General Discussion
Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsDoes speaking a second language "fluently" demand you can speak it
grammatically correct?
Melania Trump: "As you may know by now, when you attack him he will punch back 10 times harder," she said in her thick eastern European accent. "No matter who you are, a man or a woman, he treats everyone equal. He's a fighter and if you elect him to be your president he will fight for you and for our country."
http://www.cnn.com/2016/04/04/politics/melania-trump-donald-trump-wisconsin/
Her husband and his campaign emphasize her fluency in 4-5 languages. If so, someone tell Melania the referenced statements above should recognize an adverb and not substitute an adjective. (Not "he treats everyone equal". It should be "equally".)
immoderate
(20,885 posts)--imm
DawgHouse
(4,019 posts)Glassunion
(10,201 posts)hughee99
(16,113 posts)Should people speaking a second or third language be held to a higher standard?
Yes. I agree. Fo sho. Language is flexible and inventive; our errors and alterations make language evolve.
madinmaryland
(64,933 posts)hughee99
(16,113 posts)Don't get me wrong, I'm not defending the teabaggers, but there's a reason there's grammar nazis on the DU, and it's not just because teabaggers are trolling.
Complaining that Trumps wife shouldn't be considered fluent because she used an adjective instead of and adverb is like complaining about the nits but ignoring the 6000 lb elephant their on.
I'd guess it would take all of about 5 minutes to find speeches from ALL the major presidential candidates and other major leaders where they didn't manage to get their grammar quite right. It would probably take even less time to find a post where you or I made a mistake.
11 Bravo
(23,926 posts)(Nazis is plural.)
hughee99
(16,113 posts)My teachers would be sad to learn that one of their students is not fluent in their native language.
Kelvin Mace
(17,469 posts)shadowandblossom
(718 posts)expected perfect grammar. (None of them more likely...)
Kelvin Mace
(17,469 posts)Not perfect, but able to score 90% on a test.
shadowandblossom
(718 posts)This is making me think of an experience a couple of months back when I was helping a native Spanish speaker who's learning English. When he asked me if he'd written a sentence correctly, I had to explain to him that I wished more native speakers wrote so well.
shadowandblossom
(718 posts)and he is far from fluent.
840high
(17,196 posts)Albertoo
(2,016 posts)Brickbat
(19,339 posts)GOLGO 13
(1,681 posts)One who speaks 2 languages is called bilingual
One who speaks 1 language is called an American
shadowandblossom
(718 posts)there's a lot of truth to it nonetheless.
rock
(13,218 posts)Just a joke. Your construction is good (not 'well') in my book, but does show that English grammar does not pin everything down. It's loose in many places. I certainly would characterize Melania's speech as nearly fluent. How about I close with an anecdote and a comment?
Anecdote: In a Dear Abby column the writer complained that her MIL (an ex school teacher) corrected her grammar often. She asked should she tell her to go jump in a lake? To which Abby replied, "Maybe you should tell her to go jump into a lake!
Comment: There's something about Abby's advice that's odd but I can't quite put my finger onto it.
MADem
(135,425 posts)Zsa Zsa Gabor was "fluent." So was her sister, Eva (New York is where I want to stay, I get allergic smelling hay...).
This woman's ability certainly exceeds "conversational" but falls below "fluent." Now, she might be fluent in other languages, but I'd say she's just very good at this English thing.
I also think Trump told her what to say. I'd blame the "equal" on him!
shadowandblossom
(718 posts)mainer
(12,029 posts)I am not going to be petty and point out her grammatical errors. She appears to be a very accomplished woman.
840high
(17,196 posts)a lovely and intelligent woman.
Cal33
(7,018 posts)"all or nothing." If one is that strict about breaking rules, then practically no one
is fluent in any language - including his own mother tongue.
As for speaking a foreign language without an accent, it's very rare, at best, to
be able to do it when one has learned a foreign language as an adult.
linuxman
(2,337 posts)mainstreetonce
(4,178 posts)Her language usage sounds like a newly arrived immigrant.
struggle4progress
(118,338 posts)if whether the grammar of hers good or bad, since me not time wasting to be listen of her
Codeine
(25,586 posts)She speaks English with greater fluency than most native-born Americans.
lame54
(35,321 posts)I will not criticize anyone who can speak several languages - that statement is fine - her description of Trump is full of shit - but as far as the way she communicated it - it was fine
Android3.14
(5,402 posts)What an unfortunate posting.
Mosby
(16,350 posts)Was an apple slogan that in my opinion is bad English, it should be "think differently" this is really common now though, to leave off the -ly.
Lydia Leftcoast
(48,217 posts)The other dimension is accuracy, which means not making mistakes in grammar or usage. No one is 100% accurate, not even in his or her native language.