tesori, and air highlights from the Broadway musical.
...
http://www.democracynow.org/2015/7/30/alison_bechdels_fun_home_the_coming
Mike Nelson
(9,968 posts)...is looking at different ideas, and debating. You don't have to like or agree with everything! Give these kids an "F".
liberal N proud
(60,346 posts)3catwoman3
(24,054 posts)I have thought, for years, that many of those who proclaim so loudly the alleged strength of their faith are actually quite afraid that it is just the opposite. Should not a truly strong belief system serve as a bulwark, a protection, an immunization against challenges to said belief system. That is exactly what medical immunizations do - they do not promise you will not be exposed to dangerous illnesses, but rather, that you will be strong enough not to be struck down by them should exposure occur.
A belief system so easily assailed seems fragile indeed.
BlueIdaho
(13,582 posts)Attach reading lists to their syllabi. It is the student's responsibility to decide if they will accept the "social contract" a syllabus represents. If they choose not to do an assignment for any reason - they will suffer the natural consequences of their action - or inaction.
More disturbing is the irrational overheated persecution complex of modern christians. Their beliefs in a magical super-being do not elevate them to any special status. They are no different from a student that got drunk and was too hungover to do their work.
No work, no score, no score, no grade.
rurallib
(62,451 posts)filled with sex and violence and lots of myths passed off as true.
NYC Liberal
(20,136 posts)I wish I could've done this in school. I would've barely had to read anything!
Hiraeth
(4,805 posts)of a lot of intelligent/cogent conversations in their adulthood. Of course, they probably won't miss it as they will spend a huge portion of their time with like minded people at the church of their choice.
Just give them the -F- that they deserve for this portion of their grade for that class and move on.
Please, stop making stupid people famous.
niyad
(113,582 posts)is probably operating under very old assumptions that people who attend universities are there to LEARN, to THINK, to develop critical thinking skills. silly them.
why don't you and your like-minded brethren go to liberty, or oral roberts, or any of the other "christian" institutions, whose sole function seems to be turning out little, unthinking, brainwashed idiots.
by the way, you could always drop out of the class, take your incomplete, whatever. whahhhhhhhhhh,
professors, give these intellectual cretins the fails they deserve.
Cirque du So-What
(25,988 posts)if it can't take the heat from a smattering of literature. Don't like it? Go to a religious school!
dakota_democrat
(374 posts)This section intentionally left blank.
niyad
(113,582 posts)Martin Cunningham commented 37 mins ago
Three notes:
I) a faith that has never been tested is no faith at all. (I think this view is attributable to St Augustine)
2) If you dont want your religious views challenged, dont go to a secular college. There are plenty of religious schools who will be willing to reinforce your own personal dogmas.
3) Dont take their word for it. When people say they have an objection to course content on religious grounds make them write a five thousand word paper which summarizes their views, the content of the course, and shows how their views
A) conflict with the course content
and
B) why anyone should care
Cant stand the intellectual heat? Then stay out of the academic kitchen.
valerief
(53,235 posts)Feeling the Bern
(3,839 posts)invalidating all attempts to end these things: "It Violates My Religious Beliefs."
seaotter
(576 posts)Let them take a fail. And have LOTS of questions about the book on a final exam.
July
(4,751 posts)reading/critiquing a text assigned by university professors and actively seeking out what they consider porn for the sinful purpose of getting their jollies.
AngryAmish
(25,704 posts)I think many people support reading diverse materials in college. It is intellectually stultifying not to.
However, recently on college campuses there seems to be an uptick in srudents saying they feel threatened by works that contain racism, sexism and the usual litany of isms. Also, trying to no platform some points of views, MRAs for example.
So, I bet, these kids got together and said a work offended them and made them feel less safe due to the subject matter described.
The only way for Duke to win this is to reaffirm that their students must confront difficult ideas, that they are not children and, basically, shut up and learn.
The challenge then is the next time a campus member protests a right wing or christian speaker. Will Duke keep up their own rule about unwelcome ideas being necessary in college?
This is a work. Let's see who is smart enough to not fall in the trap.
melm00se
(4,996 posts)seems to stir up controversy if not every year than every couple of years.
hifiguy
(33,688 posts)And expulsions wouldn't be off the table.
Fuck the fundys with a rusty pitchfork. Plenty of other kids would love the opportunity to go to such a great school.
Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)Might as well assign a porn flick.
Hey, if you believe in diversity AT ALL, you should allow religious people to live their own way. Or maybe people who just object to explicit sexuality, which some do.
Humanist_Activist
(7,670 posts)in school due to their religious beliefs, they should not be given a pass because of it.
What's next? Creationists being able to refuse taking tests or reading materials on evolution in biology class?
They should also learn, early on, they they are not special little snowflakes who get to do what they want without consequences.
Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)It's a sort of community orientation thing.
Humanist_Activist
(7,670 posts)different types of people have different worldviews. If a graphic novel is simply too much of an offense for them to even read it, then perhaps they don't belong in a pluralistic college or society.
Solly Mack
(90,787 posts)matt819
(10,749 posts)then, I'm sorry folks, but those religious beliefs aren't very strong.
What a bunch of cowards.
America - plunging headlong into the 17th century.
KamaAina
(78,249 posts)Vinca
(50,310 posts)Yo_Mama
(8,303 posts)Good for them!
Look, when you go to college you shouldn't be forced to eat meat if you don't want to, drink alcohol if you don't want to, or eat a strict vegan diet if you don't want to, and especially not under a global mandate given to the entire incoming freshman class.
You shouldn't be forced to go to chapel, and you shouldn't be forced to watch porn flicks or read sexually explicit novels, unless they are in coursework WHICH YOU HAVE CHOSEN.
I would say that the discussion of why some few students don't want to read it would be just as mind-opening for the incoming frosh as anything else.
Liberal_in_LA
(44,397 posts)Hekate
(90,829 posts)What foolish children.
College coursework is where one hopefully learns critical reasoning skills. A religiously-inclined student can hone those skills and emerge stronger in his or her faith. Or not. But all students need to learn how to think -- and the university or college should never back down.
Refusal to do the work = F for the course.
okasha
(11,573 posts)hunter
(38,328 posts)The gods of the grifters are not so sturdy.
mike_c
(36,281 posts)moobu2
(4,822 posts)They shouldn't be given special treatment.
Jamastiene
(38,187 posts)Is that what they think?
David__77
(23,520 posts)And while I'm not sure, I think she was excused from that assignment. Her and I - we did not get along.
Flying Squirrel
(3,041 posts)Which violated my atheist beliefs. I didn't like it, but I completed the assignment.
Life's a bitch, suck it up.
LittleBlue
(10,362 posts)Don't like it, don't read it.
B Calm
(28,762 posts)WinkyDink
(51,311 posts)There seems to be hypocrisy enough to go around, n'est-ce pas ?
yardwork
(61,712 posts)bluestateguy
(44,173 posts)It's not required. Just don't read it. No need to be a drama queen about it.