Are there any sites out there now that do this? It seems like it would be a huge job. Although maybe it could be done on a state-by-state level and then the data collated?

http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/

They do annual reports on prisoner numbers, among many other things.

State prisoners numbers have actually started to decline slightly after about 30 years of increases, due largely to the fact the states can't afford their prison budgets, but the federal prisoner numbers continue to climb, driven largely by drug offenders and immigration offenders. The latter were only criminalized under Obama.

Step 1: Decriminalize drugs.

Step 2: Go to Step 1.

Only out and out legalization with regulation, just like alcohol and tobacco, is going to end the illegal distribution chain for "drugs".

Decriminalizing does nothing to end the black market and the black market is where the majority of our problems come from.

My bad?

Consider that alcohol was "decriminalized" during alcohol Prohibition, it wasn't illegal to possess or consume alcohol, only to manufacture, import or sell it.

And yet Prohibition gave us Al Capone, the St Valentine's day massacre and organized crime, all in a milieu where alcohol was not illegal to possess or consume.

I'll stand by my post. Thanks for your response, but I think I made my meaning clear, as have others in this thread.

It's both easier to say and easier to write "legalize" as well as being less confusing than "decriminalize"..

Unless there is a retail infrastructure to buy "drugs" legally for the average person then they are still not "legalized" even if penalties for possession of small amounts have been "decriminalized".

If you read around you'll find that "decriminalization" almost never includes actual legalization and regulation of retail sales, the two words don't mean the same thing.

But, IMHO, it really is a silly rhetoric argument. As I wrote, others are using the same rhetoric.

Churchill once said, This is the type of arrant pedantry up with which I shall not put.

Well, I don't mind. It just seems to be a waste of bandwidth when we're on the same side of the issue.

Thanks. I'm done here.

would go a long way toward it.

look at what other countries (with lower crime rates) are doing.

Maybe more money for working non-violent criminals back in to the economy (like jobs training) and allowing people to expunge their records for certain crimes (so they can get an actual job).

Prison is a great way to remove dangerous people from society.

For turning basically ok people with some flaw in to productive citizens. . . well not so good.

States can't incarcerate more people than they and their hired jailers have capacity for.

This will require pushback against powerful lobbies, such as prison guard unions, whose contracts in many states pay them much more than schoolteachers, and privatizing companies such as Corrections Corporation of America.

But Republican-induced declining state budgets now provide rare opportunities for reformers. They need to publicize billions of dollars in correctional waste while hundreds of thousands of scoolteachers are being laid off, and they need to put caps on correctional budgets on referendum ballots.

As long as states have the money, they can ship prisoners to Texas and other states that have privately run prisons. The states then pay the private prisons to house and care for the prisons. The question of capacity goes away... and it comes down to money.

I think you're right. Lobbying. But I also think that it has to be very specific/solution oriented. A lot of people (hmm... maybe not!) know that it costs over $20,000 to house a prisoner, and that its paid for by taxpayers. But they are not able to let go of the sense of "get those people off the streets - they are Bad." I don't want to change the laws on the books, just the sentencing policies.

When I said "hired jailers: I meant to include other states as well as prison guard unions and CCA and company.

The key is cutting the money for incarceration of any kind, IMO.

Just have to figure out how to make the people angry enough to change the laws.

Once we recognize that we are trapped in a system that offers nothing but the illusion of choice, we can set about changing it. Until then, Tweedle-Dee and Tweedle-Dum will remain our 'alternatives'.

for starters.

Legalize weed.