General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsIs Hawai‘i an Occupied State?
"As the campaign for full independence gains momentum, a new view of Hawaiian history is taking hold.
Over the summer, the US Department of the Interior held a series of hearings inviting Native Hawaiians to comment on the formation of a federally recognized nation. The hearings confirmed what many Hawaiians already knew: opposing camps have formed in the debate over Hawaiian sovereignty. One side views federal recognition as a pragmatic alternative to the status quo. The other side, at first thought to be a marginal segment of the movement, seeks the full independence that Hawaii had in the nineteenth century. Surprisingly, after decades in which the federal recognition advocates represented the mainstream, the voices for full independence seized the spotlight. The overwhelming response at the hearings to the question of federal recognition was aole: no.
...
Mainstream media coverage was misleading too. By focusing on the tone rather than the content of the comments at the hearings, commentators missed the real story, which was that a major shift in Hawaiian political will had occurred. In a community known for its divisiveness, the emergence of the independence movement as a viable force is quite stunning. Under the radar, a new view of Hawaiian history is taking hold."
https://www.thenation.com/article/hawaii-occupied-state/
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Many people just don't know that Hawaii was annexed by the US only back in 1898 -- that's pretty damn recent.
yeoman6987
(14,449 posts)If Hawaii wants to leave I don't think we should stop them when we have a state waiting for the chance.
AngryAmish
(25,704 posts)Lincoln set a precedent, secession wise. Puerto Rico needs to have the cruel heel of American oppression lifted.
NobodyHere
(2,810 posts)They're not to agree to get out.
Art_from_Ark
(27,247 posts)if the federal government doesn't help them out with their $72 billion debt?
NobodyHere
(2,810 posts)Art_from_Ark
(27,247 posts)But I imagine that one of the reasons they vote to stay tied to the US is the implied understanding that Uncle Sam will help them out when they need help.
NobodyHere
(2,810 posts)The basis for my original comment was the 2012 referendum on statehood
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puerto_Rican_status_referendum,_2012
Art_from_Ark
(27,247 posts)but that was before this debt problem came out to the forefront and some American politicians began telling them they're just going to have to suck it up.
LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)Minnesota, too seems to love the cruel heel of American oppression.
Six of one half a dozen of the other...
frazzled
(18,402 posts)the people of Hawaii (in opposition to the land and plantation owners) did desire statehood:
On June 27, 1959, a referendum asked residents of Hawaii to vote on the statehood bill; 94.3% voted in favor of statehood and 5.7% opposed it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaii#Overthrow_of_1893.E2.80.94the_Republic_of_Hawaii_.281894.E2.80.931898.29
We can't deny the expansionist history of the US, much of which disenfranchised many groups, from Native Americans everywhere to territories like California and Louisiana. When we consider the secession movement in Texas or the separatist movement in Quebec, I think Hawaii will and should remain a state. It would be quite a precedent to allow it to secede.
newfie11
(8,159 posts)Then who next?
Bucky
(54,013 posts)uawchild
(2,208 posts)when you say : "On June 27, 1959, a referendum asked residents of Hawaii to vote on the statehood bill; 94.3% voted in favor of statehood and 5.7% opposed it. " did you notice that was in 1959 -- 61 years after the annexation of Hawaii in 1898?
What was the % of the native Hawaiian population in that vote, I mean there was a massive influx of people into Hawaii after 1898 from the US and several Asian nations.
"We can't deny the expansionist history of the US, much of which disenfranchised many groups, from Native Americans everywhere to territories like California and Louisiana. When we consider the secession movement in Texas or the separatist movement in Quebec, I think Hawaii will and should remain a state. It would be quite a precedent to allow it to secede." I agree with the points you made here. Thanks for discussing this issue, I love history and the twists and turns that got us all to our present world fascinate me.
frazzled
(18,402 posts)I've never even been to Hawaii (though would love to go.) If I have time over the next days, I'll try to research the topic of that referendum.
yuiyoshida
(41,831 posts)But I was born in San Francisco. My parents, like me are part Japanese and Hawaiian, and my family spent 3 generations in Hawaii after coming from Miyazaki Japan. I don't know much about my culture, and consider myself a California brat.. XD
I would love to go back there and learn more about my people...Just as I would love to visit Japan some day. I do know more about Japan than Hawaii, cause I took courses in Asian Culture at UC Berkeley. I can even speak some Japanese, but I don't know any of the language of Native Hawaiians. My grandfather does, he is native Hawaiian, and still lives there.
artislife
(9,497 posts)yuiyoshida
(41,831 posts)KamaAina
(78,249 posts)whose residents are all Native Hawaiian. It is the only Hawaiian-speaking community on Earth.
KamaAina
(78,249 posts)then as now, there were those in Congress that had no desire to admit a two-thirds Asian state, and made no bones about saying so. It actually started back in the '30s, but was derailed by the Massie case, in which a Native Hawaiian was unjustly accused of the murder of the socialite wife of a Navy officer, and later lynched. Bigots on the mainland managed to spin it as "See? Those people can't possibly govern themselves!" It was not until after WWII, in which many Americans of Japanese ancestry distinguished themselves (including future Sen. Daniel Inouye), that attitudes began to shift.
Would make a damn good movie, come to think of it.
niyad
(113,302 posts)the woman from hawai'i made precisely that point.
sorry, did not catch the names, only caught a bit of the segment, but very powerful.
Nye Bevan
(25,406 posts)Adrahil
(13,340 posts)I'm not looking to move to Europe at this point.
Bucky
(54,013 posts)Or did you mean Asia is occupied by invading homo sapiens sapiens?
KamaAina
(78,249 posts)when Europeans got here.
By contrast:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Hawaii
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Hawaii#Foreign_relations
November 28 became a national holiday to celebrate the recognition of Hawaii's independence. The Hawaiian Kingdom entered into treaties with most major nations and established over ninety legations and consulates.
KamaAina
(78,249 posts)full citizenship is offered only to Hawaiians. Figures my somewhat flaky Hawaiian friend would forget the paperwork that day (she lived on Hawai'i (Big) Island at the time, and the meeting was on O'ahu).
Ka Lahui favors a nation-within-a-nation model similar to what was being discussed in the OP.
https://kalahuihawaii.wordpress.com/faq/
Ka Lahui is a Native initiative it is something that developed from grassroots Hawaiians. It is based on a democratic constitution, created by Native Hawaiians. Citizenship is open to all Hawaiians and honorary citizenship is offered to non- Hawaiians. Only full citizens can vote and hold office. The Constitution identifies four branches of government: the Executive, the Legislative, the Judiciary and the Alii Nui. Leadership is elected by the citizens of the 33 districts statewide where Hawaiians live. Provisions for initiative, referendum and recall are included in the Constitution. Ka Lahui Hawaii is separate from the state government and controls its own internal affairs. Therefore, Ka Lahui Hawaii is not subject to state control....
2. What is Ka Lahui Hawaiis definition of sovereignty?
The five elements of sovereignty are:
A strong and abiding faith in the Akua
A people with a common culture
A land base
A government structure
An economic base.
Sovereignty is the ability of a people who share a common culture, religion, language, value system and land base, to exercise control over their lands and lives, independent of other nations. Self-sufficiency is the goal of nationhood. Self-sufficiency means the people are able to be self-supporting, capable of feeding, clothing and sheltering themselves. It means that they are the motive force for their own farming and pastoral projects.
3. What is Ka Lahui Hawaiis approach to gain sovereignty?
Ka Lahuis approach is to seek inclusion for the Hawaiian people in the existing U.S. federal policy that affords all Native Americans the right to be self-governing, and to obtain access to the federal courts for judicial review. Once this is achieved, the sovereign nation can explore with the state, federal and county governments, resolution of claims relating to the Native trusts and other entitlements. Ka Lahui believes that the nation should be created before Native entitlements are negotiated. It is the right of the sovereign entity to advance the claims of the people and to explore ways to resolve conflicts with the State and the U.S....
4. Where is Ka Lahui Hawaii going? What is the plan?
a. Recognition and Development of a Sovereign Government
The primary objective of Ka Lahui Hawaii is to secure recognition for a sovereign government for the Hawaiian people. When Queen Liliuokalani was dethroned, our sovereign government was destroyed. The only way to repair that injury is to re-establish a sovereign entity. Ka Lahui Hawaii conducted its first General Election in February 1990, which elected national officers and island district repesentatives. Enrollment of citizens and education about Ka Lahui Hawaii and Hawaiian sovereignty will continue to be a priority.
I still remember the day I sat outside a meeting site in Nanakuli, on the west side of O'ahu where haoles (Caucasians) are often afraid to go, discussing some relevant Supreme Court decisions in some detail with a large group of Hawaiians. And then eating stewed laulau (taro leaves) afterward (I stayed away from the na'au (tripe). )