I would also follow the DU rules about the 4 paragraph limit.

Enjoy your stay.

so it looks foolish to accuse the person you're replying to of being a troll, doesn't it?
Original OP here: https://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=thread&info=1&address=10029460611

By pointing towards DU paragraph rules and questioning the source, then it raises questions as to their motives. If you were a newbie (or any poster for that matter), would the number of paragraphs have been your first thought on reading the op?

"Enjoy your stay." is not a question. "Source?" is a question - a good question. The person accusing the other of being a troll didn't realize the OP had been edited, no question about that.

Really?

...and character. How heart wrenching for him to see his son go so far astray from the family beliefs.

You can do your best and you just never know. I got lucky with my girls and how they are growing up, but I've seen parents raise wonderful kids but one will just go off the rails for some reason. Same parents, same values, same upbringing. Weird.

no matter what you do, there is just something not right with that person, you can sense it.

I know of many young people (teens-20s) who did things (including myself) that their parents are not proud of. As a teen I had a friend who would get thrills from shoplifting and encouraged others to do the same. It is an age where peer pressure is very intense.

the other day.

Just look at Stephen Miller's background.

also the Sandy Hook shooter. These were young boys living at home and behind closed door gathered material and information and the parents were never aware of it.

This is a different topic, but I never believed in a child's privacy. Behind closed door where parents are not allowed to visit, to know what they read, whom they meet, what they collect.

Once they leave home, as this young man, or the killer driver, they are adults and this is a different matter, of course. One can always feel bad for the parents, feel their pain.

my daughter was warned multiple times about abusing the privilege of having a closed door. I will never forget the look on her face when I took the door off its hinges. Didn't take her too long to figure that once again Dad was serious about certain things and then I got to rehang the door.

I never made an empty threat. If I told her that a certain action would invoke a certain consequence I always followed through. Made me very careful about what I said I'd do.

More than once, but not too many times, we left an event that we all wanted to attend when as a preschooler my little girl threw a hissy fit. Mama got mad at me a few times, but you know, by the time my daughter started school the temper tantrums were a thing of the past.

Patience, persistence, and consistence are very important tools in a parent's toolbox.

You've got to be carefully taught..." Bullshit. It doesn't always come from the home, it doesn't only happen to children and it doesn't take a huge amount of effort, either. Someone can pick up hate by osmosis, if they have a weak mind and are exposed to it at the right time under the right circumstances. They can learn to hate at school, at work, or at church. They can learn it from their friends.

These parents must be devastated.

he learned it from the people he hangs around with alot of whom he also attends the same church with.

I don't go a day without breathing a sigh of relief that my lovely daughter is my lovely daughter. I'd love to take credit. I was the primary caregiver, my dear wife was doing her service to humanity taking care of critically burned patients. At best I gave my little girl a good shot at becoming a good human being. The fact that she has become one is entirely to her credit.

There are people who just should not have children. Yet some of those kids figure it out and overcome the obstacles put in their paths. Go figure?

Being a father was not something I ever wanted to be. Toughest job I've ever had. Wouldn't have missed it for the world, and lordy, I would never chose to do it again.

So what gift do you think my 31 year old daughter presented me with the evening before my 65th birthday? Of course, if all goes well, I'm going to get to be a grandfather. Never let it be said that the Universe doesn't have a wicked sense of humor.

The father did the right thing, but this is gut wrenching to read.

I wonder whether the son was actually exposed, by name, or whether family and friend recognized him from news clips

There are a few people in my life who did this insane RW turn thing. Even Trump wasn't like this 20 years ago. Oh sure, he was a racist but not a CT enthusiast and GOP mouthpiece.

I think it was AM hate radio and Faux.

...be thrown in prison for life, ginned up a lot of public hate that found them "guilty" before there was even a trial.

As far as his upbringing, Daddy Drumpf taught him how to be a racist landlord from the get-go.

That's why I said he was a racist. He and his Dad both with their housing discrimination left no doubt as to that. The Central Park Five thing was a really, really bad example of his hatred of AA's and even when it was shown beyond any doubt those kids couldn't possibly have done it, did he appologize?

Hell no!

Just like with the birther nonscence. But beside the bigotry he was pretty much a Democrat with social issues. He was not against abortion or woman's reproductive rights f.i. and as much as they would allow it, he hung out at the 54 with the "beautiful people". Not CT, WS folks like Bannon, etc.

He was, however, always a jerk.

Imagine if Donald Trump has given such a strong denunciation of the KKK, Nazis, and white supremacists as these two men. Yes, those were real denunciations. It was clear that they were opposed to that young man and his ideology.

those types of views are typically formed early adulthood and parents may not be able to do much at that point. By all means, the father should be applauded; this is exactly what we are trying to achieve: to make sure these alt right nazis are publicly denounced by friends, family, employers, etc. And also, I am hoping someone maintains an online public registry of confirmed nazis so that we never forget and they are forever enshired into the history. All of it is necessary to discourage young people who are considering joininrg alt right

There's still hope.

Betcha his son watches Fox, and listens to Rush.....

His father recalled a time when his son joked, “The thing about us fascists is, it’s not that we don’t believe in freedom of speech. You can say whatever you want. We’ll just throw you in an oven,” Tefft recalled.

This is the far right today, their ultimate vision.

Their son has turned into someone they don't recognize. Shame on the boy for embracing hate.

“The thing about us fascists is, it’s not that we don’t believe in freedom of speech. You can say whatever you want. We’ll just throw you in an oven"

I don't see this often, but I've seen this a time or two. When one in a family is so different. It's usually because he didn't have much one on one contact w/the parents. Kids pick up their views from their parents through osmosis, seemingly. Just my opinion. But if they don't spend much time with them, that doesn't happen, and they become a blank slate on which someone else can write.

Maybe that's part of becoming a hater. You have intense anger at the world, at your situation. Some people turn their anger inward, some use it to become successful or funny, and some turn their anger outward.

... research shows that genetics and peer groups far outrank the influence of parents.

Personality influences:

Genetic: 50%
Peer: 40-50%
Parental/home environment: 10%

Social Psychology Myers and Twenge (2013)

In addition:

"Two children in the same family [are on average] as different from one another as are pairs of children selected randomly from the population."

Plomin and Daniels (1987)

You are not born or genetically inclined toward a viewpoint. Viewpoints can also change as time goes on.

Example: Trump says he's the same as he was as a 3 or 4 yr old boy. (Unfortunately, that's probably true.) But that's personality. He didn't have many viewpoints at that age. Those develop over time, most importantly from whoever the child spends time with. Those things imprint.

Trump's viewpoints are much like his father's. He spent a lot of time with his father as he grew up, but in a business or more mature way. Trump's father had drive, was all about money, had a viewpoint about minorities and being of German stock, etc.

I've read that a person's personality is done by the age of 7 and doesn't change much. But that's not views on things.

So this Nazi may have had a bad temper, brash personality. But a lot of people have that personality w/o being a Nazi. He became imprinted with a Nazi viewpoint somewhere along the way, which means he spent more time with those people at a young age than with his parents who did not. I think.

Interesting. I'm going to read up on that. Ultimately, it doesn't matter as regards this guy. He chose to try to kill people.

but the point I'm making is that people not only can be and are radicalized by their peers - by their peer culture - it's been argued they're influenced by them by a greater percentage than by the influence of their parents.

One example that comes to mind is the way Dylan Roof was radicalized - in a short period of time, by his online interactions with white supremacists. These Gab, Pepe, 4-chan, Daily Stormer, #AltRight, MAGA groups are exploding under the Trump umbrella.

I'm just adding another viewpoint to the mix: the idea that the "like father like son" adage isn't an absolute, as we've seen apparently regarding Pearce and Peter Tefft.

thanks to cellphone photos.

This son could be a psychiatrist's case study.