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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsWacko anti-Sharia protester is only familiar with one amendment in the Bill of Rights.
Trump-supporting anti-Sharia protesters are trying to make a big deal out of a threat that doesn't even exist. The First Amendment forbids Sharia law, Christian law, Jewish law, or law based upon any other religion from taking hold in the USA, and as we know, the strongest threat to that constitutional principle comes from right-wingers constantly attempting to enforce Christianity.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/religion/rallies-against-islamic-law-draw-counter-protests-across-us/2017/06/10/8d14a80e-4e16-11e7-987c-42ab5745db2e_story.html
But here's the funny part. The only word a right-winger thinks of in connection with "amendment" is "second":
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I dont believe Islam can peacefully co-exist with the Constitution, said Seattle anti-Shariah demonstrator Aaron Bassford, 29. Im not going to tell them they can come here and take away my Second Amendment right. We need unity in this country under no ideology and no banner except the Constitution of the United States of America.
That's a direct copy and paste of the Washington Post article. As I was writing this up, the article was changed.
luvMIdog
(2,533 posts)underpants
(182,904 posts)Nobody pays attention to the Third Amendment.
A HERETIC I AM
(24,380 posts)can not name or even indicate in any way what the 3rd refers to.
It is also, as a point of interest, the LEAST litigated in the Supreme Court.
I propose using it as a way to keep police officers off your property. They are, after all, an occupying force.
underpants
(182,904 posts)The British Army took over residences and holdings all the time. That's why it was in there. Not having a standing Army (though it's considered a standing Army now) was another control. The combination of the 3rd and lack of a standing Army provide the context for the whole 2nd Amendment and the writers' intent.
But that's just my opinion.
A HERETIC I AM
(24,380 posts)And that point you bring up seems lost on most advocates of the 2nd. Hell, the commonplace nature of soldiers commandeering private residences ("Right! The Colonel lives here now, so BUGGER OFF!" was such that they put that prohibition in before the right to be secure in your papers and effects and to be free of unreasonable searches and seizures.
This point - the context - is of utmost importance, in my mind. The misinterpretation, in my opinion, the DC vs Heller decision gave to the possession of firearms by individuals belies the true intent of the first 3 amendments when looked at together, in context and from the point of view of the late 1700's in New England.
underpants
(182,904 posts)As I remember it the SCOTUS had repeatedly (since the 30's) said there was no individual right.
I could easily be wrong.
BTW - love this conversation
A HERETIC I AM
(24,380 posts)(BTW, I apologize for the delays in responding, as I am working nights and don't do a whole lot of DU reading while driving!)
https://www.cga.ct.gov/2008/rpt/2008-R-0578.htm
##"In Heller, the U.S. Supreme Court answered a long-standing constitutional question about whether the right to keep and bear arms is an individual right unconnected to service in the militia or a collective right that applies only to state-regulated militias.(Other bolding and emphasis mine, if and when the Admins ever turn the HTML back on! - AHIA)
By a five to four margin, the Court held that the Second Amendment protects an individual right to possess firearms for lawful use, such as self-defense, in the home (emphasis ours - in original-AHIA). Accordingly, it struck down as unconstitutional provisions of a D.C. law that (1) effectively banned possession of handguns by non law enforcement officials and (2) required lawfully owned firearms to be kept unloaded, disassembled, or locked when not located at a business place or being used for lawful recreational activities.
According to the Court, the ban on handgun possession in the home amounted to a prohibition on an entire class of 'arms' that Americans overwhelmingly choose for the lawful purpose of self-defense. Similarly, the requirement that any firearm in a home be disassembled or locked made it impossible for citizens to use arms for the core lawful purpose of self-defense. These laws were unconstitutional under any of the standards of scrutiny the Court has applied to enumerated constitutional rights. But the Court did not cite a specific standard in making its determination, and it rejected the interest-balancing standard; proposed by Justice Breyer, and a rational basis standard.
The Second Amendment right is not absolute and a wide range of gun control laws remain presumptively lawful, according to the Court. These include laws that (1) prohibit carrying concealed weapons, (2) prohibit gun possession by felons or the mentally retarded, (3) prohibit carrying firearms in sensitive places such as schools and government buildings, (4) impose conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms, (5) prohibit dangerous and unusual weapons, and (6) regulate firearm storage to prevent accidents. Justice Scalia wrote the majority opinion. He was joined by Justices Alito, Kennedy, Roberts, and Thomas.
Justices Stevens and Breyer filed separate dissenting opinions. Stevens asserts that the Second Amendment (1) protects the individual right to bear arms only in the context of military service and (2) does not limit government's authority to regulate civilian use or possession of firearms. He describes the majority's individual-right holding as strained and unpersuasive; its conclusion, overwrought and novel. Stevens was joined in his dissent by Justices Breyer, Ginsberg, and Souter.
In his dissent, Breyer argues that even if the Second Amendment, in addition to militia-related purposes, protects an individual's right of self-defense, that assumption should be the beginning of the constitutional inquiry, not the end. Breyer contends that there are no purely logical or conceptual ways to determine the constitutionality of gun control laws, such as the District's law. Thus, a sounder approach would be a balancing test that focuses on practicalities to determine what gun control laws would be consistent with the amendment even if it is interpreted as protecting a wholly separate interest in individual self-defense. Breyer concludes that under a balancing test that takes into account the extensive evidence of gun crime and gun violence in urban areas, the District's gun law would be constitutionally permissible. Breyer was joined in his dissent by Justices Ginsberg, Souter, and Stevens."##
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It always seemed to me that the intent of the wording the 2nd was that all households could and likely should keep a musket near the door, so that when a rider came by shouting "TO ARMS!" the gun was readily at hand such that the individuals could grab them and proceed to a mustering point to join up with that "Well Regulated Militia". Another point that also needs to be considered is that many of those attending the Constitutional Congress were AGAINST the idea of having a standing army, so the idea of having that musket ready to go, coupled with the "Well Regulated" portion meant that the new states could bring up an armed force directly from the civilian population in very short order.
BTW and as a side note, the next time you get into an argument with someone who is a "strict constitutionalist" ask them if they are then willing to get rid of the Air Force and the Army, as neither of those is mentioned in the constitution as being permanent (The Air Force for obvious reasons). Only the Navy is mentioned as a permanent military force.
I have a book on the First Amendment titled "Why the Religious Right is Wrong on Separation of Church and State" that delves into the numerous previous drafts and wordings of that portion of the Bill of Rights. The framers changed a word here, a sentence there, a comma here, etc. A BUNCH OF TIMES. I can't help but think they did the same with all of them, the 2nd included.
underpants
(182,904 posts)No prob on the delay.
In "Fiasco" Thomas Ricks mentions that the constitutional status of the Navy vs Army is a running theme. I asked someone I know who has worked in the Pentagon and they confirmed that the Navy officers drop this card all the time.
marylandblue
(12,344 posts)In my view, it's the mist important article today.
oberliner
(58,724 posts)He was just listing out numbers, Farenthold said. I think he was confusing Articles and Amendments. Remember, this guy doesnt speak from a TelePrompter. He speaks from the heart.
underpants
(182,904 posts)Yes article 12. Jeeebus.
Doreen
(11,686 posts)Am I missing something?
JHB
(37,162 posts)What you need to do is axe-grind for at least a decade, then snort the resulting powder.
You will experience visions that will make it all clear to you.
Initech
(100,105 posts)Imagine if people knew what they were talking about when it comes to our government. Wouldn't that be great?
DefenseLawyer
(11,101 posts)These men are cowards.
Solly Mack
(90,787 posts)smh
oberliner
(58,724 posts)You'd think people would look at #1 before moving on to #2.