is simply jumping to wild conclusions. Wait for more facts to come out.

I think you missed the clearly defined point entirely.

A country music concert got attacked by this supposed solider in the supposed 2nd civil war.

Before last night, without the benefit of mangling facts to fit theory, what side of that "civil war" would you have put
25,000 country music fans in?

Exactly.

So tell me - which side was this shooter on, exactly?

did you miss that part of my post?

Which is it?

I define it as a war where people act uncivilized.

thanks for your advice but I will not take it.

You are right that armies don't go up against each other in set piece battles like in the American Civil war. You are right that combatants may not wear identifiable uniform, though many do wear some kind of identifiable clothing. However, I disagree with the idea that this guy is fighting a civil war. Civil wars though chaotic still have some kind of organization to them because they are fought to establish a new order or defend the existing order.

For example:

The Liberian Civil war had multiple factions either supporting or opposing the Doe government. The second civil war was to depose Charles Taylor's government which was part of the victorious factions in the first civil war.

The Rawandan civil war were factions of ethnic groups Tutsi versus Hutu people fighting for control of the government.

The Spanish civil war was fought between Republican forces and Nationalist forces.

The Nicaraguan and Salvadorian civil wars also had mixtures of paramilitary, civilian, and military factions fighting each other after the election of leftist governments.

People act uncivilized in any type of war because civil order breaks down during war.

People in the US act uncivilly toward each other because culturally we have been taught to settle differences with violence, and there are a lot of guns available. Some people like Dylan Roof and others did it to promote White Supremacy, Some, like the San Bernardino shooters and Fort Hood shooters claim radical Islam. Others like Adam Lanza and Elliot Rodger have psychological problems and want to inflict their pain on others.

This latest shooting is horrible and sad. We need to figure out why it happened and have serious discussions about the culture of violence in the US and how the easy access to guns and the publicity that these people get, continues to fuel this kind of situation.

this ins't a typical time or situation.

and on edit:

if you read my post you will see that this civil war is based upon hate.

you can define it anyway you want, just as I have, but I will believe and always believe that we are in a situation that is very far from typical.

the gun violence that we see on display every single day is just one part of the civil war.

Your definition of Civil War is not accurate by any understanding of the terminology.

I think that I get the message you are trying to convey, that there seems to be a breakdown in civil society. There is something missing in the way that we deal with each other, with stress, with differences in opinion. I am assuming that is what you are trying to convey. The problem is that your analogy of civil war is getting in the way of that message.

Whatever this man's motives were, whether personal, political, religious, etc... he was driven by fear, anger, hate, and/or other negative emotions and he had access to firearms and used them to kill and injure other people. This type of violence is becoming more common even as other types of violence and crime hold steady or decline.

Rather than calling it a civil war because shooting people is not a "civil" thing to do, we need to look at how to counteract those things that drove and facilitated him and others to carry out these murders.

I would even say that we are having more of a semantic disagreement than one on substance. America has never wanted to look truthfully on the issue of race, ethnicity, and immigration and as demographics continue to shift, there will be more significant resistance to the changing of social power structures through the natural progression of societal shift.

American has long been shy at looking at itself squarely in the mirror.

It's high time we do.

and the issue is that a majority of this nation doesn't like what it sees. but it's within that same majority, that people disagree at what they are seeing.

that is the shame.

this is about hate.

I truly find it amazing why yourself and the others who have replied have a hard time seeing that.

So out of around 320,000,000 people, how many are going to go full blown on the HATE CRAZY TRAIN for your civil war to be official?

Are we talking like 1000 people dying a week, 32,000K a weeek (0.01% of the population)


Just trying to understand the numbers of what you are proposing

I say it's going to get worse, but were did I make all the claims you just wrote about.

and as I have responded to someone else in this thread I civil war to me is when a society becomes uncivilized.

we are are now there.

but please, continue to roll your eyes while the body count rises.

but please continue with the doom and gloom...

I was helping load a semi trailer for six hours on Saturday with donations people were bringing for Houston and the surrounding area. I didn't see people spitting on each other, fights, smashing of car windows. Fairly peaceful actually...

You live in a really bad neck of the woods?

I see how you conduct a conversation.

we are done.

good day.

But, maybe I am wrong and we are IN THE MIDDLE OF A CIVIL WAR!

Shit! I need to stock up on cat food for sure.....

Do you think that no one was killed because of hate until recently?

People are having a hard time seeing it because the assertion is absurd and wildly over-the-top.

The hyperbole isn't helpful.

to me a civil war is an uncivilized society.

We are there now.

not kooky, we are all just sadly used to the daily killings.

but we never give any credence to the concept of what is causing it and why it continues.

the dehumanization of non white, non christian people along with practically unlimited access to not just guns as well but guns capable of causing massive numbers of death or injury.


if we were sane we would enforce the 2nd amendment, restrict ALL gun ownership to well regulated militias.

I think it is uncivil for us to have more guns than people, so if that is civil war, so be it.

has been for quite a while now.

I assume he is familiar with the rules.

what we see happening around us is not some wild new out-of-the-blue surprise, but rather the logical progression of events in their natural order

which, for a while anyway, society at large will pretend to forget as it focuses on the next set of threadbare and entirely predictable outrages.

Which side in this civil war was he on???

that is the concept that has to be done away with.

there is only those that hate. and how hate is defined is by those who hate not by those who want peace.

Tough war to deal with, with no one specifically to oppose.

only the person who hates can define the hate.

There will be no speculation, no debate. Each and every person in this country will KNOW beyond a shadow of a doubt we are at war.
We aren't (yet).

wow.

you really have no idea what a civil war is then.

you must flush the old notion of battle lines and them vs us from your mind, because that kind of "civil war" doesn't exist anymore.

if you are any other color than white, in this nation, it never ended.

and the white right wing chooses to play the victim because they know, that if they confronted their demons, they would be horrified at what they have wrought upon this country.

willful ignorance is their only protection