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MADem

(135,425 posts)
Sat Jul 16, 2016, 06:30 AM Jul 2016

U.S. Finds Itself on Shakier Ground as Erdogan Confronts Mutiny

What a fricken mess....


Mr. Erdogan would almost certainly have to begin a purge of the plotters and probably hunt for other challengers to his authority — extending a streak of ruthlessness that has left many of his NATO allies gasping.

Friday’s events could leave in limbo some of the top priorities of the United States and Europe. They rely on Turkey to help battle the Islamic State, to contain the flow of migrants out of Syria, and to host American intelligence agencies and NATO forces seeking to grapple with upheaval in the Middle East.

The coup attempt “presents a dilemma to the United States and European governments: Do you support a nondemocratic coup,” or an “increasingly nondemocratic leader?” said Richard N. Haass, the president of the Council on Foreign Relations, where Mr. Erdogan has often come to talk with Americans influential in the relationship between the two countries.

To many in Washington, that dilemma is secondary to the question of whether Turkey will be a reliable partner in the battle against the Islamic State, also known as ISIS or ISIL, a willing host to American forces and a stable player in the world’s most volatile corner.

American officials say the next 24 to 48 hours will be crucial in determining whether the coup attempt will have lasting repercussions. Unlike past bloodless coups in Turkey, this one does not have the implicitly understood support of the public, which appears to be divided over the military intervention.

.... more at link




http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/16/world/europe/erdogan-turkey-coup-us-fear.html?smid=tw-nytimes&smtyp=cur&_r=0
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U.S. Finds Itself on Shakier Ground as Erdogan Confronts Mutiny (Original Post) MADem Jul 2016 OP
We should never had tried this. AngryAmish Jul 2016 #1
No--we had nothing to do with it. The criticism is that we didn't even know it was happening MADem Jul 2016 #2
Post removed Post removed Jul 2016 #4
He's denying it vociferously. MADem Jul 2016 #5
What was so noticeable to me was not a woman in sight on the streets during this coup. grossproffit Jul 2016 #3
 

AngryAmish

(25,704 posts)
1. We should never had tried this.
Sat Jul 16, 2016, 06:35 AM
Jul 2016

As the sating goes, if we were going to take Vienna, we should have taken Vienna. Kill Erogan, put a pistol in his hand, yada...

Instead we thought a few military officers could pull it off.

The State Dept reallreally has egg on it's face today.

MADem

(135,425 posts)
2. No--we had nothing to do with it. The criticism is that we didn't even know it was happening
Sat Jul 16, 2016, 06:46 AM
Jul 2016

until it was well underway. No one was "monitoring" the situation. No one was at work except the watch. People had to be called in to augment staff.

The intel agencies have egg on their faces for not having better HUMINT on this one.


Not everything that happens abroad is done by our hand or at our bidding.

From the link - I'll leave the guessing as to who is the "senior diplomat" being quoted to others:


Until midafternoon Friday, American officials thought Mr. Erdogan had tightened his iron grip on his country. He had purged the judiciary; jailed insouciant senior military officers three years ago and installed seemingly compliant successors; and cracked down on the opposition and the news media.

As one senior American diplomat said Friday evening, no one had come to work that day at the White House, the State Department or the C.I.A. expecting to see Mr. Erdogan turn to FaceTime on his iPhone to plead with the Turkish people to take to the streets in his defense.

Response to MADem (Reply #2)

MADem

(135,425 posts)
5. He's denying it vociferously.
Sat Jul 16, 2016, 07:13 AM
Jul 2016

I am not at all yet convinced that the Turkish President's nemesis is behind this. Erdogan may certainly want to believe that because he doesn't want to acknowledge in his paranoid heart that the military he relies upon to prosecute his defense and national security policy has large elements in it that hate him virulently:


Fethullah Gulen, the US-based cleric and former ally of Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan, denied being behind the attempted coup in Turkey and condemned it “in the strongest terms”.

“As someone who suffered under multiple military coups during the past five decades, it is especially insulting to be accused of having any link to such an attempt. I categorically deny such accusations,” Gulen said in a brief statement just before midnight Friday.

“I condemn, in the strongest terms, the attempted military coup in Turkey,” read the two-paragraph statement.

“Government should be won through a process of free and fair elections, not force.

“I pray to God for Turkey, for Turkish citizens, and for all those currently in Turkey that this situation is resolved peacefully and quickly.” Erdogan has accused the reclusive Islamic preacher, who lives in a tiny town in the Pocono Mountains of the US state of Pennsylvania, of being behind the coup.



This looks like it was a faction of the army. I'm sure Gulen wasn't unhappy initially, but again, I'm not assured that this was his baby--the planning of the thing was amateurish, and the full military knows how to do coups--they've done enough of them in the past. But Gulen is a convenient scapegoat, that way Ergodan can delay thinking about how many in the army want him gone:

Scores of members from Turkish armed forces were arrested across the country after a coup attempt blamed by the government on supporters of US-based cleric Fethullah Gulen, the state-run Anatolia news agency reported.

754 members of Turkish armed forces were arrested for involvement in the coup, the agency said. A Turkish official added that 29 colonels and five generals had been removed from their posts. At least 60 people were killed in the turmoil.



I do know that Turkey is in for some serious shit if Erdogan hangs on, and it looks like that will happen. Stand by for more crackdowns, regression and repression....

grossproffit

(5,591 posts)
3. What was so noticeable to me was not a woman in sight on the streets during this coup.
Sat Jul 16, 2016, 06:52 AM
Jul 2016

For their own safety? I can't even imagine. I'm so blessed as a woman to live in the United States.

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