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steve2470

(37,457 posts)
Tue Apr 19, 2016, 03:56 PM Apr 2016

Religious Group Sues Over Open-Air Urinal At San Francisco’s Dolores Park

http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2016/04/19/religious-group-sues-san-francisco-over-open-air-urinal/

?w=640&h=360&crop=1

SAN FRANCISCO (CBS / AP) — A religious organization has filed a lawsuit against the city of San Francisco to remove an open-air urinal it calls unsanitary and indecent from a popular park.

The Chinese Christian Union of San Francisco filed a civil complaint last week demanding the city remove the concrete circular urinal from the iconic Dolores Park.

The group says the urinal, which is out in the open and screened only with plants for privacy, “emanates offensive odors,” ”has no hand-washing facilities” and “it’s offensive to manners and morals.”

The lawsuit further alleges that the facility installed in February discriminates against women and the disabled and exposes those who use it to “shame and embarrassment.”
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Religious Group Sues Over Open-Air Urinal At San Francisco’s Dolores Park (Original Post) steve2470 Apr 2016 OP
Who would put up an "open air" urinal? That's just weird. Vinca Apr 2016 #1
The residents of the neighborhood surrounding the park lobbied for it. Chan790 Apr 2016 #5
re: "There are restrooms...this is for the people that refuse to use them" thesquanderer Apr 2016 #50
I know, that is what the side walls and alleys by bars are for? snooper2 Apr 2016 #6
Tell me about it. We live a block from Wrigley Field. Hassin Bin Sober Apr 2016 #21
I used to drink in that neighborhood, quite a bit Warren DeMontague Apr 2016 #62
That's a urinal? Initech Apr 2016 #2
We can never be truly civilized as long as we have to piss. immoderate Apr 2016 #3
So what is the solution then? Adult diapers? Initech Apr 2016 #9
I fear there is no solution. immoderate Apr 2016 #23
I wonder - what is the purpose for the chain-link surround? Maybe for the riders, jonno99 Apr 2016 #4
It's to make you feel like you're sliding into home Orrex Apr 2016 #30
People pee all over the place in SF anyway. Quantess Apr 2016 #7
Only if you're intoxicated, beligerent and screaming threatening nonsense Sen. Walter Sobchak Apr 2016 #17
Unfortunately, Dorian Gray Apr 2016 #26
The worse place were the yuiyoshida Apr 2016 #32
Is that the one that shuts down every time it rains? Quantess Apr 2016 #34
probably...but at least the rains wash yuiyoshida Apr 2016 #45
When I was a college kid... Victor_c3 Apr 2016 #8
Before these the entire park was a urinal. hunter Apr 2016 #10
I can't tell if there is any drainage there. PersonNumber503602 Apr 2016 #12
Dolores park has multiple public washrooms Sen. Walter Sobchak Apr 2016 #22
And? hunter Apr 2016 #24
And those anti-social substance abusers are going to use this thing? Sen. Walter Sobchak Apr 2016 #33
I remember a pissoir right outside Notre Dame Cathedral in Paris pinboy3niner Apr 2016 #11
Seriously? This is a thing? ScreamingMeemie Apr 2016 #13
In America? Renew Deal Apr 2016 #18
My response exactly. peace13 Apr 2016 #51
One mistake, and urinal lot of trouble. Orrex Apr 2016 #14
You seem to be a whiz at this pinboy3niner Apr 2016 #15
That's gold, Jerry. .. OriginalGeek Apr 2016 #16
I see a steady stream of commentary about this. madinmaryland Apr 2016 #36
It's trending #1 pinboy3niner Apr 2016 #40
Wee! Look at you go! Orrex Apr 2016 #41
Urethra doer or a watcher, I guess pinboy3niner Apr 2016 #43
Pee diddly issue to me. Eleanors38 Apr 2016 #53
But it's flush with peetential pinboy3niner Apr 2016 #60
I just love showering Pb9er with praise OriginalGeek Apr 2016 #42
I prays for the day when I won't have to wear a "rain" coat! :) pinboy3niner Apr 2016 #47
Here I am, stuck in the piddle with you. 11 Bravo Apr 2016 #37
Moral: It's bladder to be safe than soggy pinboy3niner Apr 2016 #64
That thing could be useful in NYC Renew Deal Apr 2016 #19
We have bars here in Houston that have ScreamingMeemie Apr 2016 #20
Omg, what's next? Frickin drunks can't bother to put it in the toilet? wordpix Apr 2016 #61
You can sue for being "offensive to manners and morals"? Democat Apr 2016 #25
Just a WAG here - there are no/few... 3catwoman3 Apr 2016 #27
Privacy is largely a first world luxury Major Nikon Apr 2016 #28
Good point. A first world luxury for which I am profoundly grateful. 3catwoman3 Apr 2016 #29
I have seen very little of that in the third world Sen. Walter Sobchak Apr 2016 #49
I've seen it pinboy3niner Apr 2016 #55
... Major Nikon Apr 2016 #57
Not quite the same as items carried at... 3catwoman3 Apr 2016 #58
Somewhat less practical Major Nikon Apr 2016 #59
Poo in Loo AngryAmish Apr 2016 #52
Some places have troughs. johnp3907 Apr 2016 #48
Wow, I live in the City yuiyoshida Apr 2016 #31
They added another restroom building and increased from 4 toilets to 27 pinboy3niner Apr 2016 #35
good! yuiyoshida Apr 2016 #46
“It’s just like a sex party,” KamaAina Apr 2016 #38
Open-air urination: $0. The city attorney's comments: Priceless. KamaAina Apr 2016 #39
Heh. That is good. Eleanors38 Apr 2016 #54
Lol. Hassin Bin Sober Apr 2016 #63
IT IS HORRIBLE. 3RD WORLD IDEA .... peeing in public. trueblue2007 Apr 2016 #44
To throw out a contrary opinion for a second, cities like SF make it way too effin impossible Warren DeMontague Apr 2016 #56

Vinca

(50,273 posts)
1. Who would put up an "open air" urinal? That's just weird.
Tue Apr 19, 2016, 04:02 PM
Apr 2016

I can't argue with the complaint. If they want to put bathroom facilities in the park, throw up some walls.

 

Chan790

(20,176 posts)
5. The residents of the neighborhood surrounding the park lobbied for it.
Tue Apr 19, 2016, 04:23 PM
Apr 2016

It was a modest solution proposed to encourage park-users to not pee on the greenery, walls or sidewalks.

Apparently, it's not so much the lack of ability to install plumbing...it's about some park-users exercising their civil disobedience in furtherance of their belief in public urination. (I'm going to admit I don't get it...but there it is. There are restrooms...this is for the people that refuse to use them.)

thesquanderer

(11,989 posts)
50. re: "There are restrooms...this is for the people that refuse to use them"
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 07:02 PM
Apr 2016

I know a couple of people who prefer to pee outside rather than use most public restrooms. Unfortunately, they're both women, so this kind of thing wouldn't help them.

Hassin Bin Sober

(26,330 posts)
21. Tell me about it. We live a block from Wrigley Field.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:33 AM
Apr 2016

We constantly have people peeing between our cars and on our garbage cans.

I used to get mad. Then I remembered I made a few "alley stops" when I was a yoot.

I've gone from wanting to poor boiling oil off my third story deck, to wanting to get a megaphone and try the embarrassment angle "hey, that looks like a dick, only smaller" ...

... lately I think about getting a camera and starting a porn site "the dicks of Wrigley Field". Why not turn a profit?

 

immoderate

(20,885 posts)
3. We can never be truly civilized as long as we have to piss.
Tue Apr 19, 2016, 04:12 PM
Apr 2016

And if we tear down this edifice...

--imm

Initech

(100,079 posts)
9. So what is the solution then? Adult diapers?
Tue Apr 19, 2016, 09:14 PM
Apr 2016

I think Bill Maher said one time something like "Face it, we are a bunch of lazy slobs who won't be happy until we can go to the mall wearing a diaper."

 

immoderate

(20,885 posts)
23. I fear there is no solution.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:49 AM
Apr 2016

The more civilized (and populated) we become, the more limited the areas for natural relief.

People who wear diapers can't usually complain about it.

--imm

jonno99

(2,620 posts)
4. I wonder - what is the purpose for the chain-link surround? Maybe for the riders,
Tue Apr 19, 2016, 04:21 PM
Apr 2016

it "blurs" what you're holding??

Quantess

(27,630 posts)
7. People pee all over the place in SF anyway.
Tue Apr 19, 2016, 04:31 PM
Apr 2016

It's hard to find an actual toilet sometimes, and some people stopped bothering to find one. Kind of an uphill battle.

 

Sen. Walter Sobchak

(8,692 posts)
17. Only if you're intoxicated, beligerent and screaming threatening nonsense
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:11 AM
Apr 2016

Sane and sober people don't "pee all over the place"

Dorian Gray

(13,496 posts)
26. Unfortunately,
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 06:19 AM
Apr 2016

there seems to be a higher number of people who fit that description in San Francisco. (Than in other cities.) Hasn't it been said that governments from Red Counties throughout California bus their homeless people to SF?

Services for homeless and the mentally ill need to be increased.


I do remember smelling urine quite a bit in SF. The smell would randomly hit me as we were walking around the city.

yuiyoshida

(41,831 posts)
32. The worse place were the
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 01:12 PM
Apr 2016

escalators at Powell and Market street, where it comes up from the Muni and Bart Station. Omg, during the summer I had to hold my nose, it wreaked of Urine..

Victor_c3

(3,557 posts)
8. When I was a college kid...
Tue Apr 19, 2016, 09:06 PM
Apr 2016

I took a trip to Europe. We decided that we weren't going to drink anything but beer the whole time we were there (no water or coffee allowed) and I was proud of myself for peeing on the street or major building of every city or town I visited while I was there for two weeks.

I don't know what that accomplished, but I was pretty proud of it. After the incident where Marilyn Manson spit on me when I was at one of his concerts in 1997, it is one of my proudest moments in life. Well, there was this one time when I was 12 or 13 years old and I was riding on a spinny ride high in the air at a country fair with my friend's hot sister's friend. I puked all over the place and I covered all sorts of people below me with my puke! Nobody had a clue who did it and I got away with it scott free! The girl I was with was completely disgusted and it was completely awesome.

PersonNumber503602

(1,134 posts)
12. I can't tell if there is any drainage there.
Tue Apr 19, 2016, 10:40 PM
Apr 2016

Does the urine just pool up at the base?



*edit*

ahhh here were go

 

Sen. Walter Sobchak

(8,692 posts)
22. Dolores park has multiple public washrooms
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:39 AM
Apr 2016

This is a substance abuse and anti-social behavior issue, not an infrastructure one.

hunter

(38,316 posts)
24. And?
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 01:08 AM
Apr 2016

Would you like to be nominated for toilet monitor duty?

Dealing with anti-social substance abusers isn't easy, especially those with money.

 

Sen. Walter Sobchak

(8,692 posts)
33. And those anti-social substance abusers are going to use this thing?
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:32 PM
Apr 2016

As opposed to pissing themselves or just whatever is three feet away from them?

pinboy3niner

(53,339 posts)
11. I remember a pissoir right outside Notre Dame Cathedral in Paris
Tue Apr 19, 2016, 09:29 PM
Apr 2016

It was screened all the way around, but only from neck to mid-calf, so people could see the heads and feet and streams of the users.

Renew Deal

(81,860 posts)
19. That thing could be useful in NYC
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:18 AM
Apr 2016

I saw a guy using an open air urinal that looked like a building on a busy street the other day.

ScreamingMeemie

(68,918 posts)
20. We have bars here in Houston that have
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:20 AM
Apr 2016

peeing walls in the men's room. Apparently, you pee against the wall and there's a drain running along the floor

wordpix

(18,652 posts)
61. Omg, what's next? Frickin drunks can't bother to put it in the toilet?
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 10:29 PM
Apr 2016

Truly we're the Roman empire now. How about afew vomitoriums thrown in for a few bucks more?

3catwoman3

(24,003 posts)
27. Just a WAG here - there are no/few...
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 07:31 AM
Apr 2016

...women using this facility. Do men not value privacy for thee performance of bodily functions? It has always puzzled me that there are no stalls around urinals. I would NEVER want to pee with an audience.

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
28. Privacy is largely a first world luxury
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 08:26 AM
Apr 2016

In the third world you can see people squating on the sidewalks. Some places have open sewers with trenches to squat over.

In France, stall-less urinals are often placed next to community sinks in public restrooms. So a woman can be washing her hands while a guy is relieving himself 2' away.

The urinals in the public restrooms at the Eiffel Tower have stalls, but they only are about 4' tall, so you can wave at your wife in line for the women's toilets.

3catwoman3

(24,003 posts)
29. Good point. A first world luxury for which I am profoundly grateful.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:14 PM
Apr 2016

AKAIK, San Francisco is a first world city.

I lived in Japan for 2 years, while in the Air Force nurse corps. One of the more challenging experiences was trying to use one of the in-the-floor trough/trench type toilets, while having a gastrointestinal illness, while on a moving train that was swaying side to side. Thank goodness for the handrails on the walls. Trying to gather up a long skirt or get your pants for enough off so as not to pee on your clothes was an additional challenge.

Relieving oneself in public if you are a female wearing jeans/trousers, would require fully disrobing from the waist down. No thanks.

 

Sen. Walter Sobchak

(8,692 posts)
49. I have seen very little of that in the third world
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 06:51 PM
Apr 2016

The only place in the third world I have seen that was India, and the (primarily men) who were doing it would immediately face an onslaught of verbal abuse and occasionally thrown objects.

pinboy3niner

(53,339 posts)
55. I've seen it
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 08:08 PM
Apr 2016

People peeing on street medians with traffic going by, people peeing on buildings.

On a major government building in Saigon I saw messages painted on the outer walls in red about every 10 feet, all the way around. It said something like "Cong Dai!" I turned to my interpreter and asked what that meant, "Cong Dai! Cong Dai! Cong Dai!"

My interpreter told me it means "Don't Pee! Don't Pee! Don't Pee!"

Major Nikon

(36,827 posts)
59. Somewhat less practical
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 09:11 PM
Apr 2016

At least assuming the reason for underwear is to protect your pants from your ass. At least assless pants still achieves that goal.

yuiyoshida

(41,831 posts)
31. Wow, I live in the City
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 01:07 PM
Apr 2016

been to Dolores Park and never noticed that. How odd...and Yes, put in a Facility with toilets and Running water! Who thought this was a good idea??

pinboy3niner

(53,339 posts)
35. They added another restroom building and increased from 4 toilets to 27
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 04:56 PM
Apr 2016

This story gives more of the background:

Dolores Park, with spiffy new look, reopens next week in S.F.
http://www.sfgate.com/bayarea/article/Dolores-Park-with-spiffy-new-look-reopens-next-6744096.php

 

KamaAina

(78,249 posts)
38. “It’s just like a sex party,”
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 05:19 PM
Apr 2016
said the Pacific Justice Institute’s Frank Lee. “You know they have a lot of places they can have a sex party, but not in a public park!”


Party on, Frank!
 

KamaAina

(78,249 posts)
39. Open-air urination: $0. The city attorney's comments: Priceless.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 05:20 PM
Apr 2016
The City Attorney’s office said in a statement that it will defend against the litigation and pointed out the 16-acre park is well-known for its “counter culture, immodest sunbathers, pot brownie vendors, spectacular city views, and famously irreverent ‘Hunky Jesus’ contest.”...

“If I had to predict the top 100 things in Dolores Park likely to offend these plaintiffs, I wouldn’t have guessed that this would make the cut,” City Attorney spokesman Matt Dorsey said in the statement.


Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
56. To throw out a contrary opinion for a second, cities like SF make it way too effin impossible
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 08:16 PM
Apr 2016

to use a public bathroom, in many cases.

I don't know if Dolores Park has public restrooms- it's been a long time since I chilled on the hills there- but I can tell you I've spent plenty of time wandering around overpriced San Francisco neighborhoods looking for a place to take a leak that wouldn't require me to sit down and order a full dinner, first.

Also, that thing looks more like a pitcher's backstop than a urinal. I would imagine the softball leagues find it confusing. Just sayin'.

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