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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWhat is it with self-important young men and libertarianism?
I offer an in-depth writing mentorship program with a local theatre collective. I will take on a student after I've reviewed a writing sample. I spend a lot of time reading and critiquing work, so I have to be choosy about who I take on. I'm limited to about 10 students. I don't get paid for this.
Several of the participants are young men (20s) who are actors, writers, and would-be directors. Basically, young white, straight, cisgender men from privileged backgrounds. Despite their professed willingness to hone their craft, which is why they take the class in the first place, these young men are astonishingly resistant to criticism of any kind. One dissed me and withdrew after I told him he had to spell check his own work; that wasn't my job.
Instead of dialogue, what I'm getting is incredible pushback. Their arrogance and ego appear to know no bounds. Any person who might be construed as an authority figure, is to be vigorously opposed on principle. (And I am the least authoritarian person you are ever likely to meet). Heaven forfend I call out a cliche in someone's magnum opus. That makes me an agent of oppression, and a (still trying to wrap my head around this), a "common liberal."
I try to keep politics out of the proceedings, but I'm starting to wonder if alt-right or MGTOW or some other insidious misogyny is infecting these kids. I also get lectured about various conspiracy theories (yawn), and the "authoritarian left." What are these kids reading? And what makes them think they need to be mansplaining it to a woman old enough to be their mother, and a successful professional to boot?
The women and the older men are wonderful to work with and clearly committed to the program. But these young men are dragging down the rest with their sanctimony.
What is with these angry young men? Ye gods, I hope they outgrow it, because they have thoroughly exhausted my patience. The group always needs young actors for readings, but I think I'm going to have to be a lot more selective in my choice of who I accept as a student. I am past the point of giving a fuck, and one of these kids is going to get it right in his privileged ear one of these days.
JHan
(10,173 posts)I went through a libertarian phase myself (I'm 22, not white and not male) and quickly grew out of it when I realised Libertarians talk a good game but never take responsibility for the outcomes (and even ignore the outcomes) of their ridiculous ideas.
Generally though, young people are kinda full of it and very idealistic - this is true with every generation lol.
jehop61
(1,735 posts)Some have the same attitude you describe. Could it be because they've always been told "good job"? Failure was unacceptable and they aren't prepared for the cold, cruel world.
lapislzi
(5,762 posts)She's capable, responsible, focused, and takes zero crap from these types. She would eat their lunch in a heartbeat.
To paraphrase the housekeeper from "It's a Wonderful Life,"...all children should be girls. (tongue firmly in cheek...mostly)
jehop61
(1,735 posts)Three raised with discipline are super, three raised with the attitude of do whatever you want and apologize later, are angry and seem mad at the world and are strong Trump supporters. Puzzling and sad.
MineralMan
(146,333 posts)Yes, a lot of young guys have libertarian, me-first tendencies. They always have. If they aren't interested in direction from anyone, don't bother with them. They'll learn, eventually, or at least some of them will.
A writer who bristles at being told he needs to spell-check is going to fail miserably. I've been a full-time professional writer since 1974. I owe a good deal of my success to taking direction from anyone willing to offer it to me. If someone told me I had a problem with something in my writing, I worked to rid myself of that problem.
I've also taught commercial writing to others. I've met many who could not bear to have anyone suggest improvements in their work. Those people are doomed to failure. It is those who actively seek advice and use that advice to improve their writing who succeed. It's very simple.
So, shrug off all those who think they have already reached their pinnacle. They're probably right, and their pinnacle won't bring them success. Focus on the ones who take advice to heart and demonstrate that with improvements in their writing. They're on the right path.
lapislzi
(5,762 posts)I will hear and evaluate criticism from any source. I need to hear it. It makes me a better writer--and I've been writing professionally for my entire adult life, albeit not very lucratively, but that's a different story.
Here's an example of what I have to deal with. Ambitious kid makes a short film. I praise his effort. Making a film is not so easy. It's actually a reasonably good first film. Then, I point out an incident that takes me out of the film, that is inconsistent with the story line and should be edited for consistency and flow. The response? "Well, I like it. You're too conventionally shackled to the narrative structure. Kubrick used this device."
I have news for you, kid. You are no Stanley Kubrick, not now, and probably not ever.
Oh, they love their big words.
MineralMan
(146,333 posts)However, talent alone isn't enough. Refinement of the expression of talent is the key to success. Your example is a good one, I think. The young filmmaker demonstrated talent in that early film. You praised that talent, but also pointed out an area that caused a problem with the audience's appreciation of the film. That was rejected by the young, talented person. Now, perhaps that young person will end up taking your advice, despite the immediate rejection. If so, then, perhaps the next film won't have that particular flaw.
My wife and I are film fans. She mentioned the concept of a "perfect film" one time and explained it to me. Now, we often discuss films using that criteria. A perfect film needn't be a particularly meaningful film. It simply has to fully engage the audience, be consistent in itself, and have no serious flaws that interfere with the experience of viewing it. It has to capture your attention and hold it from the beginning to the end and do what it intended to do. "Clueless" is such a film, despite its lightweight nature. So is "The Pawnbroker." We spend a good bit of time discussing films we see, but they're always measured by that standard.
We sometimes disagree in our judgment about individual films, and that's really fun. For example, "The Umbrellas of Cherbourg," in its original French version is one of my "perfect films." My wife disagrees, because she was put off by a jazz opera in French, a language she doesn't understand well enough, so she is interrupted by the subtitles.
lapislzi
(5,762 posts)Interestingly, as a writer, I zero in on the writing and internal consistency, while my husband, who's a sound engineer, is very picky about details both visual and audio--audio more so, for obvious reasons. He positively ruined "Dirty Dancing" for me because of the finale musical number being completely out of character with the film's sensibility. He's right, of course, but I haven't quite forgiven him for that. I can no longer suspend my disbelief when watching that film, although I still enjoy it.
One film that he and I both agree is gets a perfect score is "Moonstruck." There is not a word out of place or a wasted frame of film. I've read the "original" original screenplay, and Shanley was very smart to let the director cut what he cut and where he cut it.
I mean "serious" films, of course. Everyone knows that "Airplane" is the best movie ever. No consistency issues, great performances.
meadowlark5
(2,795 posts)I was just remembering the other day how all of my guy friends and acquaintances all loved Atlas Shrugged and Ayn Rand in general
in college. But at least a couple that I do still see on FB are not libertarian but more left leaning.
Maybe it's just the peak of testosterone and they're feeling alpha maleish. I think they get humbled when they hit the real working world. Of course, some don't.
Sorry they're making this so unpleasant for you.
jmg257
(11,996 posts)If millennials are self-absorbed little monsters who expect the world to come to them and for their parents to clean up their rooms well into their 20s, weve got no one to blame but ourselves especially the moms and dads among us.
Indeed, the same poll documents the ridiculous level of kid-coddling that has now become the new normal.
...
But whatever the reasons for our insistence that we childproof the world around us, this way madness lies. From King Lear to Mildred Pierce, classic literature (and basic common sense) suggests that coddling kids is no way to raise thriving, much less grateful, offspring. Indeed, quite the opposite. And with 58% of millennials calling themselves entitled and more than 70% saying they are selfish, older Americans may soon be learning that lesson the hard way."
http://time.com/3154186/millennials-selfish-entitled-helicopter-parenting/
cyclonefence
(4,483 posts)lapislzi
(5,762 posts)That gets a laugh from the older crowd. The kids just stare at me like I've sprouted antlers. What does art have to do with life, anyway?! Ha!
cyclonefence
(4,483 posts)my father was a newspaper editor and the Neverending Story was that know-it-all snots fresh from journalism school took about a month of seeing what life was really like to calm down and grow up. Nothing like sending a young reporter bursting with Ayn Rand out to interview the survivors of a mine cave-in to rid them of their belief in self-determination.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)My wife teaches college classes at a community college and another local university. The biggest problem she has is with students protesting their bad grades despite the fact that they never did their homework, didn't come to class, failed their exams, etc. They feel they deserve a passing grade by virtue of enrolling in the class.
Also, quite often there is sexism and racism involved; my wife is black, and though very highly educated, some young white men will not accept her authority. They do this at their peril.
Old Vet
(2,001 posts)She tells me the same things you mentioned, How someone can complain about failing and not do the work. There is definitely a sense of entitlement in this generation, Personally I think its bad up-bringing.
mopinko
(70,243 posts)premised on the ridiculous notion that we are stronger alone.
please knock these assholes down a peg. they need it more than they know.
SharonClark
(10,014 posts)and not the little fishes.
Initech
(100,105 posts)And I think its' because they're too scared to cross over to one side over the other. I live in Southern California which is mostly known for being a liberal blue area. But I have friends who for some reason or another don't want to admit that they're full on liberal, or full on conservative.
OriginalGeek
(12,132 posts)in my teens. I got better.
LeftInTX
(25,567 posts)Drug laws
Privacy issues
American isolation issues
They like that Ron Paul was against the "war on drugs". They tend to be more concerned about online privacy than other law abiding groups. They don't want the US to be part of foreign wars, such as Iraq.
RobinA
(9,894 posts)who is going through this. He is not entitled, but he's arrogant and Libertarian. I keep telling myself that he hasn't lived long enough to develop any nuance yet.. Plus, the computer world they live in strengthens this mindset, because it contains a lot of white boy winger nonsense. I've heard that "authoritarian left" nonsense. And you can't really discuss anything with them because they attack broad labels instead of ideas. It's never, "Your idea is wrong because..." It's "That idea comes from the liberal media, so it is wrong." Unfortunately, education has failed them and they can't argue ideas.
dawg
(10,624 posts)Only with experience did I realize that so much in life is beyond our control, and that good people who try hard still end up needing help all the time.