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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThe Bernie or Busters swore there was nothing to fear in a Trump win
That was the message of Jimmy Dore, of TYT, one of their most prominent leaders when he debated Sam Seder.
Why, if Trump wins, all the Democrats had to do was stick together.
McConnell wouldnt dare just shove things through with a simple majority, he said.
And he certainly wouldnt risk doing away with the filibuster on SCOTUS, he assured us.
Trump could totally be managed.
What now, genius?
I notice that Seth Rich troofer imbecile isn't tweeting tonight.
And bringing this up isnt rehashing things. These pricks are planning to continue their idiocy, with "Justice Democrats" preparing to throw general election tantrums when their candidates dont get nominated and "team player" Sanders gearing up for another egotrip at age 80 in 2020.
TeamPooka
(24,254 posts)oasis
(49,407 posts)workinclasszero
(28,270 posts)Trump really appreciated the assist in destroying America you POS!
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)stonecutter357
(12,697 posts)still_one
(92,394 posts)Response to Adenoid_Hynkel (Original post)
Post removed
chwaliszewski
(1,514 posts)wasupaloopa
(4,516 posts)There is no water under the bridge. We must not let it happen again so we must keep it in front of our faces.
HopeAgain
(4,407 posts)Please let's move on.
wasupaloopa
(4,516 posts)after election.
There is right now and how are we going to deal with it.
HopeAgain
(4,407 posts)THAT lights work! Keep alienating!
wasupaloopa
(4,516 posts)enough do because if they repeat the same behavior they don't help the cause anyway.
If you don't vote in such a way that gets us back in power nothing you say matters because it won't happen. We just get deeper in the right wing shit world
Demsrule86
(68,667 posts)mistakes as some Green voters did in 2000.
dembotoz
(16,832 posts)you want them to totally go away?
JHB
(37,161 posts)The distinction is significant, since the "or busters" ceased to actually be Bernie supporters once they chose the "bust" part.
dembotoz
(16,832 posts)ClarendonDem
(720 posts)Like, actual evidence? Instead of other issues such as poor decision-making.
wasupaloopa
(4,516 posts)We can only assume what happened.
We could have nice things today if we all pulled together to elect Hillary. Bernie's campaign made it harder to win in my opinion.
theaocp
(4,244 posts)so keep assuming. It feels from all the posts that we're going back to attacking ourselves again. I guess it's therapeutic, but seems like just more tantrums. Get it all out, I suppose. Then, back to work. I'm heading out to Noel Night to continue gathering signatures to get gerrymandering removal on our next ballot. Try something like that.
ClarendonDem
(720 posts)Other than Hillary, so assuming they swayed the election is nothing more than baseless speculation. If I were to rank the reasons I thought HRC lost, defection of Bernie voters wouldn't make the top 5, maybe not top 10.
Response to chwaliszewski (Reply #5)
Name removed Message auto-removed
MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)TexasBushwhacker
(20,214 posts)MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)Please correct me, if I am wrong. I definitely DO NOT want Bernie, Hillary or Joe to run again. We need fresh, yes, young, charismatic candidates in 2020.
TexasBushwhacker
(20,214 posts)I'm with you about younger candidates running.
MoonRiver
(36,926 posts)tazkcmo
(7,300 posts)That is the source of this "Sanders 2020" meme, not Sen Sanders or anyone else.
This is the story: https://www.politico.com/story/2017/11/27/bernie-sanders-2020-elections-258160
Just a reporter with nothing better to do than stir shit.
Blue_true
(31,261 posts)We have a significant number of people saying their way or the highway. Personally I say to them, go screw yourself. True Democrats are better off working on non voters than spending tome on clueless assholes.
Adenoid_Hynkel
(14,093 posts)The Justice "Democrat" candidate in my state has already said she won't back the Democrat if she doesn't get the nomination over Joe Manchin.
Yeah, Manchin leaves a lot to be desired, but do you know who's running against him?
This guy:
Explain to me how adopting the Jimmy Dore "just let the GOP win" approach in that race benefits anyone.
Duppers
(28,127 posts)Says about that....
Yet I take *great offense* to your characterization of Bernie himself here: "Sanders gearing up for another egotrip at age 80 in 2020."
I won't be seeing you. Bye. 🐦
Highway61
(2,568 posts)Sick of the bullshit. Always stirring up the pot...ignore.
InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)Wednesdays
(17,408 posts)Chasstev365
(5,191 posts)Adenoid_Hynkel
(14,093 posts)Justice "Democrats" 2018 and another Sanders run are in the works, and the same Busters who were happy to let Trump win need to be educated before they do it again.
The passage of the GOP tax bill shows a major, major difference between the two parties.
This needs drilled into everyone's head. These are the stakes.
jalan48
(13,883 posts)samnsara
(17,635 posts)aikoaiko
(34,183 posts)Smitty63nnn
(59 posts)Nothing in this post is against the rules?
Decoy of Fenris
(1,954 posts)The alert selected "No personal attacks." On those grounds, I couldn't vote to hide. If the alerter picked "Don't keep refighting the primaries", or even "Don't bash Democrats" or whatnot, I could have fudged a Hide vote, but since this post isn't attacking any member of the D.U. community, I couldn't vote Hide.
Sorry, mate. For what it's worth, I agree with you.
Demsrule86
(68,667 posts)And what Democrat was bashed?
Decoy of Fenris
(1,954 posts)If I feel like speaking with you, I'll do so. Until then, have a pleasant day.
Demsrule86
(68,667 posts)However, I will simply put you on ignore...I have maybe one other poster on this list...In general I reserve it for those who are rude or unpleasant.
Skidmore
(37,364 posts)Last edited Sat Dec 2, 2017, 09:25 AM - Edit history (1)
The OP is an opinion on attributions for very current events which will be catastrophic for many. Criticism of Sanders and the contributions some of followers is legitimate. He is not a Democrat no matter how hard he spins it and these people are not progressives either. In some ways they mesh well with Trump's followers. What as been wrought this past year is indefensible.
Those who preached that there was no difference between the parties or between Hillary and trump bear much responsibility for the catastrophe unfolding before our eyes. As the republicans destroy all that our Party holds dear and the citizens we strive to protect, criticism of those who abetted this abomination is not only legitimate, it is a necessary part of planning a Democratic bulwark against these forces.
as a vet on Medicare, Social Security on with serious health problems related to my service in another war, decades ago, based on lies, my death sentence affirmed by those yesterday in our Senate is assured because of those who DID not vote for HRC....YOU ARE SO CORRECT IN YOUR ASSESSMENT.
greatauntoftriplets
(175,749 posts)GulfCoast66
(11,949 posts)In the historical sense of the word. Read up on William Jennings Bryan, Woodrow Wilson, Huey Long and other progressive of the past. Social Justice had nothing to do with their agenda just as for many Progressives who did not vote for Hillary. It is all about economic justice. You still hear it when they carry one about those poor midwestern blue collar workers. Translation-white guys. And they still call themselves the base of the party when in reality minorities have been our base for 30 years.
The sooner the millions of Liberal Social Democrats who self identify as Progressives realize the poison that word holds for many the better off the Democratic Party will be.
The right wing poisoning of the word liberal even worked on Liberals.
Skidmore
(37,364 posts)society last night minus the political science class word salad of definitions. Those economic decisions made by a corrupt REPUBLICAN majority is singularly reprehensible. We live in a pluralistic society where justice must be sought for all, not just a narrow sliver of privileged people. The backbone of the political movement forward has been women and people of color, primarily black women. It is not aggrieved white guys who will save this nation that they are busily helping their oppressors destroy. Social justice must be part of the equation. That is on-the-ground reality.
I hope I'm not misunderstanding what you are saying.
GulfCoast66
(11,949 posts)Or perhaps I did a poor job of commutation.
We agree. Too many people who call themselves progressives are neutral or even hostile to social justice. Certainly not all or even a majority. But enough. Which is why I reject the title of progressive.
Minorities are the base and backbone of our party. And are the people as a group who has gained the most from a socially liberal agenda in there mid-20th century.
I just wished we had not become ashamed of calling ourselves liberals. It was a successful strategy of the right.
standingtall
(2,787 posts)were in times when many minorities and women couldn't vote or had serious restrictions on voting. Today economic and social justice go hand in hand the two cannot be separated in today's reality. What happened last night was both social and economic injustice.
Also anyone who votes for Democrats is the base including white guys. You could cherry pick any demographic group among democratic voters and say that group doesn't constitute a majority of voters by themselves and therefore say they are not the base.
GulfCoast66
(11,949 posts)i agree that to most members of the Democratic Party that social and economic justice are 2 of the legs our party. And almost all members on DU for the past year.
My point remains however that the are self identified progressives who are hostile to social issues. We both are aware of several websites where they can be found.
I guess I am too emotional about my distain for the term progressive. However, I do not know anyone who self identifies as a Social Democrat or a Liberal who dismisses social justice.
Have a nice weekend
Gothmog
(145,554 posts)Historic NY
(37,453 posts)UCmeNdc
(9,600 posts)InAbLuEsTaTe
(24,122 posts)TheDebbieDee
(11,119 posts)and how many were just Russian on-line trolls trying to whip up support for Trump?
Both groups were and still are spouting the same talking points (the DNC rigged the primaries for Hillary, Hillary was an unlikeable/unpopular candidate, Bernie would have won the General Election, blah, blah, blah), making the same arguments - who can tell the difference?
ClarendonDem
(720 posts)Had record low approval ratings, only trumped by Trump. Doesnt that make the unpopular candidate charge true? And to avoid anyone accusing me of spreading RW talking ooh to, heres a WaPo story on that issue - https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/news/the-fix/wp/2016/08/31/a-record-number-of-americans-now-dislike-hillary-clinton/
StevieM
(10,500 posts)Since that time she has not served one more day on the job.
She was unpopular because a corrupt FBI deliberately set out to make her look like a criminal who got away with her crimes.
Had Sanders or O'Malley been the nominee, or especially if they had been the early favorite for years, the FBI would have targeted them too. And HRC was the early favorite for so many years because she had been so popular for so long.
TheDebbieDee
(11,119 posts)This same argument is made by both Sanders' supporters and Russian [img][/img]
I'm not calling you a Russian troll, but I'm saying that Russian trolls frequently make the same argument...
And as far as the WashingtonPost, it has only become filled with LIBERAL LIES since Trump's Inauguration... ALL the media outlets have been referring to Hillary Clinton as divisive since 1998 - divisive has been the default adjective used to describe Sen/Sec Clinton by the MSM...
As far as your argument that Sec Clinton was unpopular, consider this: Sec Clinton was campaigning against Trump, the Russians, their vote hacker/flippers in some states and their internet trolls and the Bernie Busters and she still got more 3 million more votes than Trump!
ClarendonDem
(720 posts)But it was true, at least at certain points. I don't understand the relationship between her unpopularity and the Russians though. She was unpopular before the election (I think). Any evidence of vote flipping? I haven't seen it.
TheDebbieDee
(11,119 posts)It would take a MUELLER-like investigation to go into these states and look around. That said, once the vote totals are meddled with electronically, no one can prove what the true vote totals were w/o checking paper ballots, if there were any.
There is a way to access the vote tabulation systems with internet platforms using a modem. And Russian hackers did actively attack and penetrate the computers of elections officials in some - they were specifically looking for their password s to these systems...
Do you think the Russians WOULDN'T use these passwords to the republicans advantage if they had them? If you want proof of that then you should review why Reality Winner was arrested and why she is still being detained...
Duncan Grant
(8,291 posts)Hope youre able to resolve this for yourself. Most of us have moved on or are otherwise engaged with whats needed today (rather than in some unknowable tomorrow). Cheers!
chwaliszewski
(1,514 posts)marble falls
(57,204 posts)Willie Pep
(841 posts)Dore came out looking foolish. I like Bernie and most of his supporters since they did the smart thing and voted for Clinton in the general election. Heck I even voted for Sanders in the primary. But the Bernie or Bust types deserve to be ridiculed. The "both parties are the same" argument needs to die.
left-of-center2012
(34,195 posts)Can we stop looking backward,
and work on winning in 2018 and 2020?
dembotoz
(16,832 posts)left-of-center2012
(34,195 posts)That Teddy Roosevelt lost the 1912 election.
Adenoid_Hynkel
(14,093 posts)They're going to do it again, and they're organizing with Justice "Democrats" to take it to as many congressional races as they can.
Any candidate running under Dore's banner is not on our side.
And if Sanders runs in 2020 and inevitable fails to get the nomination, they will tar whoever the nominee is with "not a true progressive" BS, cherry picking a single issue as they do Kamala Harris, or absurdly claiming Warren backing Clinton in the general was grounds to hate her.
Of course, these single issue purity tests don't apply to Saint Sanders and his abysmal position on guns. Convenient, eh?
left-of-center2012
(34,195 posts)Can you offer up some winning lottery numbers,
in time for Christmas?
Thank you.
Greybnk48
(10,176 posts)Lil Missy
(17,865 posts)louis c
(8,652 posts)These so called allies act as though we have a Parliamentary System of Government.
We have a two party, winner take all form of government. If you lose by 1 point (or, in the case in 2000 and 2016, actually win the plurality, but lose on a technicality), you are shut out of government completely, you're fucked.
The other side gets it. How else can you explain that DJ Trump insinuated that Ted Cruz's father was involved in JFK's assignation, and Cruz still campaigned for Trump in the General?
The biggest problem is not just that our side doesn't get it, it's that the other side does.
workinclasszero
(28,270 posts)Susan Sarandon , Jill Stein and Cenk Uygur retreat to one of their many mansions and count all their lovely millions while the rest of us unwashed peasants go on a cat food diet and move into big cardboard boxes at the local dump.
See? All is well.
MFM008
(19,818 posts)Hope they eat shit and die....
Mike Nelson
(9,966 posts)...I do have friends who were aware of the damage and still either stayed home or voted for a third party candidate. They thought Bernie was robbed of the Democratic nomination and would have easily been elected President. They think the damage done by Trump is, in part, due to Hillary supporters. Some also feel the country must proceed toward a revolution, including the damage that would bring. This is not my thinking... and, like Trump supporters, there is not much I can say that changes their minds. Most Bernie supporters I know happily switched to Hillary when she won the nomination, however.
Kentonio
(4,377 posts)As we continuously look for people on our own side of the spectrum to fight.
Seriously, are the GOP not a big enough target for us?
Takket
(21,625 posts)Fixed the misleading title for you.
Adenoid_Hynkel
(14,093 posts)This was Dore's precise argument.
And he's hardly a random guy. He appeared at the so-called "People's Summit" where Bernie spoke earlier this year to a room of supporters who booed clips of Hillary CLinton.
Gothmog
(145,554 posts)OhZone
(3,212 posts)They stated pushing propaganda rather than calling out propaganda. They detached from looking for truth and reality and became their own version of Fox News for the far left.
Gothmog
(145,554 posts)I shudder to think what Stein and the BOB will give us
GaryCnf
(1,399 posts)That far more self-proclaimed "liberal" Democrats are essentially unconcerned about working Americans (witness support/praise for trade agreements that have demonstrably lowered wages, hostility toward living wage, lecturing workers in good paying jobs that they need to just get use to the reality of a world where they have to take a step backwards) than there are progressives who are unconcerned about social issue (witness that no high profile progressive has taken a position on any social issue to the right of the "liberal" position and, on issues like criminal justice issues, progressives take a position to the left of "liberals"
GaryCnf
(1,399 posts)Gave us Iraq and Afghanistan and Citizens United by saddling Gore with centrist slaps in the face of important constituencies like the 1996 Crime Bill, NAFTA, and no major civil rights initiative in the prior 8 years and a Republican to be running mate
betsuni
(25,614 posts)Sherman A1
(38,958 posts)I am reminded just why I signed off of DU earlier this year.