Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member Latest Breaking News General Discussion The DU Lounge All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search
 

KamaAina

(78,249 posts)
Fri Sep 11, 2015, 04:05 PM Sep 2015

A Nation of Sociopaths? What the Trump Phenomenon Says About America

http://prospect.org/article/nation-sociopaths-what-trump-phenomenon-says-about-america

Beyond the question, though, of whether Trump is good for Democrats lies the question of whether his candidacy is good for America. Some have implied that the response to Trump on the stump—the smoking out of nativists, racists, and misogynists, bringing them to the surface—is indeed a good thing, because it reveals, in no uncertain terms, to whom the Republican Party most appeals. Heck, even avowed white supremacists—not a constituency prone to endorsing candidates of either major party—are professing their love for The Donald.

If I had faith that America would look at those smoked-out varmints in horror, and resolve as a nation to ostracize all who professed such views—and, better yet, enact policies to rectify the vestiges of past oppression and discrimination in our present society—I might be able to buy the “Trump is good for America” argument. But, alas, I am not familiar with an America whose people, as a whole, are willing to do that.

Instead, what Trump is doing, via the media circus of which he has appointed himself ringmaster, is making the articulation of the basest bigotry acceptable in mainstream outlets, amplifying the many oppressive tropes and stereotypes of race and gender that already exist in more than adequate abundance.

For all the ink I’ve just spilled on these two questions, neither is the most important one that should be asked about the Trump candidacy. That would be this one: What is wrong with America that this racist, misogynist, money-cheating clown should be the frontrunner for the presidential nomination of one of its two major parties?
22 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
A Nation of Sociopaths? What the Trump Phenomenon Says About America (Original Post) KamaAina Sep 2015 OP
I think it's more complicated. People are sick of being handed prepackaged "retail" candidates by Warren DeMontague Sep 2015 #1
trump is always backing away from his statements... lame54 Sep 2015 #9
Here's one... wcmagumba Sep 2015 #2
I think that the biggest thing Trump has going against him is not the American people acting out world wide wally Sep 2015 #3
+1. He's Palin again and it is too early treestar Sep 2015 #4
It reminds me of when Norman Lear thought Americans would recoil from Archie Bunker, Arugula Latte Sep 2015 #5
Unintended Consequences Octafish Sep 2015 #10
It's not America per se maxsolomon Sep 2015 #6
So true. libdem4life Sep 2015 #7
Yes, unfortunarely. smirkymonkey Sep 2015 #8
+1 hifiguy Sep 2015 #12
NO, not "humans," many conservative humans, but not even all of them. Hortensis Sep 2015 #13
conservatives are humans - last time i checked maxsolomon Sep 2015 #14
Max, the vast majority of human-caused misery comes from a personality Hortensis Sep 2015 #15
Looks like a neat book Nevernose Sep 2015 #18
How this subject can be fun to read is amazing, but it is that, Never. Hortensis Sep 2015 #21
One of the most interesting things about Authoritarian Followers, as described in that book... Marr Sep 2015 #19
Yes, and for sure environment has a great effect. Disagree that we all Hortensis Sep 2015 #20
Something in our lower brain (jr. high school level) Ron Green Sep 2015 #11
I don't think people get it Skittles Sep 2015 #16
Social engineering a la oligarch at its finest... Dont call me Shirley Sep 2015 #17
Shamefully embarrassing to be American that this fuck is front runner of Grand Ol Party of Pervs. lonestarnot Sep 2015 #22

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
1. I think it's more complicated. People are sick of being handed prepackaged "retail" candidates by
Fri Sep 11, 2015, 04:12 PM
Sep 2015

Party elites who stick closely to safe-sounding, poll tested soundbites and chunks of meaningless pablum.

Trump taps into the zetigeist of people who are tired of this. He says something and the beltway gatekeepers go "but but butbutbut you cant say that!" ....And instead of going on a 3 week apology tour, he turns around and goes "heyyyyy... fuck you" and says something even more egregious.

It's extremely entertaining to people tired of business as usual, and until he says something that actually does alienate a large portion of his base, or otherwise implodes (both very real possibilities, mind you) a good chunk of the voting public will eat it up.

world wide wally

(21,744 posts)
3. I think that the biggest thing Trump has going against him is not the American people acting out
Fri Sep 11, 2015, 04:27 PM
Sep 2015

of a sense of common decency and justice, but just like Americabn Idol, they will simply become fatigued with his constant coverage and spiteful intensity. I can't imagine how people could tolerate this windbag every day for four plus years, and soon they will realize that.

treestar

(82,383 posts)
4. +1. He's Palin again and it is too early
Fri Sep 11, 2015, 04:29 PM
Sep 2015

to worry about his actually getting into the real meat of the campaign. He'll probably quit when it gets real.

 

Arugula Latte

(50,566 posts)
5. It reminds me of when Norman Lear thought Americans would recoil from Archie Bunker,
Fri Sep 11, 2015, 04:33 PM
Sep 2015

but of course a huge number loved everything he had to say.

Octafish

(55,745 posts)
10. Unintended Consequences
Sat Sep 12, 2015, 10:33 AM
Sep 2015

All in the Family made it OK to feel "that way." Then came Reagan and it was OK to be out in the open about it.



Until Obama, it felt like "official policy," killing in the name of freedem and demockrussee.

maxsolomon

(33,345 posts)
6. It's not America per se
Fri Sep 11, 2015, 05:03 PM
Sep 2015

HUMANS have a predilection for Fascism. It provides simple answers to complex questions, and absolves people of collective guilt.

Remember, Berlusconi was elected more than once. We're dumb as fuck, but we're not alone.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
13. NO, not "humans," many conservative humans, but not even all of them.
Sat Sep 12, 2015, 01:09 PM
Sep 2015

Although fascism can take so-called left- or right-wing governing forms, social scientists say fascism is a conservative phenomenon. A hard-right conservative phenomenon.

Looking at it in action, Mussolini dissolved Italy's representative government and replaced it with a board of business executives. He also suppressed groups that Italy's social conservatives who supported him wanted didn't like. Persecution of selected minority groups is a characteristic of every fascist government studied.

As for liberals, Benito Mussolini once explained that they were incompatible with fascism because liberalism is the individual, fascism is the state. (Probably paraphrased slightly).

Although our right wingers do try to project fascism as liberal (it is seen as a bad word, even if most don't know what it means), one guess whose leaders are jailed and executed as necessary during the establishment of fascist governments.

Why is Scott Walker popping into my head as I write...?

maxsolomon

(33,345 posts)
14. conservatives are humans - last time i checked
Tue Sep 15, 2015, 04:08 PM
Sep 2015

when I said fascism was a human phenomenon, did I say EVERY human?

you're quibbling.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
15. Max, the vast majority of human-caused misery comes from a personality
Tue Sep 15, 2015, 06:13 PM
Sep 2015

subtype that has now been IDENTIFIED and studied for the first time in history. This is HUGE! And continually fascinating for those who have studied it in college or read about it and observe this election with open eyes.

These people are not sociopaths. They're normal, but just of a type that is capable of doing terrible things to their fellow man under the wrong leadership. They are the people who chose Hitler in Germany and then unquestioningly followed all orders from their chosen leader.

BUT they are a minority (mercifully!) and could never have elected him if millions of their fellow citizens who mistakenly also voted for him knew then what we know now.

http://members.shaw.ca/jeanaltemeyer/drbob/TheAuthoritarians.pdf

BTW, because they are not sociopaths, authoritarians are capable of learning and reining in their behavior, just like anyone else, and of recognizing attempts by would-be leaders to inflame and harness their tendency to hostility and aggression toward others.

Nevernose

(13,081 posts)
18. Looks like a neat book
Tue Sep 15, 2015, 08:44 PM
Sep 2015

I don't know what the person you were talking to originally will do, but I, for one, will read it.

 

Marr

(20,317 posts)
19. One of the most interesting things about Authoritarian Followers, as described in that book...
Tue Sep 15, 2015, 08:57 PM
Sep 2015

...is that they're not so much born as they are made. People who are raised to be scared of things tend to become more authoritarian. When those same people are put in contact with people they've been told to despise, their authoritarian personalities tend to fade along with their fear.

I think we all fall somewhere on that authoritarian spectrum, and our position on it isn't fixed at all.

Hortensis

(58,785 posts)
20. Yes, and for sure environment has a great effect. Disagree that we all
Wed Sep 16, 2015, 04:43 AM
Sep 2015

are authoritarian to some degree. A majority can move more that way somewhat under the wrong circumstances, but even in the worst situations there will always be large blocks who are shocked and horrified at what they see happening.

One key feature of authoritarians is that -- once they have chosen a leader for themselves whom they want to follow -- they not only turn their decision-making responsibilities over to that leader, but they effectively also turn their consciences over to that leader. Good followers are very loyal and steadfast. They've decided they and their leader are on the side of right, and they don't make trouble for the cause by questioning orders.

There really are tremendous differences between the kind who dutifully reported Jews to authorities in Germany -- because obeying authorities is what good citizens do -- and the kind who, at very least, did not.

Ron Green

(9,822 posts)
11. Something in our lower brain (jr. high school level)
Sat Sep 12, 2015, 10:51 AM
Sep 2015

likes to identify and call out "losers."

Trump does this for us, and those operating in that jr. high brain respond.

Skittles

(153,164 posts)
16. I don't think people get it
Tue Sep 15, 2015, 08:33 PM
Sep 2015

Trump has the ability to get the entire stupid / racist / homophobic / sexist / xenophobic / reality-TV loving vote and that is a LOT of people

it is NOT good for Democrats

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»A Nation of Sociopaths? W...