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tabasco

(22,974 posts)
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:33 PM Apr 2016

Hillary will never survive the Trump onslaught: It’s not fair, but it makes her a weak nominee

There are many nauseating aspects of the new reality TV series, “America Picks a Prez,” which airs around the clock on every single channel on earth: the cynical, open-air conspiracy between our Fourth Estate and Donald “Ratings Viagra” Trump. Ted Cruz uttering the word “prayerfully“ while not exploding into a cloud of synthetic piety. Caucasian patriots heroically exercising their right to punch people of color.

Among these, let me nominate one more: listening to Hillary partisans explain to those of us who support Bernie Sanders just how naive we are. Only Hillary, we are told, has a real shot at winning in November. She’s the only one with a realistic grasp of how Washington works, whose moderate (and modest) policy aims might, realistically, be enacted. It often sounds as if Clinton’s central pitch to voters isn’t that she has a moral vision for the country, but that she owns the franchise on realism.

Bernie, meanwhile, is just a sweet-shouting rube whose quarter-century as a congressman and senator has somehow failed to instill in him an appreciation for the twin plagues of grift and gridlock.

For us benighted hippies, the standard counter-argument at this point is that our man understands all too well the magnitude of Washington’s dysfunction, which is why he’s calling for a political revolution: to obliterate the most heinous aspects of the status quo, starting with corporate-sponsored elections.


http://www.salon.com/2016/03/14/hillary_will_never_survive_the_trump_onslaught_its_not_fair_but_it_makes_her_a_weak_nominee/
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Hillary will never survive the Trump onslaught: It’s not fair, but it makes her a weak nominee (Original Post) tabasco Apr 2016 OP
She's already survived more puke onslaughts sharp_stick Apr 2016 #1
Edited to say I need to read before I post. nt Else You Are Mad Apr 2016 #4
Caught the edit sharp_stick Apr 2016 #6
I know. Sorry. Else You Are Mad Apr 2016 #8
No worries n/t sharp_stick Apr 2016 #9
I agree. Else You Are Mad Apr 2016 #10
Are you saying Hillary cant beat Trump? Really saying that? Jackie Wilson Said Apr 2016 #2
Of course she will. Buzz Clik Apr 2016 #3
Corrrect. And seeing that we all know this, what's the bizness? yourpaljoey Apr 2016 #5
Yawn. Another far leftie has a sad because Saint Bernard is crashing and berning. stopbush Apr 2016 #7
Eh, I disagree. cwydro Apr 2016 #11
She is a terrible candidate. Svafa Apr 2016 #12
Salon needs to rebrand as 'NotHillary.' onehandle Apr 2016 #13
The author is seriously mistaken and utterly clueless. underahedgerow Apr 2016 #14
Oh, please. She's been surviving rw onslaughts for decades. Arkansas Granny Apr 2016 #15
After the author acknowledges he supports Bernie, he makes this closing admission; procon Apr 2016 #16
Your outline is correct Protalker Apr 2016 #17
I don't think she can beat Trump. Marr Apr 2016 #18
BWAHAHA FLPanhandle Apr 2016 #19
"no chance of being elected" tabasco Apr 2016 #21
Sanders is a very weak general election candidate who would be destroyed Gothmog Apr 2016 #20

sharp_stick

(14,400 posts)
1. She's already survived more puke onslaughts
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:35 PM
Apr 2016

than any other candidate in history with the possible exception of Barack Obama.

She's tough as hell and she has an oppo research group as good or better than any other candidate.

sharp_stick

(14,400 posts)
6. Caught the edit
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:37 PM
Apr 2016

I meant it when I said "with the possible exception of Barack Obama" too. He proved himself to be one hell of a lot tougher and smarter than any Republican, and some Democrats ever dreamed.

I've never seen anyone weather a shitstorm of hate like him.

Svafa

(594 posts)
12. She is a terrible candidate.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:42 PM
Apr 2016

Her favorability is in the toilet, the only people who support her a percentage of the dem base. Independents, moderates, and many democrats are not fond of her. Even setting aside the "Bernie or Bust" crowd, voter turnout will be very low for her (probably for Trump too, though). If the best thing a candidate can say in an attempt to bring lefties, indies, and moderates into the fold is, "At least I'm not as bad as the other guy!" you have a terrible candidate.

onehandle

(51,122 posts)
13. Salon needs to rebrand as 'NotHillary.'
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:43 PM
Apr 2016

Maybe then they would get some of that sweet, sweet 'Not Hillary' Party cash and not be so totally broke.

underahedgerow

(1,232 posts)
14. The author is seriously mistaken and utterly clueless.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:43 PM
Apr 2016

Trump blows up and blusters and sputters at the drop of a hat. He loses his temper and can't construct more than 2 words at a time.

Clinton is the epitome of cool, extreme intelligence and even temper.

Trump has played out his game for too long and he's teetering on the edge. Bernie is also losing patience and wearing thin. It's a shame, he's a good guy.

Thing is, I don't think Bernie could hold his own against Trump. Trump is good at being a bully.

And I still can't figure out WHAT Bernie was thinking in the Vatican thing. A Hail Mary play, figuratively and literally... That one stumps me.

No one can bully Mrs. Clinton.

It will all be just fine.

Arkansas Granny

(31,518 posts)
15. Oh, please. She's been surviving rw onslaughts for decades.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:44 PM
Apr 2016

At some point, Trump is going to be expected to explain in detail how he plans to make America great again. His fans might love his bombastic bullshit answers, but that won't go over so well in the debates.

procon

(15,805 posts)
16. After the author acknowledges he supports Bernie, he makes this closing admission;
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:44 PM
Apr 2016

"None of this is to suggest that Hillary won’t beat Trump, if they wind up as the nominees. Nor that she won’t be a great president."

Thanks for wasting my time reading about how Hillary is going to be a weak nominee, but still beat Trump and be a great president.

Protalker

(418 posts)
17. Your outline is correct
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 12:45 PM
Apr 2016

He has been in congress for 25 years. His colleagues who will be carrying and pushing change have overwhelmingly chosen Clinton I would assume seeing them both on the job. Believe in her.ability to DO the job.Things should be different.

 

Marr

(20,317 posts)
18. I don't think she can beat Trump.
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 01:04 PM
Apr 2016

Her campaign's reflexive cries of sexism will boomerang back on her in seconds, too.

It's an unfortunate situation. We've got a stupendously bad candidate, a person with decades of baggage and shockingly low approval ratings, who is under investigation by the FBI, who has zero appeal to Independents and millennials (and may actually send many of the latter away from the party for good, in fact).

Then there's the fact that she energizes the hell out of the far right, and will make the ideal punching bag for Trump.

FLPanhandle

(7,107 posts)
19. BWAHAHA
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 01:09 PM
Apr 2016


Trump has no chance of being elected. None. Nada. Zilch.

You wonder why the Republican leadership is fighting tooth and nail to get someone, anyone, besides Trump as the nominee? It's because they see the demographics and know Trump would be slaughtered by anyone the Democrats nominate.

This is a another stupid "concern" piece.

Gothmog

(145,312 posts)
20. Sanders is a very weak general election candidate who would be destroyed
Wed Apr 20, 2016, 02:07 PM
Apr 2016

Sanders has not been vetted and is very vulnerable to negative ads. I am amused that Sanders supporters and Sanders keep citing general election match polls that are worthless because Sanders has not been vetted. Dana Milbank has some good comments on general election match up polls https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/democrats-would-be-insane-to-nominate-bernie-sanders/2016/01/26/0590e624-c472-11e5-a4aa-f25866ba0dc6_story.html?hpid=hp_opinions-for-wide-side_opinion-card-a%3Ahomepage%2Fstory

Sanders and his supporters boast of polls showing him, on average, matching up slightly better against Trump than Clinton does. But those matchups are misleading: Opponents have been attacking and defining Clinton for a quarter- century, but nobody has really gone to work yet on demonizing Sanders.

Watching Sanders at Monday night’s Democratic presidential forum in Des Moines, I imagined how Trump — or another Republican nominee — would disembowel the relatively unknown Vermonter.


The first questioner from the audience asked Sanders to explain why he embraces the “socialist” label and requested that Sanders define it “so that it doesn’t concern the rest of us citizens.”

Sanders, explaining that much of what he proposes is happening in Scandinavia and Germany (a concept that itself alarms Americans who don’t want to be like socialized Europe), answered vaguely: “Creating a government that works for all of us, not just a handful of people on the top — that’s my definition of democratic socialism.”

But that’s not how Republicans will define socialism — and they’ll have the dictionary on their side. They’ll portray Sanders as one who wants the government to own and control major industries and the means of production and distribution of goods. They’ll say he wants to take away private property. That wouldn’t be fair, but it would be easy. Socialists don’t win national elections in the United States .

Sanders on Monday night also admitted he would seek massive tax increases — “one of the biggest tax hikes in history,” as moderator Chris Cuomo put it — to expand Medicare to all. Sanders, this time making a comparison with Britain and France, allowed that “hypothetically, you’re going to pay $5,000 more in taxes,” and declared, “W e will raise taxes, yes we will.” He said this would be offset by lower health-insurance premiums and protested that “it’s demagogic to say, oh, you’re paying more in taxes.

Well, yes — and Trump is a demagogue.

Sanders also made clear he would be happy to identify Democrats as the party of big government and of wealth redistribution. When Cuomo said Sanders seemed to be saying he would grow government “bigger than ever,” Sanders didn’t quarrel, saying, “P eople want to criticize me, okay,” and “F ine, if that’s the criticism, I accept it.”

Sanders accepts it, but are Democrats ready to accept ownership of socialism, massive tax increases and a dramatic expansion of government? If so, they will lose.

Match up polls are worthless because these polls do not measure what would happen to Sanders in a general election where Sanders is very vulnerable to negative ads.
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