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Purveyor

(29,876 posts)
Tue May 10, 2016, 02:53 PM May 2016

Russia To Test Unstoppable 'Satan 2' Stealth Nuke Capable Of Wiping Out An Entire Nation

Russia is preparing to test-fire a nuclear weapon which is so powerful it could reportedly destroy a whole country in seconds.

The "Satan 2" missile is rumoured to be the most powerful ever designed and is equipped with stealth technology to help it dodge enemy radar systems .

This terrifying doomsday weapon is likely to strike fear into the hearts of Western military chiefs, as current missile defence technology is totally incapable of stopping it.

Its official name is the RS-28 Sarmat and it will replace aging Soviet R-36M missiles, which NATO military experts nicknamed "Satan".

"In this sense, the Sarmat missile will not only become the R-36M's successor, but also to some extent it will determine in which direction nuclear deterrence in the world will develop," the Russian news network Zvezda reported .

more...

http://www.mirror.co.uk/tech/russia-test-unstoppable-satan-2-7935675

47 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Russia To Test Unstoppable 'Satan 2' Stealth Nuke Capable Of Wiping Out An Entire Nation (Original Post) Purveyor May 2016 OP
This kind of thing happens when a country's run by Doctor fucking Doom. NuclearDem May 2016 #1
How many hundreds of thousands innocent civilians have Russia killed in the last twenty five years Purveyor May 2016 #3
Ask Ukraine, Poland, the Baltics, Afghanistan, Central Asia, the Caucasus states, NuclearDem May 2016 #11
Got a 'body count' to go with that list? eom Purveyor May 2016 #15
Sure, why not? NuclearDem May 2016 #17
Guess you missed 'the last twenty five years' part in my reply. Make it Purveyor May 2016 #21
Given that he's KGB and has invaded two former Soviet republics so far NuclearDem May 2016 #23
Wouldn't it be relevant, necessary even, to implicitly allow not merely civilian deaths but also... LanternWaste May 2016 #45
Don't know, it's not relevent Bradical79 May 2016 #13
Shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh! n/t malaise May 2016 #19
Well the US seems to be going full steam ahead with weapons development RedCappedBandit May 2016 #38
Full steam ahead would be war production taking 41% of GDP. LanternWaste May 2016 #46
^^^^^^^^^^^ Peacetrain May 2016 #43
Just how large a country? SheilaT May 2016 #2
"Half a dozen of those could pretty much wipe out most life on the planet" EX500rider May 2016 #6
Then what the hell is anyone worried for!? Let the unchecked arms race resume! villager May 2016 #7
I'm thinking in terms of the size given: SheilaT May 2016 #12
And just how likely is it to live up to that hype? JHB May 2016 #22
Exactly. SheilaT May 2016 #25
Downthread it's mentioned that it's a MIRV... JHB May 2016 #27
This part is such utter BS. Modern MIRV warheads are much smaller yield than '50s free fall bombs leveymg May 2016 #28
Why do you need details? pediatricmedic May 2016 #8
A bit of context. Chan790 May 2016 #20
OK, so now I'm REALLY deterred!! immoderate May 2016 #4
Gee, I wish we had one of them doomsday machines Heeeeers Johnny May 2016 #5
Ugh - this just another MIRVed ICBM - just like US MX missile - it carries up to 12 warheads jpak May 2016 #9
The difference is MX was destroyed as part of arms limitation treaties stevenleser May 2016 #40
Are we afraid now? MuseRider May 2016 #10
I'd bet the American track record is worse Matrosov May 2016 #14
Russia killed twice as many civilians in Afghanistan NuclearDem May 2016 #24
Here we go maxrandb May 2016 #16
Unless your conspiracy theory accounts for Lockheed controlling Moscow media, no. stevenleser May 2016 #18
"Strike fear" my ass. It's going to give erections to the MIC n/t arcane1 May 2016 #26
Where the F do they plan to test this beauty? Space? 7wo7rees May 2016 #29
how many megatons? Manifestor_of_Light May 2016 #30
Must be military appropriations time again thelordofhell May 2016 #31
Nope, source is Russian media, not US. See my above post. NT stevenleser May 2016 #33
In Independence Day the aliens did it wrong. TrappedInUtah May 2016 #32
The best mad scientist nuclear weapon proposal ever was U.S.A.'s "Project Pluto" hunter May 2016 #34
"We'll meet again, don't know where, don't know when..." edbermac May 2016 #35
One more awful thing to worry about. leftyladyfrommo May 2016 #36
This one goes to 11. Orrex May 2016 #37
It doesn't really change the logic of deterrence. Warren DeMontague May 2016 #39
Donald Trump: "I accept that challenge redStateBlueHeart May 2016 #41
A pic of the new weapon. Pretty scary stuff... leeroysphitz May 2016 #42
I lulz'd KG May 2016 #44
Regarding Russian military hardware? What source for that would you prefer? stevenleser May 2016 #47
 

Purveyor

(29,876 posts)
3. How many hundreds of thousands innocent civilians have Russia killed in the last twenty five years
Tue May 10, 2016, 03:00 PM
May 2016

compared to the grand ole USA?

 

NuclearDem

(16,184 posts)
11. Ask Ukraine, Poland, the Baltics, Afghanistan, Central Asia, the Caucasus states,
Tue May 10, 2016, 03:17 PM
May 2016

Finland, Hungary, and Czechoslovakia about how compassionate dear Russia is to civilians.

 

NuclearDem

(16,184 posts)
17. Sure, why not?
Tue May 10, 2016, 04:03 PM
May 2016

For Holodomor alone, anywhere from between 2.4 and 7.5 million. For Stalin's Purges, anywhere from between 650,000 and 1.2 million. For Katyn, 22,000. For the March deportations, at least 94,000. About 3,000 killed in Hungary in 1956. Nearly 35,000 killed during the Battle of Grozny. Anywhere from 850,000 to 1.5 million civilians in Afghanistan.

For comparison, the Iraq War, which you seem to think killed every living human being on the face of the planet, is estimated between 110,000 and 650,000 civilian deaths; at the most liberal estimate, that's fewer than the most conservative estimate for how many of its own civilians Russia killed during the Purge.

For even more context, the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan killed at least twice as many civilians as the US invasion of Afghanistan and invasion of Iraq combined.

 

Purveyor

(29,876 posts)
21. Guess you missed 'the last twenty five years' part in my reply. Make it
Tue May 10, 2016, 05:02 PM
May 2016

easier for you, how about since the year 2000 when your "Doctor fucking Doom" first became President of Russia.

 

NuclearDem

(16,184 posts)
23. Given that he's KGB and has invaded two former Soviet republics so far
Tue May 10, 2016, 05:41 PM
May 2016

I'm just going to go ahead and lump him in with his Soviet predecessors where he wants to be.

He's even picking up where they left off, with propping up a puppet regime by bombing Muslim insurgents.

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
45. Wouldn't it be relevant, necessary even, to implicitly allow not merely civilian deaths but also...
Fri May 13, 2016, 12:55 PM
May 2016

Wouldn't it be relevant, necessary even, to implicitly allow not merely civilian deaths but also square mileage due to the mechanism of expansionism and number of nation-states dissolved as well to better gauge a government's greed?

Or are the repugnant, offensive and destructive actions of any one nation wholly predicated on a comparison to Washington rather than taken, analyzed and judged on its own lack of merit?

 

Bradical79

(4,490 posts)
13. Don't know, it's not relevent
Tue May 10, 2016, 03:22 PM
May 2016

We're talking about a stealth nuclear missle developed by Russia. Civilian casualties aren't relevent to the story. That said, I assume we've killed more between Iraq and Afghanistan, though the Russian number is well over 100,000.

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
46. Full steam ahead would be war production taking 41% of GDP.
Fri May 13, 2016, 12:59 PM
May 2016

Full steam ahead would be war production during the 40's (41% of GDP) as opposed to the here and now (4.75% of GDP).

"so what does that make us?"
Individuals who are rational enough to judge the actions of one nation on its own merits rather than wholly predicating them on Washington's merits.

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
2. Just how large a country?
Tue May 10, 2016, 02:59 PM
May 2016

Okay, the article says the size of France or Texas, but I still feel some details are lacking.

Half a dozen of those could pretty much wipe out most life on the planet. It's also not clear just how much radioactivity would be released, or what it's half life will be.

Details, people, it's all in the details.

EX500rider

(10,881 posts)
6. "Half a dozen of those could pretty much wipe out most life on the planet"
Tue May 10, 2016, 03:03 PM
May 2016

That seems unlikely:

In total nuclear test megatonnage, from 1945–92, 520 atmospheric nuclear explosions (including 8 underwater) have been conducted with a total yield of 545 megatons, with a peak occurring in 1961-62, when 340 megatons were detonated in the atmosphere by the United States and Soviet Union.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_weapons_testing

 

villager

(26,001 posts)
7. Then what the hell is anyone worried for!? Let the unchecked arms race resume!
Tue May 10, 2016, 03:07 PM
May 2016

No finer use for public monies! And what could possibly go wrong!?

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
12. I'm thinking in terms of the size given:
Tue May 10, 2016, 03:19 PM
May 2016

Texas or France. Two or three of those in Europe would destroy most of Western Europe. Africa and Asia are larger, so you're right that I've underestimated how many would be needed to wipe out most life. Not to mention North and South America.

Still, if I were an alien race wanting to clear this planet of the creatures that currently live here, I'd be quite happy with this development.

JHB

(37,163 posts)
22. And just how likely is it to live up to that hype?
Tue May 10, 2016, 05:38 PM
May 2016

Destruction over that area is on par with an asteroid impact, and multiple times the size of e biggest nuke to date, the 1961 Tsar Bomba. Russia's big, but just how big a chunk of it is Vlad willing to flatten (and poison) to test it?

 

SheilaT

(23,156 posts)
25. Exactly.
Tue May 10, 2016, 05:43 PM
May 2016

That's what I was trying to get at, but I was far too oblique.

I am hesitate to say I simply don't believe the claim, since I know next to nothing about bombs or how they're built or just how destructive they can be, but it does seem rather improbable.

JHB

(37,163 posts)
27. Downthread it's mentioned that it's a MIRV...
Tue May 10, 2016, 05:49 PM
May 2016

...so the main question is how does it compare to stuff we've had for 30 years.

Not anything you'd want launched, but it doesn't really change the strategic situation.

leveymg

(36,418 posts)
28. This part is such utter BS. Modern MIRV warheads are much smaller yield than '50s free fall bombs
Tue May 10, 2016, 05:52 PM
May 2016

the largest of which was 50 megatons. Those could wipe out an area the size of Massachusetts. These NATO codename Satan 2s have 12 warheads that are about a megaton each, but much more accurate and likely to reach their targets than bomber-carried weapons of the Cold War.

pediatricmedic

(397 posts)
8. Why do you need details?
Tue May 10, 2016, 03:08 PM
May 2016

But some internet digging revealed, but unable to verify:

12 warheads per missile, average yield 1 to 1.4 Mtons each. Each warhead independently target-able.

 

Chan790

(20,176 posts)
20. A bit of context.
Tue May 10, 2016, 04:37 PM
May 2016

I only know this from having taken a poli. sci. class on the Cold War in college but for strategic reasons MIRVed warheads are redundantly-targeted (12 warheads means 6 primary targets and 3 secondary targets...if a primary target is sensed as destroyed, the IRV "corrects" to a secondary target) and time from deployment to impact limits the number of reassignments possible post-launch to one per IRV. 12 warheads means a maximum of 9 and a near-certainty of 6 detonations. (This is up from the earliest US and Soviet MIRVs which carried 4 warheads with a maximum of 2 detonations.) To limit the risk of "broken arrows" (loose viable nuclear weapons) warheads not detonated on target self-destruct.

It's still pretty horrific...but it's not quite as bad as 12 warheads initially sounds.

jpak

(41,760 posts)
9. Ugh - this just another MIRVed ICBM - just like US MX missile - it carries up to 12 warheads
Tue May 10, 2016, 03:09 PM
May 2016

Could wipe out NYC or LA - but not the entire US.

yup

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
40. The difference is MX was destroyed as part of arms limitation treaties
Thu May 12, 2016, 05:11 PM
May 2016

No MX missiles exist anymore and haven't since 2005.

It figures a relic from the Cold War like Putin would deploy a new strategic nuclear missile system.

 

Matrosov

(1,098 posts)
14. I'd bet the American track record is worse
Tue May 10, 2016, 03:25 PM
May 2016

How many people has Russia killed in Georgia, Ukraine, and Syria, compared to the US in Afghanistan and Iraq?

 

NuclearDem

(16,184 posts)
24. Russia killed twice as many civilians in Afghanistan
Tue May 10, 2016, 05:42 PM
May 2016

than the US did in Afghanistan and Iraq combined.

maxrandb

(15,364 posts)
16. Here we go
Tue May 10, 2016, 03:44 PM
May 2016

Dollars to Donuts it's a planted story from Lockheed-Martin to ensure we develop stealthier stealth weapons.

Donald Trump will build it. It will be the stealthiest!

The Empire must now have a Death Star. Why settle for vaporizing one puny little nation. Let's build something that would destroy a planet.

OK, maybe I've had one too many Bombay Safire's and water.

 

stevenleser

(32,886 posts)
18. Unless your conspiracy theory accounts for Lockheed controlling Moscow media, no.
Tue May 10, 2016, 04:21 PM
May 2016

On edit, here is the link to Russian state media's report that prompted the article the OP talks about:
http://sputniknews.com/russia/20160508/1039258053/russia-ballistic-missile-sarmat.html

Russia's New ICBM Sarmat Can Penetrate Defense Shield, Wipe Out Texas

The best current missile defenses system may prove powerless against Sarmat, Russia's new intercontinental ballistic missile, which will be ready for field trials this summer, according to the Russian news network Zvezda.
.
.
.
The broadcaster added that the RS-28 is capable of wiping out parts of the earth the size of Texas or France, and that its higher speed performance will enable it to speed past every missile defense system in existence.
Although there is very little information on the technical characteristics of the new missile, some sources said that the Sarmat is a two-stage missile with an estimated operational range of 10,000km and a mass of at least 100 tons, including a payload weighing from 4 tons up to 10 tons.
.
.
.

 

Manifestor_of_Light

(21,046 posts)
30. how many megatons?
Tue May 10, 2016, 06:03 PM
May 2016

Blast radius approximately 450 miles or so, knowing the size of Texas. Details please.

thelordofhell

(4,569 posts)
31. Must be military appropriations time again
Tue May 10, 2016, 06:09 PM
May 2016

Doomsday weapon articles come out of the woodwork........Between this and the North Korea articles, the MIC is ready for it's yearly blank check.......

 

TrappedInUtah

(87 posts)
32. In Independence Day the aliens did it wrong.
Tue May 10, 2016, 06:09 PM
May 2016

They just needed to wait for us to eventually kill ourselves off lol. Nukes that can wipe out small countries. What a practical and necessary invention and use of human time and intelligence.

hunter

(38,337 posts)
34. The best mad scientist nuclear weapon proposal ever was U.S.A.'s "Project Pluto"
Wed May 11, 2016, 12:53 AM
May 2016

It was an unmanned supersonic bomber that could remain airborne for weeks, unmanned because the radiation from its engine would be deadly to humans, even humans it flew over. After dropping its load of atomic bombs it would fly around a few more weeks terrifying an enemy nation's inhabitants with its deadly radiation and smashing them with sonic booms. Then it would crash into a final target leaving a radioactive Chernobyl scale mess.

Facilities to test the scheme were built at Jackass Flats in Nevada, including a prototype engine:



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_Pluto

Warren DeMontague

(80,708 posts)
39. It doesn't really change the logic of deterrence.
Wed May 11, 2016, 07:38 AM
May 2016

The only way a nuclear weapon would be a game-changer in terms of the (admittedly fucked up) reasoning which has underlain the uneasy truce between the nuclear superpowers all these years, would be if one country could somehow knock the other country's nuclear strike capability out entirely, to the point that the other country couldn't hit back. (The environmental impact would be global, of course, but that's another story)

Even with a "stealth doomsday missile"- or a bunch, lets follow the logic, here- even if Putin up and decided one day to incinerate the continental United States, we have a 3 pronged nuclear deterrence (as do they) strategy which is implicitly designed to avoid being able to be neutralized in a first strike scenario. That includes not just hardened missile silos, but also strategic bombers and nuclear subs, all of which are ostensibly ready in just such a dreadful scenario.

I don't know if we keep the bombers in the air 24-7 the way we used to, but the subs are still out there- both ours and theirs - so in reality, it's pretty unlikely any kind of stealth doomsday missile would be able to keep us from striking back if attacked.

Which makes the exercise of nuclear war pretty pointless, to recall the movie where Matthew Broderick is the pale computer nerd kid.

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