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geardaddy

(24,931 posts)
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 05:09 PM Aug 2016

I'm a Muslim doctor. My patient refused treatment because of my religion.

http://www.pri.org/stories/2016-08-15/im-muslim-doctor-my-patient-refused-treatment-because-my-religion?utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=SocialFlow

I was preparing to see my patients. I picked up my phone and saw news that three coordinated suicide bombings had just occurred in Brussels, Belgium.

I went through the all-too-familiar ritual that a lot of Muslims go through, of hoping that the perpetrators would not be identified as sharing my faith.

There's this voice in the back of your mind you keep hearing: "Please don't be Muslim. Please don't be Muslim." Because otherwise you know a cycle will ensue. A cycle of polarization, of vilification.

And at the very end of all that, a collective guilt many adherents of Islam feel.

So, as I went into a patient's room that day, I was saddled, or burdened, with some of these thoughts. And when I went to examine her I saw that she was completely engrossed in the television. And she was distressed. Outraged. It was quite palpable.

As I examined her she started speaking, very upset. She looked at me and said, "These foreign people only come here to kill and ruin things." And then: "Donald Trump is right. America should ban all Muslims from immigrating here."

Naturally, I was shaken.

Then she said, "I'm sorry, but your people and people who look like you make me uncomfortable." She refused to let me take care of her any further. Refused to let me provide any further medical treatment.

It was jarring. I wondered how my humanity, my sincerity, my medical training had been made irrelevant in mere seconds.


The rest at link.
47 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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I'm a Muslim doctor. My patient refused treatment because of my religion. (Original Post) geardaddy Aug 2016 OP
I see my gastroenterologist tomorrow left-of-center2012 Aug 2016 #1
That patient is a bigot and an idiot. riderinthestorm Aug 2016 #2
Oh, knock it off. The physician DID NOT IDENTIFY the patient. kestrel91316 Aug 2016 #5
how is he exposing her identity? La Lioness Priyanka Aug 2016 #7
I'm sure she'll recognize herself in this story riderinthestorm Aug 2016 #13
Guilty dogs bark first... awoke_in_2003 Aug 2016 #27
If she told her friends and family, she exposed herself. uppityperson Aug 2016 #34
Nobody is saying she should use that doctor. But - moonscape Aug 2016 #14
so the muslim doctor DonCoquixote Aug 2016 #15
you're making this a sexism thing? Skittles Aug 2016 #26
I never said he's lost any right to speak. nt riderinthestorm Aug 2016 #30
yeah but you condemned him for it DonCoquixote Aug 2016 #43
trust level DonCoquixote Aug 2016 #16
I don't "fear" male gynecologists. riderinthestorm Aug 2016 #18
I won't go to male OBGYNs either Skittles Aug 2016 #29
I don't believe he exposed her either. But I do agree that her fear... Moonwalk Aug 2016 #33
He didn't disclose personal information. Aristus Aug 2016 #35
Agreed. BUT! Do you regularly write for Wapo? riderinthestorm Aug 2016 #37
Not the point. Aristus Aug 2016 #38
I already agreed. riderinthestorm Aug 2016 #39
I suppose it's a case where one may abide by the letter of the law, instead of the spirit. Aristus Aug 2016 #40
The only bit of truth DonCoquixote Aug 2016 #44
Screw her nini Aug 2016 #47
Sincerely held religious beliefs. Iggo Aug 2016 #3
In the early days of my veterinary career (1982-1990) I frequently kestrel91316 Aug 2016 #4
DU often sees a spate of posts in the immediate aftermath of a large scale shooting LanternWaste Aug 2016 #6
For every one of her, though, are at least a dozen patients grateful for a knowledgeable doctor REP Aug 2016 #8
Did you read the whole article? librarylu Aug 2016 #36
I expressed no doubts about his integrity at all REP Aug 2016 #46
It's sad that biggots like this woman exist in the world. Hate and stupidity are burning us. onecaliberal Aug 2016 #9
I hugged my Muslim doctor yesterday SheriffBob Aug 2016 #10
I hope there are thousands more like you than like this woman ailsagirl Aug 2016 #19
It certainly did. SheriffBob Aug 2016 #42
A Muslim doctor saved my life when my appendix ruptured on a Sunday afternoon. Francis Booth Aug 2016 #20
Haters gonna Hate! Cryptoad Aug 2016 #11
A Muslim surgeon TNNurse Aug 2016 #12
An ignorant question maybe, but narnian60 Aug 2016 #17
Easy - they're the ones who are sober. Francis Booth Aug 2016 #21
That's helpful. narnian60 Aug 2016 #31
You can make a pretty educated assumption about somebody's background with a lot of names. LeftyMom Aug 2016 #23
Thank you. narnian60 Aug 2016 #28
Jalal Baig has stories in major papers about his experiences as a Muslim riderinthestorm Aug 2016 #25
"Your people and people who look like you." Which is pretty much anybody, pnwmom Aug 2016 #22
Part of the tragedy of humanity. We pass collective judgement based on the actions of the few. Francis Booth Aug 2016 #24
Then this nutcase goes home and watches Dr. Oz on the teevee Person 2713 Aug 2016 #32
I'm not a woman Sgent Aug 2016 #41
patient has a right to a doctor they feel comfortable with and also a right to be stupid dembotoz Aug 2016 #45

left-of-center2012

(34,195 posts)
1. I see my gastroenterologist tomorrow
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 05:19 PM
Aug 2016

He's a Muslim who moved here from Syria.
All I care is that he's good at what he does.

I suspect he is, as he trained at the prestigious Cleveland Clinic before moving to N.M.

 

riderinthestorm

(23,272 posts)
2. That patient is a bigot and an idiot.
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 05:37 PM
Aug 2016

That said, there's a lot of trust patients must have in their doctor and if you aren't comfortable with that doctor, then it's hard to say they must use that doctor.

Personally as a woman I only see female gynecologists. I confess I purposefully avoid male gynecologists. Am I a bigot for deliberately avoiding male gynecologists? Or is my comfort and trust level with a female doctor most important?

The author of that piece is an oncologist. His former patient was already in a very very vulnerable emotional state I guarantee you. She's already freaked out seeing an oncologist.

FWIW, I wish this doctor had been able to view her fear compassionately instead of now exposing his former patient - a cancer patient - to the world like this. It doesn't reflect well on him either and the fact he made this episode public probably proves this woman right that he wasn't the doctor for her.



 

kestrel91316

(51,666 posts)
5. Oh, knock it off. The physician DID NOT IDENTIFY the patient.
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 05:41 PM
Aug 2016

She has not been "exposed to the world". She is just letters on a computer screen.

 

riderinthestorm

(23,272 posts)
13. I'm sure she'll recognize herself in this story
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 06:54 PM
Aug 2016

If she told friends and family, they'll recognize the doctor's name and her story.

moonscape

(4,673 posts)
14. Nobody is saying she should use that doctor. But -
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 06:59 PM
Aug 2016

insulting another human being by being uncomfortable because of how they look? And 'you people?'

I have cancer and my first oncologist was someone I knew within 2 minutes I wouldn't be continuing the journey with. What you do is finish the appointment and then change doctors. What's so complicated about that?

What's disturbing starts with her ignorance (Muslim) - but then a culture which increasingly treats others so shabbily. Donald Trump is doubling down on that culture, feeding it.

Cancer is no excuse.

DonCoquixote

(13,616 posts)
15. so the muslim doctor
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 06:59 PM
Aug 2016

loses the right to speak about a problem they had, where the patient was not identified at all?

Let's be frank, if that patient was a white man as opposed to a woman, would we show the same compassion for the men if it was, let's say colon cancer?

The doctor has a right to speak about a problem, especially since it will NOT be addressed by many, especially the ones who frankly were already 20 meters deep into demonizing him already.

DonCoquixote

(13,616 posts)
43. yeah but you condemned him for it
Wed Aug 17, 2016, 10:00 AM
Aug 2016

which is the same thing and you know it.

BTW, I am a male who has female doctors, who I trust.

DonCoquixote

(13,616 posts)
16. trust level
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 07:03 PM
Aug 2016

I can see why you would fear male OBGYNs, although frankly, it is also dangerous. Simply put, there are male psychopaths and sociopaths, and females ones. The fact that a doctor is male does not mean he is any less likely to harm me, any more than a female one. Prejudices are deadly in that the give us the illusion that we have taken an extra safety measure, when truth to tell that doctor of (insert gender here) could be a menace.

 

riderinthestorm

(23,272 posts)
18. I don't "fear" male gynecologists.
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 07:17 PM
Aug 2016

I've just had kinder, gentler experiences with women who perhaps understand the situation better?

My current gynecologist just oozes empathy and compassion. Knew she was "my doctor" when I first met her for the follow up after her male obstetrician partner delivered my second girl. I'd had a long labor, pushed for 2 hours without progress. He impatiently tapped his foot, looked at his watch, sighed heavily during the whole thing.
He's an ass. She is not.

I'll even say doctor preferences can be irrational and I'm perfectly ok with that.

Skittles

(153,169 posts)
29. I won't go to male OBGYNs either
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 07:53 PM
Aug 2016

why would I, if female OBGYNs are available? She surely understands my parts better than a male doctor.

Moonwalk

(2,322 posts)
33. I don't believe he exposed her either. But I do agree that her fear...
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 08:18 PM
Aug 2016

...of cancer might have made her use this as an excuse to get out of that examination. I had a suspicious lump and when the place I went to said they needed to examine it more closely I ran away for a week. I needed to steel myself before going back and yes, finding out it was cancer. Luckily for me, I survived it and I'm now free of it, but I totally understand that kind of fear.

Which isn't to say that the woman might not have been completely honest here about her fear and bias. But it is possible that if she'd been there about a sore throat (and he was an ear-nose-and-throat doctor) she might not have said that or bolted. There is no knowing unless, maybe a year or so from now, she comes forward and says, "I was terrified of my diagnosis and used this to run away," or "I was wrong to have been afraid of him just because of he was Muslim." Or both.

It really doesn't matter. What does matter is that Trump has made it easy for someone to say that to a good, honest, innocent person. And that's wrong. He'd made America a harder place for them to live in, to work in, to survive in, to get justice in. And that is VERY wrong. And he has made it harder for them to deal with their own feelings about terrorists who, unfortunately, share their religion.

Which is fucked up. If he'd been a white male Christian doctor, and the bombers had been white male Christians blowing up, say, a cafe because they felt it went against the Bible, that woman would not have run from the room with the excuse that "You white men can't be trusted!" She'd have said, "We need better mental health care!" Why should White Christains be able to dismiss terrorists who share their race, gender, religion as being unrelated to them? Why should they be allowed to feel no guilt, no fear of being persecuted for such crimes, yet every other minority race and religion must, according to them, bear the guilt of every other one of their members who commits crimes? This is what is most wrong and what most needs to change.

Aristus

(66,388 posts)
35. He didn't disclose personal information.
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 09:58 PM
Aug 2016

He's free to talk about patient experiences all he wants, as long as he doesn't break HIPAA. And he didn't.

Anyway, his flighty little racist goombah of a patient chose to behave the way she did. If somehow she were to recognize herself in her doctor's story, she can always choose to be ashamed of herself.

I talk about patient experiences here on DU. I never mention names or dates of birth.

 

riderinthestorm

(23,272 posts)
37. Agreed. BUT! Do you regularly write for Wapo?
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 10:32 PM
Aug 2016

The Guardian? NYTimes? Salon?

That's international level exposure. Thats Jalal Baig.

When my husband was diagnosed with Stage 4, Grade 4 lymphoma, we saw 3 different oncology doctors to figure out compatibility. Googled all of them.

Our circle of fellow lymphoma support group patients followed every bit of minutiae of that search, throwing in anecdotes, personal info and utterly ridiculous conspiracy shit about every doctor.

You know that's true or I doubt you're a PA...

That said, he's fully within his rights to take this patients reaction public on an international stage, oh so public.

But I have the right to protest that finding his (now ex) patient won't be hard to do.

Aristus

(66,388 posts)
38. Not the point.
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 10:36 PM
Aug 2016

He didn't disclose personal identifiers. He's clear.

I don't care if you believe I'm a PA or not. Your disbelief wouldn't change anything.

 

riderinthestorm

(23,272 posts)
39. I already agreed.
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 10:45 PM
Aug 2016

And for the record I also believe you're a PA.

That said, I'm sure this patient told many folks she was seeing Dr. Jalal Baiz since she'd googled him and saw him well published. I know I did in a similar circumstance with my husband. I know I'm not special.

Dr Baiz didn't have to disclose personal identifiers in this case. She's an outlier. She's the identifier.

If you had a patient storm off, refusing to see you because you were a male Vet. Made a scene. Lots of people would have witnessed that. If that patient went home and talked the episode up (which I presume they did - guessing they're the theatrical type), this wouldn't be some small affair without wider implications in your community of folks that "know" and understand...



Aristus

(66,388 posts)
40. I suppose it's a case where one may abide by the letter of the law, instead of the spirit.
Wed Aug 17, 2016, 12:06 AM
Aug 2016

When maintaining a license, such as to practice medicine, the letter of the law is more important.

DonCoquixote

(13,616 posts)
44. The only bit of truth
Wed Aug 17, 2016, 10:06 AM
Aug 2016

is that, where this Islamic doctor me, I would have written this anonymously.

That being said, where the HELL did this woman get the right to interject islam into this? Frankly, while I know many white women would NEVER, EVER do this, I do get tired of the conservative white female that gets to act like that scary brown male is going to do something to her, hit the fainting couch and get sympathy, as the same white male posse she was badmouthing behind their backs all of a sudden get to be her paladins while the evil brown male is punished.

nini

(16,672 posts)
47. Screw her
Wed Aug 17, 2016, 12:24 PM
Aug 2016

Hate is hate and isn't created by fear of her diagnosis.

He is the victim here - not her and it's by her own choosing to be a jerk - sick or not she is wrong.

 

kestrel91316

(51,666 posts)
4. In the early days of my veterinary career (1982-1990) I frequently
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 05:39 PM
Aug 2016

got rejected by clients merely because of my gender. Eventually word got out that women were dominating vet school admissions and those pigs shut the hell up.

Women surpassed 50% of practicing veterinarians at least 5 years ago. It's been a very long time since anybody told me they wanted "the MAN doctor" instead of me. Helps that I started my own practice 25 years ago.

 

LanternWaste

(37,748 posts)
6. DU often sees a spate of posts in the immediate aftermath of a large scale shooting
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 06:06 PM
Aug 2016

DU often sees a spate of posts in the immediate and murky aftermath of a large scale shooting speculating on culture and/or religion of shooters.

Almost as often is the sentiment "look at all these idiots hoping it's not an act inspired by the dirty Muslim faith. In fact, they're hoping it's white people!!!..."

Upon reading (or more accurately, feeling) these sentiments, remember this precise phrase: '"Please don't be Muslim. Please don't be Muslim." Because otherwise you know a cycle will ensue. A cycle of polarization, of vilification."'

Remember that. Remember that phrase because when a man-made tragedy is orchestrated by a white individual, we're assured time after time that it's simply a statistical aberration, a one-off, a lone wolf, a mentally disturbed person acting alone.

When that same act is perpetrated by a member of a minority demographic, well... it's a culture war, it's terrorism, it's "all of them against all of us," "they're thugs and bandits and terrorists and (insert dog-whistle for plausible deniability here)!!!"

That cycle of polarization and vilification of a people will happen... but only if it's perpetrated by a minority member, otherwise it's "just some crazy guy from Flori-Duh or Tex-Ass..."

Every time.

REP

(21,691 posts)
8. For every one of her, though, are at least a dozen patients grateful for a knowledgeable doctor
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 06:29 PM
Aug 2016

who cares about the well being of their patients.

As someone else mentioned, this patient may have been scared just by having to deal with her cancer - I know I was - and was lashing out at something and someone. It doesn't excuse it, but I'm willing to give such people in those circumstances a bit of benefit of doubt. It's also possible she's just a horrid person - a horrid person with cancer. What worse can we do to her with our scorn?

This doctor, who is probably very skilled and cares about his patients, did not deserve this treatment, but I hope he considers the source and realize it was truly more about her (whether it be fear of her illnes or just stupidity) than about him or even Muslims.

librarylu

(503 posts)
36. Did you read the whole article?
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 10:17 PM
Aug 2016

"But medicine is something far greater than one patient experience that went awry.

The teachings of my faith to practice mutual respect and tolerance — and, of course, the Hippocratic Oath — compel me to continue to do my work with dignity, despite these types of interactions.

That's why the next day, when I visited the same patient's door, I didn't hesitate to knock."

[emphasis mine]

REP

(21,691 posts)
46. I expressed no doubts about his integrity at all
Wed Aug 17, 2016, 12:18 PM
Aug 2016

Only speculated that perhaps she was misplacing her fear of being treated for cancer inappropriately (or that she was simply a terrible person with cancer). His integrity was not in question. Doctors treat rapists, murderers, and other hideous people; treating a loud mouthed idiot is unfortunately part of the job.

The main point is her statements say much about her, and nothing about the doctor or even other Muslims.

SheriffBob

(552 posts)
10. I hugged my Muslim doctor yesterday
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 06:37 PM
Aug 2016

I was diagnosed with colon cancer and a blockage one year ago.

I recently had a cat scan and it revealed that my cancer was gone.

I believe he saved my life and I love him.

He is one of the nicest person I have ever known.

ailsagirl

(22,897 posts)
19. I hope there are thousands more like you than like this woman
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 07:19 PM
Aug 2016

I just don't understand that mentality-- I bet she's a drumpf supporter

By the way (and very importantly), congratulations on the results of your cat scan!! That and the hug must have made your doctor's day!!


Francis Booth

(162 posts)
20. A Muslim doctor saved my life when my appendix ruptured on a Sunday afternoon.
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 07:25 PM
Aug 2016

He was a very warm and caring surgeon. His name was Doctor Islam, no less.

After a few days of recovery, he stopped by my hospital room to visit. I gave him a big hug.

TNNurse

(6,927 posts)
12. A Muslim surgeon
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 06:51 PM
Aug 2016

removed my gallbladder and placed and removed my IV port for chemotherapy. I would trust him with anything, he is a wonderful,decent human being. As a nurse I worked with several Muslim intensivists (who care for you in ICU when you are real damn sick) who were exceptionally good and were often working while worrying about family in Syria. I have great respect for them.

As to the patient being an oncology patient and that making her more emotional and vulnerable feeling, I understand that having been an oncology patient. But if she trusted him initially, someone influenced to change that trust and I would bet that was Trump.

LeftyMom

(49,212 posts)
23. You can make a pretty educated assumption about somebody's background with a lot of names.
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 07:40 PM
Aug 2016

If you run into somebody named Dr. Ibrahim Mohammed you can make a pretty safe bet that he's at least from a muslim background, whether or not he's practicing. And then you can make regional or factional assumptions based on other names: Dr. El Bey's origins can be narrowed down past a particular religious slant to maybe three BART stops.

A LOT of religions have distinctive naming conventions or names from their scriptures nobody else uses: if you meet somebody named Nephi Smith that person's almost certainly from a Mormon background, but so is somebody whose first name is their mom and dad's first names jammed together, or a name that sounds like it's from the 1880s.

 

riderinthestorm

(23,272 posts)
25. Jalal Baig has stories in major papers about his experiences as a Muslim
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 07:46 PM
Aug 2016

I'm guessing it came up in a Google search as it did for me.

When researching the oncology doctors for my husband, we googled info about all of them. I don't think that's uncommon these days.

pnwmom

(108,980 posts)
22. "Your people and people who look like you." Which is pretty much anybody,
Tue Aug 16, 2016, 07:31 PM
Aug 2016

since a Muslim can be of any race.

Sgent

(5,857 posts)
41. I'm not a woman
Wed Aug 17, 2016, 01:24 AM
Aug 2016

but would be very careful about seeing a Catholic OB/GYN for pregnancy or going to a Catholic Hospital. They have a history of putting the mother's life at danger to save a fetus.

dembotoz

(16,808 posts)
45. patient has a right to a doctor they feel comfortable with and also a right to be stupid
Wed Aug 17, 2016, 10:11 AM
Aug 2016

unless ofcoarse you have and hmo

in that case you are just fucked

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