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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsPolice: Williams legally entered intersection before crash
http://www.msn.com/en-us/sports/tennis/police-williams-legally-entered-intersection-before-crash/ar-BBDYf5Y?li=BBnb7Kz<snip>
FORT LAUDERDALE, Fla. (AP) -- Tennis star Venus Williams legally entered an intersection but was cut off by another car, setting off a chain of events that seconds later resulted in a fatal crash with a third car, police say video released Friday shows.
The video, taken by a security camera, shows Williams heading north as she stops her 2010 Toyota Sequoia SUV at a stoplight behind a white car as she exits her Palm Beach Gardens neighborhood shortly after 1 p.m. June 9.
When the light turns green, the white car turns left onto a six-lane, heavily traveled boulevard, but Williams heads straight. A dark colored sedan turns left in front of her, causing her to stop.
--------------------------------
Ah well.
oasis
(49,388 posts)malaise
(269,026 posts)Maybe now the 'grifting' lawyer will back off.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)CNN.
How do you miss all these stories?
She's been exonerated. Not that she did anything wrong to begin with.
Venus is gonna be just fine.
Are_grits_groceries
(17,111 posts)Venus was found to be at fault by the police. They found a security tape from some building that captured the accident and gave them a clear view of what happened. They revised their position.
The OP has kept up with the storyline. This was posted because of the change. The change is important in light of the lawsuit.
Venus will be fine. However, she has clearly been bothered by the accident and the fact she was at fault thus helping to cause a death.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Daily. Hourly.
Any tennis fan has heard nothing but.
Somehow I doubt the OP would care if this story involved say, Wozniaki or any other random player.
There are enough reasons for real outrage in the world without trying to gin up a fake one.
wryter2000
(46,051 posts)And the initial version of what happened won't help
malaise
(269,026 posts)erpowers
(9,350 posts)This was the second or third story on tonight's CBS Evening News. It was also promoted in the show opening.
cwydro
(51,308 posts)Smh.
TexasProgresive
(12,157 posts)That she entered the intersection on a green light and was stopped. Then she proceeded and hit the other car. The other car, in my opinion, should not have moved into the intersection as Williams' car was still in the intersection.
malaise
(269,026 posts)Glad they went public with the correction - the family lawyer was pushing an aggressive 'get money' line.
LisaL
(44,973 posts)green. And William's wasn't.
malaise
(269,026 posts)You seem way too eager to blame Venus.
LisaL
(44,973 posts)When that car had the right of way because it had a green light.
writes3000
(4,734 posts)As anyone should with a recently turned light, then the accident might not have happened. As it stands, Venus entered the intersection when her light was green. She avoided an accident when a driver made a turn in front of her, causing her to slow down. Since Venus was still in the intersection, she needed to complete her turn to get out of the intersection. Anyone racing into that intersection without looking ahead is asking for trouble.
I'm glad the police rescinded their statement placing blame on Venus. Its an accident and she was trying to drive responsibly the whole time.
NutmegYankee
(16,199 posts)Just because the light is green doesn't make it legal to smash into a car stuck in the intersection. She is responsible for her husbands death.
LisaL
(44,973 posts)NutmegYankee
(16,199 posts)It is basic traffic law to yield to traffic still in the intersection.
Demsrule86
(68,582 posts)She had the right of way damn it and that car better move...only it couldn't.
mainer
(12,022 posts)You don't have the right to hit another car that's still in the intersection. That's just crazy that anyone thinks it's OK to just plow ahead into another car "because my light just turned GREEN!"
That's the truth
we can do it
(12,189 posts)Too many terrible drivers want to blame everyone else and cash in.
phylny
(8,380 posts)When my light turns green, before I proceed, not only do I look AHEAD of me to see that it's clear, but I look to the left and right to make sure no one is running their red light.
The only reason anyone is suing is because they see it as easy money.
LiberalFighter
(50,942 posts)tammywammy
(26,582 posts)When the light turns green you need to pause and check both directions before proceeding - especially since so many run red lights (though that wasn't the case for Venus).
amuse bouche
(3,657 posts)58Sunliner
(4,386 posts)"No vehicle is to enter an intersection until it is safe to do so"
(No matter if they have a green light or not)
Vehicle code 101.
Based on the video, Ms Williams is in the clear.
elleng
(130,956 posts)It's awful that she's as traumatized as she is.
JI7
(89,251 posts)She couldn't even defend herself from what was clearly not her fault.
malaise
(269,026 posts)told me all I needed to know. She was going at 5mph when her car was struck.
rufus dog
(8,419 posts)Had she not yielded to the original car she would not have been at fault yet caused (actually not avoided) a accident?
After that point it appears she was in a no win situation.
malaise
(269,026 posts)but it clearly wasn't her fault - give thanks for cameras because someone was planning to cash in big time.
rufus dog
(8,419 posts)She yielded to an offending driver to avoid an accident. At that point she was stuck. She proceeded and the car that hit her didn't assess the situation. It appears her other option was to just sit there. Not a good option, she could cause an accident by doing that. Thus my comment that she was in a no win situation. The vast majority of drivers would have made the same decision as Venus.
I'm glad the video exists to show she was innocent.
malaise
(269,026 posts)The driver who hit her was a senior citizen who may have panicked rather than assess the situation.
rufus dog
(8,419 posts)In newer areas (25+ years) of CA it is all green turn arrows with a delay then oncoming traffic gets a green. Seeing an accident on left hand turns is a rarity. I grew up in AZ with no arrows, couldn't drive across the city without seeing a left hand turn accident. In the FL case it sounds like they have arrows and also and immediate green for oncoming, so no time to clear the intersection.
I just don't get the time savings of seconds for the risk of major accidents.
nolabear
(41,984 posts)She's going to pay for it forever. I hope they leave her alone.
Lotusflower70
(3,077 posts)Last edited Fri Jul 7, 2017, 10:35 PM - Edit history (1)
They won't leave her alone. She is a successful black woman and has been the target of a lot of hate, just like her sister. I feel really bad for her because even though it wasn't her fault, a life was lost. Such a tragedy.
malaise
(269,026 posts)money
nolabear
(41,984 posts)I don't doubt she is only one of many people unfairly harassed. I hate like hell that it's that way.
NutmegYankee
(16,199 posts)He'd be alive if he had used the the seat belt. This was a completely survivable accident, even with the wife's irresponsible decision to hit a car in the intersection that wasn't clear at a high rate of speed.
I haven't seen anything suggesting the man wasn't wearing his seat belt.
NutmegYankee
(16,199 posts)Use Google.
LisaL
(44,973 posts)"The Barsons and Williams were all wearing seat belts at the time of the crash, according to the police report."
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/local/venus-williams-crash-what-caused-other-traffic-intersection/FX5rL4yNnUNubYuptU3X4M/
malaise
(269,026 posts)I don't drive though our gate without my seat belt
malaise
(269,026 posts)dash cameras.
amuse bouche
(3,657 posts)cannabis_flower
(3,764 posts)A few days ago I had a driver who was honking at me because I didn't turn fast enough for him. So he sped past me, swooped in front of me, slammed on the brakes and stopped. If I had rear ended him, it would be presumed to be my fault - unless I had a dash cam that showed that the other driver had deliberately caused the accident.
spanone
(135,843 posts)K&R....
malaise
(269,026 posts)Rollo
(2,559 posts)And it wouldn't be the first time that a traffic collision police report came to exactly the opposite conclusion from the truth.
I know from personal (and painful) experience.
In Russia, just about everyone has a dash cam in their car. Might be a good idea here, too.
malaise
(269,026 posts)Sorry about your experience
heather blossom
(174 posts)Here's my opinion for what it is worth, Family's lawyer was hoping to cash in fast because he thought Venus would want to avoid litigation and bad publicity.
My question- was the deceased wearing his seat? He sustained head injuries, air bag should prevent that.
The plaintiff driver had the last clear chance to avoid the accident in my opinion.
Very very sad situation. My sympathy goes out to the family and to Venus.
malaise
(269,026 posts)until they allowed the lawyer to try and seize her car. Thankfully the court stopped that.
erpowers
(9,350 posts)The way I heard the story I thought on its face the other person was wrong. First, I always thought if you hit someone from the rear or from the side you were automatically wrong in that if you had been paying attention and keeping a safe distance you would not have ended up in the accident. Second, Venus Williams entered the intersection on a green light, but was not able to proceed across until the light had already turned red. Even though the light had turned red I thought Williams was still in the right in that she was already in the intersection and the other car could have and should have stopped.
malaise
(269,026 posts)Some intersections have clear rules about being at fault if caught in them so I'm not sure about that part.
I just couldn't figure out how she ended up being wrong when the light was clearly green when she entered.
I hope both sisters install dashboard cameras.
LisaL
(44,973 posts)malaise
(269,026 posts)Catherine Vincent
(34,490 posts)I don't understand why the lady was driving fast while the other cars to the left of her had barely taken off. Still sad that the man died of his injuries. Sorry for their loss.
malaise
(269,026 posts)Her light could not have been green for that long. How was he injured so badly?
LisaL
(44,973 posts)while other cars stopped at the light.
malaise
(269,026 posts)amuse bouche
(3,657 posts)LiberalFighter
(50,942 posts)tblue37
(65,393 posts)she did what one SHOULD do, which is go slowly enough to recognize and adjust for the possibility of another car's crossing in front of her before proceeding to complete her turn.
Barson raced through the green light that had just turned from red and was moving too fast to take the situation into consideration and adjust for the fact that VW had gotten stuck in the intersection because another car had cut her off as she was completing her maneuver.
The damage to VW's car is evidence of being hit at some speed.
Obviously Barson timed her approach to the light just so, in order to not have to slow down or stop. (When there is no traffic, I sometimes do that, too.) She was concentrating on doing that, not on whether another car might be stuck in the intersection when the light turned just because someone else had blocked the other driver from clearing the intersection right away.
Mrs. Barson is the person mainly responsible for the accident and thus for her husband's death, but she can't bear to believe that, so she needs to believe that it is all VW's fault and that, as Barson says, VW should "be held responsible."
And I am sure the fact that VW has deep pockets enters into Barson's lawyer's consideration and advice, too, even if Barson's own motivation is more about her need to hold someone else responsible for causing her husband's death.
LisaL
(44,973 posts)Couldn't it be that Barson was just driving, the light turned green and Barson proceeded as one would when the light is green?
Nobody has said that Barson was at fault since she did have the right of way at the time of the collision.
tblue37
(65,393 posts)is pretty clear.
Princess Turandot
(4,787 posts)The video appears to be from a private security camera located at a guardhouse of some kind just south of the intersection.
The events take place at the top of the image, but after the original video plays, at about 48 seconds in, they zoom in to show the area around the intersection.
VW was driving north and was already in the intersection when a dark colored car on the other side of the intersection (in the southbound lane of the road that she was on) made a left turn in front of her. She waits to let it go through, and a few seconds later, begins moving north again, and is hit by the Barson's car driving west through the intersection.
The dark car making the turn passes in front of the Barsons' car, which begins to move almost immediately after it passes. Perhaps the turning car distracted Barson, who failed to note that a car was already in the intersection, and collides with it. If it's anyone's fault, it seems like it's hers.
https://apnews.com/c8b783603fc6490cbf24b7f1c07557cf/Police:-Williams-legally-entered-intersection-before-crash?utm_campaign=SocialFlow&utm_source=Twitter&utm_medium=APSouthRegion
LisaL
(44,973 posts)tblue37
(65,393 posts)proceeding and completing her maneuver before the light turns read, so that she is stuck in the intersection when the light changes.
malaise
(269,026 posts)Sad all around
AngryAmish
(25,704 posts)Dark car that took the left hand turn in front of her is mostly 90% at fault. She was put in a really shitty position being stuck in the intersection.
The only way to hang this on her is if it was a divided highway and she could have stopped in between. Also, the yellow seems rather short. Finally, what was the speed limit?
LisaL
(44,973 posts)bhikkhu
(10,718 posts)they'd run through the yellow to red much faster than one would expect. Driving the same roads most of the time I knew what to expect, but it wasn't unusual to see people caught out. The worst was just a few blocks from my house, where a two-lane secondary road crossed a four-lane main road. The light for the secondary only went green when a car was waiting at the intersection, but then would almost immediately cycle back to red; if you weren't right at the intersection you weren't going to make.
They did some reprogramming a couple years ago in response to complaints (or accidents, I'm not sure), and now the timing is normal.
BeyondGeography
(39,374 posts)Ridiculous with a 50 mph speed limit on that road that they don't allow more time. Here's a group that recommends 5.5 seconds of yellow light time for that level of speed:
http://www.shortyellowlights.com/standards/
malaise
(269,026 posts)Your two cents was useful
csziggy
(34,136 posts)The location is Steeplechase Drive and Northlake Blvd., Palm Beach Gardens. Williams was driving north on Steeplechase, trying to go straight across Northlak to go to Ballenisles Drive.
There is not much of a median so Williams could not have stayed in the intersection without blocking traffic from one way or an other. Her only choice once she had been cut off was to try to clear the way.
Thinkingabout
(30,058 posts)now and in the future to know someone died in an accident she was involved. She has always been a good person but it has to hurt.
malaise
(269,026 posts)I cried with her the other morning at the press conference
Susan Calvin
(1,646 posts)I hope it eases her mind.
All-In
(312 posts)I record all dumbasses. Bicyclists with death wishes too.
nikibatts
(2,198 posts)spooky3
(34,456 posts)At Wimbledon!
as well
Catmusicfan
(816 posts)malaise
(269,026 posts)Alea
(706 posts)Even entering the intersection while the light was green, once delayed by the turning car, she still had as much obligation to check right and left before proceeding as the other driver had approaching the intersection and avoid the collision. They both had an obligation to see each other and avoid the crash. Williams may be found blameless in the eyes of the law but she should have checked left and right before moving on. I certainly would have, and have been in this situation. Once you stop in an intersection, for any reason, you better look both way before getting going again. Other car should have noticed her and slowed down or stopped too.
pnwmom
(108,980 posts)She's not at fault.
Alea
(706 posts)But it doesn't mean once you stopped in the intersection you put blinders on and proceed without looking.
pnwmom
(108,980 posts)hit me -- and knowing that she was going to hit me didn't give me any better options. I was still boxed in.
Alea
(706 posts)If she looked before proceeding, saw the car coming, why did she go? In that situation I would have rechecked left and right and if I saw a car coming I would not have driven into the path. It was a bad situation. I'm not blaming her for the accident, but she's not 100 percent blameless either.
TexasBushwhacker
(20,192 posts)She entered the intersection legally, therefore she continues to have the right of way until she clears the intersection.
BTW, the man who died was 78. His wife, the driver who hit Ms Williams, was 68. Age may have been a factor.
Alea
(706 posts)I'm not talking about illegal/legal, or who is primarily at fault. I'm also not trying to be argumentative. Just driving to survive. The video clearly shows her stopping because a car cut her off. When she stopped her rear wheels had just cleared the gutter, so she was in the far right east bound lane. When she started again she crossed 2 more east bound lanes, then a median and turn lane area, then in to the west bound lanes where she was hit. All I'm saying is she had as much obligation to pay attention as the people that hit her.
In the same situation, I would have looked very carefully before I went across those west bound lanes. Just as this accident shows, people get stuck in intersections all the time. When it happens they should proceed with extreme caution.
kwassa
(23,340 posts)Williams is eventually in the path of many vehicles. If she was in the intersection before the light turned red, she has the right of way. Green is not a mandate to go. The fault is not hers.
I am a former insurance adjuster, by the way.
malaise
(269,026 posts)That simple
onecent
(6,096 posts)nini
(16,672 posts)People get caught in no man's land all the time in intersections like that which is why you pay attention to the actions of the cars around you too.
treestar
(82,383 posts)because the light is green does not mean you get to just barrel through without looking right in front of you to see a car stuck there.
nini
(16,672 posts)that car was going to way too fast if it was red as they were approaching the intersection. Holy crap.
RhodeIslandOne
(5,042 posts)...in a timely fashion. And possibly another passing vehicle. I don't believe either of the actual people involved are at fault.