health insurance rise over 100% next year. Really?

drumpf going to Asia is a great thing? Why? Tell me why?

This isn't the first time this loser POTUS has invited him into the WH. Kissinger has nothing to say about the current state of foeriegn affairs and probably can't even name the leaders of many countries. This is a joke and the press should be outraged. Just because you are the last person standing from the 60's and 70's doesn't mean you get a free pass. He has nothing, NOTHING, to offer but this country is led by a joker.

The assumption is that they have contacts and experience with similar people and problems. This is why even a John Kerry, who called out Kissinger and others in 1971 would be willing to listen to what he has to say on strategy on foreign policy. Respecting his intelligence and knowlege does not mean accepting his values. Obviously he and HRC and more importantly, Obama bring a different value system to foreign policy.

This is why Trump and Tillerson not meeting with Kerry or any top State Department people in the transition was a huge break with normal transitions. Obviously, they do not share his values, but ignoring that his insights -even if they reject advice - would have worth hearing.

Trump is probably happy to be photographed with anyone famous.

The winners never stand trial.

and no doubt about that destination

Not threatening to bomb North Korea or talking about the calm before the storm? Or asking why do we have nuclear weapons if we don't have them? Yet you're more disturbed by Kissinger than a man who treats nuclear weapons as toys.

Please don't put words or emotions on anyone else but yourself. That's how you become a good citizen.

not those other things. You wrote: " Trump's photo-op with Henry Fucking Kissinger is a message of War [View all]

That's the message he is sending by sitting with this war mongerer."

I disagree. It looks to me like Kelly has convinced Trump to talk to some foreign policy experts to get him to back away from nuking N Korea.

Furthermore, I don't share the view that Trump's ignorance and emotion-driven approach to politics is worse than Kissinger's real politik. That is not to excuse Kissinger's atrocious human rights record but rather to point out that Trump is far, far worse than anything or anyone that has come before him.

But keep on keeping on my friend.

The guy belongs in The Hague not advising The President.

It figures that asshole Trump would seek his advice. Kissinger is the go-to guy when you want to start illegal wars or maybe kidnap a few people who stand in your way of a coup.

Kissinger is the grand daddy of treating the use of nuclear weapons, as you put it, as toys.

Trumps "madman strategy" is right out of old Henry's and Nixon's playbook.

It was only a matter of time before Trump bellies up to that crusty old sack of shit war criminal.

Kissinger is not the "grand daddy" of treating nuclear weapons like toys. When did he drop one?

How is Trump's "madman strategy" out of Kissinger's playbook? You'll have to explain to me how Trump relates to Real Politik.

Vietnam begun under the Eisenhower and Kennedy administrations, long before Kissinger served in government.

The bulk of the kidnappings in Chile, the disappeared, occurred after the coup, after Pinochet seized power. If you are referring to the kidnapping and murder of General Rene Schneider, you have a point. Your use of the plural, however, does not, to my knowledge, seem appropriate.

Trump is not part of a continuum of US foreign policy. He's an imbecile with no knowledge or strategy.

The point of the OP was not that Kissinger was bad. It was expressing outrage that Trump met with him, that doing so somehow made nuclear war more likely. I disagree. I rather he seek advice from foreign policy experts than continue flailing based entirely on ego and idiocy. Despite Kissinger's role in atrocities in Chile and Vietnam, he is knowledgeable on foreign policy. Frankly, I'm more concerned about his meeting with John Bolton because the neocons are more eager for war than Kissinger and other realists.

He dithered.
I doubt that he has any useful advice today.
A commentator said "He knows more about China than anyone else."
And I thought "Maybe 40 years ago, but no longer."
Kissinger is a has been.

And I expect he was brought there to help convince Trump that nuclear war with N Korea would have devastating consequences for the US.

You used that phrase in reference to trump. Now I've been pretty busy all day but, last I checked, trump hasn't used nukes yet either. So I'm confused why actually dropping a nuke is now a prerequisite for the "toys" analogy.

Google Nixon madman theory.

You can't be serious that was the only kidnapping Kissinger either green lighted or encouraged. Tell me you are joking.

To use nukes. " why do we have them if we can't use them"? He fully intends to start shit.

Schneider fits that description. I also referenced the 11,000 plus disappeared, and clearly Kissinger was complicit in those disappearance in that he helped install Pinochet and refused to consider human rights in ongoing relations with that govt. you have not cited another example of a kidnapping that fits your characterization, and your responses suggest the details are of limited interest to you. I think they matter.

You repeated the phrase about nukes as toys in regard to Kissinger and insisted he is the “grand daddy of using nuclear weapons as toys.” Now you refuse to say what prompted you to make that claim and even deny responsibility for using it.

I’ll chalk your comments up to “Kissinger bad.” I don’t disagree with that, or that he should be subject to the International Criminal Court, which would require the US to become a signatory. I do, however, believe it important to know and care about the particulars. I think the tendency to see Kissinger as uniquely evil in US foreign policy is wrong. The US invaded Latin America alone 30 times prior to the end of WWI. Administrations in the post-WWII period have sponsored a series of coups and propped up dozens of horrifically brutal, even genocidal, regimes. That includes during the time periods progressives say they want the US to return to. Kissinger was part of a long history of a brutal US foreign policy, not divergent from it. Trump is different in that he has no knowledge, policy, or ideology and is instead driven by ego and emotion, which makes him far more dangerous.

Trump has not yet launched a nuke, but Kelly is afraid to leave him alone with the nuclear football. Kelly and some others have talked about whether they would tackle Trump and take it away if, or more likely when, he tries to launch nukes. I have little doubts that Kissinger's visit today was part of an effort to convince Trump that nuclear war with N Korea would be devastating to the US, since there is zero doubt Kim Jung Un will use nukes if attacked. Nuclear Armageddon is worse than Vietnam, Laos, and Pinochet because many millions would die. You may, for reasons I can only speculate about, see Kissinger as worse than Trump, but I do not.

Explain how Trump used nukes as toys and I'll explain how Nixon/Kissinger used nukes as toys.

Not playing your game. Both have used or are using nuclear brinkmanship.

Go look up the "madman theory"

And yeah, I'm glad you acknowledge 11,000 (plus) victims. Remember those people who stood in the way of their coup? Kissinger was complicit before, during and after the coup. He encouraged and signed off on stepped up terror campaigns.


Here. Right here. Has Trump used nukes? No. Then why is he treating nukes as toys, as you put it? I was using YOUR phrase:

Like, really?

To respond to your first question, when did Trump dropped a nuke?

The only experience on foreign policy Kissinger has is how to murder as much of the population as he can without being tried for it.

He's a monster, full stop.

Read it again.

and all the responses in the thread.

Can't believe what I'm reading.

KISSINGER (and HK and Ford, unto 1975).

What makes him worse than Allen Dulles, John Foster Dulles, Lyndon Johnson, the Reagan administration, Rumsfeld or Bolton?

While it may make you feel better to pretend the ills of US foreign policy can be explained by one man, its history does not bear that out.

The US empire was built, from the late 19th century, on foreign invasion and regime change through cover action. That is what provided for the prosperity of the white middle class that many today say they want to return to. Kissinger is part of a long history of a brutal foreign policy, not divergent from it.

I do not find the internet meme approach to understanding US diplomatic history and foreign policy particularly useful.

time-frame. I omitted Jefferson Davis, too.

I am FULLY aware of the depredations of US foreign interventions, for both geo-political and corporate interests. I do not absolve anyone from the Reagan or Bush Administrations of their actions.

However, Kissinger, a war criminal who dares not set foot in, say, The Hague, has lent his "services" to other nations in his global and on-going evil.

These articles are quite enlightening---and supportive of my assertion.

http://humansarefree.com/2016/12/the-case-against-henry-kissinger.html?m=0

http://www.etan.org/issues/kissinger.htm

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Trial_of_Henry_Kissinger

https://www.globalresearch.ca/crimes-against-humanity-why-is-henry-kissinger-walking-around-free/5358322

https://www.commondreams.org/views/2016/02/13/why-not-being-friends-war-criminal-henry-kissinger-matters

http://fpif.org/bernies-broadsides-kissinger-werent-even-half/

BTW: As long as we are being exquisitely precise, Obama has blood on his hands, too (or would that be Hillary, who viewed HK as a mentor?).

https://www.pastemagazine.com/articles/2016/08/someone-should-tell-hillary-clinton-that-henry-kis.html
(This writer explicitly agrees with me.)

Kissinger is argung that Vietnam can still be won!

Two evil scumbags.

Henry isn't gonna do it.

HK looks like he's dead. DOTUS is stupid for dragging his old carcass back into the WH.

Kissinger, I'll always wonder...

n/t

Be careful what you wish for.





Laura